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  #1  
Old 05-04-2017, 02:55 PM
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Machine shops require huge quantity of consumables to make product.

High speed steel to make tool bits or tungsten carbide premade bits. Those are consumed as resharpened or chipped in use. Cutting oils and kerosene for lubricating parts as these are cut and generating heat. Sand paper in strips or sheets from 80 grit to 5000 grit to polish parts for fit gets used up fast. Sandpapers think three to six feet of strips for barrel polishing. Valve grinding compound in 40 to 600 for final fitting two parts that must have below .003 tolerances like gas valves. Drill bits (especially certain preferred sizes) last from a month to a year with periodic resharpening. Same goes for reamers to be sure a hole is true to the specified diameter.

Barrel reamers (cutters or buttons) are made by few specialized shops (Pacific Tool & Gauge is one) as are the specific reamers for a chosen caliber. These come in sets of three. One and Two basically open up and establish to chamber shape and size. Number three is the Final and cuts the chamber to SAAMI specs in depth, shoulder, and leed. One and Two would last about six months if you used a drill bit to hog out material. Three or Final has to be precise and would be out of spec if you were trying to cut several chambers a day for a month.

A machine shop needs three phase 240 or 440 watt power at 60 cycles without interruptions. Any loss or power that fluctuates will cause imprecise cuts a trained machinists would need to assess and recut.

Most of all a machine shop needs steel, iron, aluminum, copper, and lead in pure or as alloys in correct ratios. Most salvaged metals can't be trusted to make parts that must endure with out destructive testing first for hardness, ductility, etc, etc.

The Republic is must build a blast furnace to be fed with coke (cooked coal) and some metallurgists that know how to add in alloys like chromium, manganese, boron, and others to make steels for various purposes.

That is why I think the Republic and the KFS have a trade established about New Orleans with beef, ammonium nitrate, leather, motor oil, gear oil, lamp oil, kerosene, diesel, and plastic pellets going to the KFS. The KFS is sending back textiles, machine shop consumables, containers (55 gallon and 30 gallon drums, metal boxes with lids, and assorted tupperware or glass jars with lids), and horses for the Cavalry.
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Old 05-04-2017, 05:37 PM
Matt W Matt W is offline
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Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post

That is why I think the Republic and the KFS have a trade established about New Orleans with beef, ammonium nitrate, leather, motor oil, gear oil, lamp oil, kerosene, diesel, and plastic pellets going to the KFS. The KFS is sending back textiles, machine shop consumables, containers (55 gallon and 30 gallon drums, metal boxes with lids, and assorted tupperware or glass jars with lids), and horses for the Cavalry.
Agreed.

There should be trade between the major "industrial" nations. But I don't think you have to go all the way to New Orleans. Somewhere like Vicksburg might be a "free city" that trades with Texas and KFS if you include Truckers .

A minor detail I would add is that synthetic rubber should be on the list of Texas exports. Somebody has to make tyres for the Truckers and Bikers
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Old 05-04-2017, 06:51 PM
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Agreed.

There should be trade between the major "industrial" nations. But I don't think you have to go all the way to New Orleans. Somewhere like Vicksburg might be a "free city" that trades with Texas and KFS if you include Truckers .

A minor detail I would add is that synthetic rubber should be on the list of Texas exports. Somebody has to make tyres for the Truckers and Bikers
Truckers and bikers works. I was thinking of the Shipmen/Boatmen... I would have sworn there was a separate encounter group for the traders/pirates moving cargo and people up and down the Ohio, Upper Mississippi, Illinois and Tennessee.
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Old 05-04-2017, 08:00 PM
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I like New Orleans as a trade center just for the historical reference to it always having been one. Vicksburg works too, maybe the Natchez Trace is once again running mule trains?
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Old 05-05-2017, 08:30 AM
mmartin798 mmartin798 is offline
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The problem with New Orleans is that the Mississippi River likely would have changed course and no longer empties near it. The Army Corp of Engineers fights a continuous battle to maintain the course of the Mississippi at no small cost. It would not take long for the Old River Control Structure (ORCS) to fail.

This was a major concern in the late 70's, since the flood of 1973 almost did undermine the ORCS. There was a paper written about the physical and economic consequences of such a failure in 1980 by two professors at Louisiana State University. An excerpt from the abstract reads:

"Were a major flood to destroy the ability of the ORCS to control the distribuion of flow between the Lower Mississippi River and the Atchafalaya River, then major flooding would occur in the Atchafalaya Basin, highway and railroad bridges would be destroyed, gas pipelines severed, and industrial production along the Mississippi River between Baton Rouge (BR) and New Orleans (NO) would be reduced. The dry weather period following the flood would result in reduced discharges in the river between BR and NO. This would permit salt water from the Gulf of Mexico to fill what is now the main stem of the river. The present channel would become a salt water estuary of the Gulf of Mexico."

It goes on to discuss the saltwater making existing potable water supplies unusable requiring a plan to replace them. It is a good read if you want a realistic idea of what likely happens in the lower Mississippi River after the war. The paper is the "Louisiana Water Resources Research Institute, Bulletin 12, September 1980". Using that as a search term in Google will take you to a PDF of the entire paper.
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Old 05-05-2017, 11:48 AM
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My recollection is imperfect, but wasn't the city of New Orleans far removed from the ports and docks until very recent modern times?

Miles and miles if I am not mistaken.
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Old 05-05-2017, 03:02 PM
dragoon500ly dragoon500ly is offline
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The problems with the Mississippi River and its change of directions over 150 years on non-human control will almost certainly make New Orleans-Vicksburg-Baton Rouge almost useless as ports, on the other hand Mobile Bay would almost certainly be still usable, so how about a shipping route from Mobile Bay to Galveston or Port Arthur?

For Lonestar's long term plans, the Republic's efforts to recapture Galveston and reopen the trade route would be interesting.
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Old 12-25-2017, 03:04 PM
tsofian tsofian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
Machine shops require huge quantity of consumables to make product.

High speed steel to make tool bits or tungsten carbide premade bits. Those are consumed as resharpened or chipped in use. Cutting oils and kerosene for lubricating parts as these are cut and generating heat. Sand paper in strips or sheets from 80 grit to 5000 grit to polish parts for fit gets used up fast. Sandpapers think three to six feet of strips for barrel polishing. Valve grinding compound in 40 to 600 for final fitting two parts that must have below .003 tolerances like gas valves. Drill bits (especially certain preferred sizes) last from a month to a year with periodic resharpening. Same goes for reamers to be sure a hole is true to the specified diameter.

Barrel reamers (cutters or buttons) are made by few specialized shops (Pacific Tool & Gauge is one) as are the specific reamers for a chosen caliber. These come in sets of three. One and Two basically open up and establish to chamber shape and size. Number three is the Final and cuts the chamber to SAAMI specs in depth, shoulder, and leed. One and Two would last about six months if you used a drill bit to hog out material. Three or Final has to be precise and would be out of spec if you were trying to cut several chambers a day for a month.

A machine shop needs three phase 240 or 440 watt power at 60 cycles without interruptions. Any loss or power that fluctuates will cause imprecise cuts a trained machinists would need to assess and recut.

Most of all a machine shop needs steel, iron, aluminum, copper, and lead in pure or as alloys in correct ratios. Most salvaged metals can't be trusted to make parts that must endure with out destructive testing first for hardness, ductility, etc, etc.

The Republic is must build a blast furnace to be fed with coke (cooked coal) and some metallurgists that know how to add in alloys like chromium, manganese, boron, and others to make steels for various purposes.

That is why I think the Republic and the KFS have a trade established about New Orleans with beef, ammonium nitrate, leather, motor oil, gear oil, lamp oil, kerosene, diesel, and plastic pellets going to the KFS. The KFS is sending back textiles, machine shop consumables, containers (55 gallon and 30 gallon drums, metal boxes with lids, and assorted tupperware or glass jars with lids), and horses for the Cavalry.
Machine shops do not need electricity at all. They need an energy source but it could be steam or hydraulic to name two. There was a long period when all the machines in a shop were powered by belt drives off line shafts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6D_V5smCaOw

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_shaft

Perfect alloys make equipment last a lot longer, but they aren't required. Most of the alloys you mention didn't come into general use until well after the 1903 Springfield was in production. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel#History

Also steel is widely recycled today https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scrap#...etal_recycling so getting it graded and sorted is not only possibly but commercially viable.
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  #9  
Old 12-25-2017, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by tsofian View Post
Machine shops do not need electricity at all. They need an energy source but it could be steam or hydraulic to name two. There was a long period when all the machines in a shop were powered by belt drives offline shafts.
Those have been out of fashion since the 1930s and won't be found outside of a museum with most having been scrapped for the metals in WW2. Postwar date 1989 or 2017 electrically driven machinery is going to be found in industrial zones, high schools, colleges, and trade schools.

forget conversion. That would take more effort than it would be worth.
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  #10  
Old 12-26-2017, 09:19 AM
tsofian tsofian is offline
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Those have been out of fashion since the 1930s and won't be found outside of a museum with most having been scrapped for the metals in WW2. Postwar date 1989 or 2017 electrically driven machinery is going to be found in industrial zones, high schools, colleges, and trade schools.

forget conversion. That would take more effort than it would be worth.
Who said conversion? This technology will be remade after the war. Folks will use generators and remaining fuel to build systems that are sustainable. Things like hit and miss engines and PTO off truck and tractors will be powering equipment. Antique stores and museums and barns will be raided for hit and miss motors and similar pre electrical technology. This won't happen everywhere. The places it doesn't happen will either find other ways or not develop technologically
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