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Manpower numbers
Anyone know of a source to find divisional manpower numbers for the NATO nations in the late 80s? I can find US and WP numbers, but that's all.
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#2
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This is the only thing found sofar for the NATO forces and its only for Tanks:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War_tank_formations I hope this helps some |
#3
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Osprey books.
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Ok..... The main problem for man power numbers that your looking at peace time numbers. NATO allies do not have the resources to keep large forces on hand for contingencies ..... The other thing that is going to throw you is the definitions of Squad, Section, Company, Battalion, Regiment, Divsion, Corps, and Army vary greatly.
I am hazarding a guess that most are intended to be the core cadre of rapidly fielded larger formations during a war time call up. Example, a peacetime four platoon armor company getting poached to make two or three company sized units.... dividing up the active duty among the green troops. |
#5
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Its hard to find a precise manpower figure for division sizes in most NATO armies, mainly because the composition of divisions in different NATO armies are not the same, and many countries also keep changing the composition of divisions and their component units.
There is some information on French divisions. Armoured Divisions (10,000 troops) Light Armoured Divisions (7,400 troops) Infantry Division (7,500 troops) Airborne Division (13,500 troops) Airmobile Division (6,000 troops) Mountain Division (8,500 troops) Marine Division (8,000 troops) The French had a lot of divisions considering the relative size of their army, but French divisions were also smaller than most of other NATO armies especially compared with American, British and West German divisions. |
#6
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As far as manpower numbers go, and this is a fair source, try "Armies of NATO'S Central Front"
France Alpine Chasseur Battalion: 1,107 men Reconnaissance Regiment: 800 men Armored Regiment: 800 men Mechanized Infantry Regiment: 1,000 men West Germany Panzergrenadier Company: 130 men Panzer Company: 65 men United Kingdom Mechanized Infantry Battalion: 680 men Motorized Infantry Battalion: 630 men Light Infantry Battalion: 590 men Armored Regiment: 583 men Reconnaissance Regiment: 548 men Royal Marine Commando: 800 men Netherlands Field Artillery Battalion: 533 men Reconnaissance Battalion: 750 men Armored Infantry Battalion (YPR-408): 805 men Armored Infantry Battalion (YPR-765): 842 men Armored Battalion: 566 men Hope this helps!
__________________
The reason that the American Army does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the American Army practices chaos on a daily basis. |
#7
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Thanks gents
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#8
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Found some more information from IISS Military Balance 1980-81.
Based on standard unit composition. Some armies such as the British can vary upon the regiments assigned and Soviet divisions are only Category One that were based in Europe. Armoured/Tank Division American (18,900 men/324 tanks) West German (17,000 men/300 tanks) British (15,600 men/280 tanks) Indian (15,000 men/200 tanks) Soviet (11,000 men/335 tanks) Chinese (9,200 men/270 tanks) Mechanised Infantry/Motorised Rifle Division American (18,500 men/216 tanks) West German (17,500 men/250 tanks) Indian (17,500 men) Soviet (14,000 men/266 tanks) British (13,600 men/140 tanks) Chinese (12,700 men/30 tanks) Airborne Division American (16,500 men) West German (9,000 men) Chinese (9,000 men) Soviet (7,000 men) Armoured/Tank Brigade Indian (6,000 men/150 tanks) American (4,500 men/108 tanks) West German (4,500 tanks/110 tanks) British (4,000 men/140-70 tanks) Soviet (1,300 men/95 tanks) Chinese (1,200 men/90 tanks) Mechanised Infantry/Motorised Rifle Brigade West German (5,000 men/54 tanks) American (4,800 men/54 tanks) Indian (4,500 men) British (4,000 men/70 tanks) Soviet (2,300 men/40 tanks) Chinese (2,000 men) |
#9
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Perfect! Thank you
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#10
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Quote:
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#12
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Some more manpower and quipment strengths for divisions of the major powers in 1989-1990.
AIFV for the US Army is the Bradley which had replaced the M113 by this time in the regular army. Soviet AIFV depended on number of BMP regiments in each divisions. APC's are basic models with no heavy weapons larger than machine guns. Artillery includes MLR, self-propelled and towed artillery and mortars over 100mm calibre. As can be seen Chinese and French divisions are quite small. US Armored Division Troops: 16,800 Tanks: 348 AIFV: 216 Artillery: 117 ATGM: 168 US Mechanised Division Troops: 17,100 Tanks: 290 AIFV: 270 Artillery: 113 ATGM: 204 Soviet Tank Division Troops: 11,000 Tanks: 328 AIFV: 273 Artillery: 174 ATGM: 9 Soviet Motor Rifle Division (Europe) Troops: 13,300 Tanks: 271 AIFV: 245 Artillery: 216 ATGM: 117 Soviet Motor Rifle Division (Other) Troops: 13,300 Tanks: 220 APC: 290 Artillery: 216 ATGM: 117 Chinese Tank Division Troops: 9,900 Tanks: 323 Artillery: 32 ATGM: 52 Chinese Infantry Division Troops: 13,400 Tanks: 80 Artillery: 60 ATGM: 54 British Armoured Division Troops: 14,900 Tanks: 285 AIFV: 225 Artillery: 72 ATGM: 120 British Infantry Division Troops: 14,000 APC: 129 Artillery: 54 ATGM: 126 West German Panzer Division Troops: 21,750 Tanks: 308 AIFV: 164 Artillery: 124 ATGM: 141 West German Panzergrenadier Division Troops: 22,000 Tanks: 252 AIFV: 190 Artillery: 130 ATGM: 171 French Armoured Division Troops: 9,000 Tanks: 190 AIFV: 114 Artillery: 68 ATGM: 60 French Infantry Division Troops: 7,200 APC: 400 Artillery: 42 ATGM: 96 |
#13
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Another collection of data points, these ones the Dutch army from 1985, courtesy orbat85.nl:
1st Division: 12285 men plus artillery, engineer, recon, air defense & MP units attached from I NL Corps. 4th Division: 12353 men plus attachments 5th Division: 12183 men plus attachments. These are general guidelines, since as orbat85.nl explains: "Although 1 (NL) Corps included three divisions, these were not fixed formations as for instance in the British or US Army. During operations Commander, 1 (NL) Corps would allocate brigades and corps level assets to the divisional staffs depending the tactical situation, reallocating them as circumstances required. The three divisional staffs thus were pure tactical headquarters, each commanding between two and five brigades and whatever units they would receive from corps level. The brigades were the main operational elements, designed to be able to operate independently for up to forty-eight hours, each having their own artillery, engineers and logistic support.8 Within this adaptable command structure the brigades were the only permanent formations, retaining their units as much as possible."
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I love the smell of napalm in the morning. You know, one time we had a hill bombed, for 12 hours. When it was all over, I walked up. We didn't find one of 'em, not one stinkin' body. The smell, you know that gasoline smell, the whole hill. Smelled like... victory. Someday this war's gonna end... |
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