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  #1  
Old 02-05-2017, 12:31 PM
Giorgio Giorgio is offline
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Default TMP 4E New GM Facebook page feedback

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Hello everyone,

Below is the post I wrote on The Morrow Projects Facebook page; I copied and pasted it here for better visibility after I learned from Chris Garland that this was a good place to bring up a discussion on topic. I will be posting a follow up in a new post in these forums later.

Not in my original FB post, as I didn’t have my notes on hand; when I talk below about “settlements” as they pertain to the Pathfinder RPG game; this is the kind of template and guidance I have in mind, that would make my job as a TMP 4E GM much easier.

Pathfinder Settlements

Pathfinder Settlement Tools


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello All!

I recently purchased and I am currently reading The Morrow Project 4th Edition, as a new GM with no prior experience I have some questions, any assistance welcome.

1- After TMP 4E core rulebook, what other 4E material is available now and in the near future? The timeline website is not clear on this/does not have a news section.

2- Are additional TMP 4E resources going to be made available in digital format?

3- When will a GM screen and dice be made available for purchase?

4- Which of the many TMP fan sites forums are more TMP 4E new GM friendly and conductive to good discussions and gaming resources?

5- Are there any good YouTube videos you can recommend that show the basics of the game/how to play?

Request: Can you make available more pre-gens PCs and blank character sheets on Drivetrurpg.com?

Some feedback/comments below from my perspective as a new TMP 4E GM, and where I could use some clarification, guidance and help.

Core Rulebook Chapter 13: Survivors
-Some more information about Prime Base, Regional Bases, and bolt-holes/team locations that can be used for running a campaign would be very useful and welcome. Also, more maps and blueprints/layouts of interior spaces, pre-generated NPCs and settlements, player handouts, and plastic minis or pawns would all be good candidates for future supplements/expansions.

Core Rulebook Chapter 14: Survivors Equipment and Economics
-This section is VERY math heavy and intimidating to me as a new GM. More detailed example on how to build settlements step by step (like Hope and Grinder), an empty/default settlement template/sheet AND a completed version (of Hope and Grinder), and “upgrade templates” (showing cost, time, labor, resources) for different tech levels for each of the eight identified sectors [Agriculture, Extraction, Manufacturing, Transport, Energy, Communications, Healthcare, Weapons] would be very, very useful and help me to better understand the material.

For example, if I had a full “settlement sheet” of Hope (I can expand on this upon request), and basic information on available labor, resources, and tech base and some “upgrade templates” like “+ x labor, x time, x resources, x tech base to upgrade the military/defense sector to the next tech level” I could as GM calculate what kind of effort the PCs would need to achieve in order for a marked difference to be made on their world/environment, and to help make informed choices.
GM to Players (example): Hope has a Labor pool of 10, a Resource pool of 7, and a Tech Base of F in Agriculture, Extraction, Manufacturing, Transport, Energy, Communications and Healthcare, and a Tech Base of E in Weapons. It will cost you the following points to upgrade any sector from Tech Base F to E: Labor 30, Resource 50, Time 6 months; double that to go from Tech Base E to D. You can’t build everything you want with the time, resources, skills, equipment and technology you have on hand; what to you want to prioritize and start first?

Core Rulebook P. 205; The image is very blurry and I can’t read some of the numbers, do you have a better image available to print?

Core Rulebook P.304: The Day the World Begin (Sample Scenario)
-As a new GM, this section feels rushed and incomplete. As the only non-rules/background section of the book, it is my view it falls short in assisting a new GM to get a campaign off the ground. Where are the maps of the surrounding area showing the location of the bolt holes, the supply catches, the town of Evanstown and the nearby settlements and points of interests? Where are the handy list of Evanstown NPCs, available supplies for sale or trade, and map of the town? This section could use a bit of expansion to make it more new GM friendly.

Core Rulebook P.305: Evanstown
-The info on the town is a good starting point yet I feel that its missing a one page printable “settlement block” info that summaries the info in a GM friendly way.

-The focus of this game is rebuilding America, and I feel like the book is lacking guidance in how to get that implemented in game. For example, Evanstown is stated up, but it is not clear how it can be “upgraded” once TMP personnel get involved. Let’s say the PCs find all 6 supply catches, and decide that this town will be their base of operation and will be “upgraded”. How many people can be involved in improving the town (manpower/labor), what areas can be improved (defense, education, health, trade, infrastructure) at a cost of what effort(time/resources/labor), and how will it affect the surrounding settlements once word gets of “the rich and powerful strangers from the past” as the PCs start hiring local labor, trading, and brining new knowledge and technology to the world? More clarifications and example would be very useful.

Thanks for everyone who has read this far and provided feedback!
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  #2  
Old 02-05-2017, 06:41 PM
ArmySGT.'s Avatar
ArmySGT. ArmySGT. is offline
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Good luck.

We have been waiting two years for an answer.

My copy of 4th is in a box, and I haven't looked at it in over a year.

If I could return it and get my $50 back I would in a heart beat.
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  #3  
Old 02-05-2017, 07:07 PM
Giorgio Giorgio is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
Good luck.

We have been waiting two years for an answer.

My copy of 4th is in a box, and I haven't looked at it in over a year.

If I could return it and get my $50 back I would in a heart beat.
Not quite the type of reply I was expecting.

I am hopeful that this game line will continue to be supported and that new material will come along soon; its a game I really would like to GM one day (as long as I have the gaming resources to do so).
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  #4  
Old 02-05-2017, 07:09 PM
nuke11 nuke11 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
TMP FB page

Hello everyone,

Below is the post I wrote on The Morrow Projects Facebook page; I copied and pasted it here for better visibility after I learned from Chris Garland that this was a good place to bring up a discussion on topic. I will be posting a follow up in a new post in these forums later.

Not in my original FB post, as I didn’t have my notes on hand; when I talk below about “settlements” as they pertain to the Pathfinder RPG game; this is the kind of template and guidance I have in mind, that would make my job as a TMP 4E GM much easier.

Pathfinder Settlements

Pathfinder Settlement Tools


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello All!

I recently purchased and I am currently reading The Morrow Project 4th Edition, as a new GM with no prior experience I have some questions, any assistance welcome.

1- After TMP 4E core rulebook, what other 4E material is available now and in the near future? The timeline website is not clear on this/does not have a news section.

2- Are additional TMP 4E resources going to be made available in digital format?

3- When will a GM screen and dice be made available for purchase?

4- Which of the many TMP fan sites forums are more TMP 4E new GM friendly and conductive to good discussions and gaming resources?

5- Are there any good YouTube videos you can recommend that show the basics of the game/how to play?

Request: Can you make available more pre-gens PCs and blank character sheets on Drivetrurpg.com?

Some feedback/comments below from my perspective as a new TMP 4E GM, and where I could use some clarification, guidance and help.
Some answers;

1. There is nothing currently out, there are plans for some. I believe at the moment a 4th ed blue prints are being worked on and I think a GM screen, but we haven't heard much for a while now. There are plans to bring the 3rd edition modules up to 4th edition compatibility, but no dates or details have been released.

2. Most likely, but that will be up to Chris.

3. The dice I'm not sure about about, the GM screen see #1.

4. There are none that I know of that are 4th edition specific. Very few of the current sites even run the 4th edition. This forum is the only forum for TMP and there are a couple of mailing lists for TMP as well.

5. There are no videos of game play that I know of at the moment.

There is a free PC sheet downloadable from TML that is for the 4th edition : http://timelineltd.3dcartstores.com/...heet_p_24.html
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  #5  
Old 02-05-2017, 10:51 PM
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ArmySGT. ArmySGT. is offline
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1- After TMP 4E core rulebook, what other 4E material is available now and in the near future? The timeline website is not clear on this/does not have a news section. Only Chris has that answer. The only "canon" material is the game modules PF (Project File) 01 through 10. Each has more equipment, tables, maps, vehicles, and facilities than came with the the 3rd edition. You will just have to adapt where necessary to 4th if it is even necessary.

2- Are additional TMP 4E resources going to be made available in digital format? Pdfs in this forum. Chris Garland is the sole source for what is going to happen with 4th edition.

3- When will a GM screen and dice be made available for purchase?

There is a thread here with inputs to make your own. Search should turn that up. It is incomplete as each PD has preferences.

4- Which of the many TMP fan sites forums are more TMP 4E new GM friendly and conductive to good discussions and gaming resources?
Goodness..... This and Google + are the only ones with any activity that I know of. 3rd edition came out in the 1970s, whole forums have come and died.

5- Are there any good YouTube videos you can recommend that show the basics of the game/how to play? Using the Youtube search engine provided this. Gameplay

Request: Can you make available more pre-gens PCs and blank character sheets on Drivetrurpg.com? As suggested the Blank character sheet is free to download from Timeline Ltd. Google suggested others.
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  #6  
Old 02-05-2017, 11:16 PM
ArmySGT.'s Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook Chapter 13: Survivors
-Some more information about Prime Base, Regional Bases, and bolt-holes/team locations that can be used for running a campaign would be very useful and welcome. Also, more maps and blueprints/layouts of interior spaces, pre-generated NPCs and settlements, player handouts, and plastic minis or pawns would all be good candidates for future supplements/expansions.
There is a short section on Bolt holes bases and such in 4th edition. It is all very general. Each of the modules has more specific information. I suggest you purchase the modules (Project File) starting with PF-01 Liberation at Riverton.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook Chapter 14: Survivors Equipment and Economics
-This section is VERY math heavy and intimidating to me as a new GM. More detailed example on how to build settlements step by step (like Hope and Grinder), an empty/default settlement template/sheet AND a completed version (of Hope and Grinder), and “upgrade templates” (showing cost, time, labor, resources) for different tech levels for each of the eight identified sectors [Agriculture, Extraction, Manufacturing, Transport, Energy, Communications, Healthcare, Weapons] would be very, very useful and help me to better understand the material.
This is so broken as to be virtually worthless. MMartin798 has done a fantastic job unraveling much of the core rulebooks examples. The problem is the section is incomplete, changes inputs/outputs without explanation, and misses tables.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
For example, if I had a full “settlement sheet” of Hope (I can expand on this upon request), and basic information on available labor, resources, and tech base and some “upgrade templates” like “+ x labor, x time, x resources, x tech base to upgrade the military/defense sector to the next tech level” I could as GM calculate what kind of effort the PCs would need to achieve in order for a marked difference to be made on their world/environment, and to help make informed choices.
GM to Players (example): Hope has a Labor pool of 10, a Resource pool of 7, and a Tech Base of F in Agriculture, Extraction, Manufacturing, Transport, Energy, Communications and Healthcare, and a Tech Base of E in Weapons. It will cost you the following points to upgrade any sector from Tech Base F to E: Labor 30, Resource 50, Time 6 months; double that to go from Tech Base E to D. You can’t build everything you want with the time, resources, skills, equipment and technology you have on hand; what to you want to prioritize and start first?
Neither Chris or Robert has produced such to my knowledge. You can read the 4th Economics thread and maybe some of it will be better explained here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook P. 205; The image is very blurry and I can’t read some of the numbers, do you have a better image available to print?
I don't have the book available to me. Maybe buy the digital download and enlarge the image?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook P.304: The Day the World Begin (Sample Scenario)
-As a new GM, this section feels rushed and incomplete. As the only non-rules/background section of the book, it is my view it falls short in assisting a new GM to get a campaign off the ground. Where are the maps of the surrounding area showing the location of the bolt holes, the supply catches, the town of Evanstown and the nearby settlements and points of interests? Where are the handy list of Evanstown NPCs, available supplies for sale or trade, and map of the town? This section could use a bit of expansion to make it more new GM friendly.
Yeah. I don't have book out. I think it is meant to just get you started and you as the PD fill in the blanks... Aka set Evanstown in any State you wish, fill it with your own NPCs, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook P.305: Evanstown
-The info on the town is a good starting point yet I feel that its missing a one page printable “settlement block” info that summaries the info in a GM friendly way.
I think it was meant as a suggestion and the PD goes with it from there. After a few years I don't see it happening.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
-The focus of this game is rebuilding America, and I feel like the book is lacking guidance in how to get that implemented in game. For example, Evanstown is stated up, but it is not clear how it can be “upgraded” once TMP personnel get involved. Let’s say the PCs find all 6 supply catches, and decide that this town will be their base of operation and will be “upgraded”. How many people can be involved in improving the town (manpower/labor), what areas can be improved (defense, education, health, trade, infrastructure) at a cost of what effort(time/resources/labor), and how will it affect the surrounding settlements once word gets of “the rich and powerful strangers from the past” as the PCs start hiring local labor, trading, and brining new knowledge and technology to the world? More clarifications and example would be very useful.
That is all in the Role Play. How does a town work? Is it a democracy, a theocracy, a dictatorship, a feudal kingdom? Is their enough food, clean water, and homes for everyone? Who wants to kill and enslave them? The King, the Mayor, or the Warriors of Krell not 20 miles down the road?

Some of the focus changed...In 3rd edition it was to save "civilization" and now in 4th it is to "restore the United States of America". So what that means is up to the PD and the players. Good Luck!
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  #7  
Old 02-06-2017, 04:59 AM
rob rob is offline
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Default What I've done

What I have done:

1: I made my own GM Screen with the charts and other related material that I feel is relevant. Blank GM screens can be made by using a scanner, printer and a blank GM screen that are made by Hammerdog.com.

2: The Pathfinder material is fine to use but do keep it in context with the environment of your campaign. I have found that the old Cities book that was published by Midkemia Publishing back in the 1980s. Copies can still be had on Ebay, etc. Also be flexible on campaign development. So far the largest community 'found' by the PCs is around 3-4000 people. They are in a largely rural area.

3: I use my own dice. The dice that came with the Morrow Project 4th edition do roll nicely, especially the percentile dice.

4: I have found this forum to be of great use! Other GMs/PDs have insight to things I may not thought of or have bounced ideas off them for their thoughts.

Thanks!
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  #8  
Old 02-06-2017, 05:23 PM
Matt W Matt W is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
TMP FB page

Hello everyone,

Below is the post I wrote on The Morrow Projects Facebook page; I copied and pasted it here for better visibility after I learned from Chris Garland that this was a good place to bring up a discussion on topic. I will be posting a follow up in a new post in these forums later.

Not in my original FB post, as I didn’t have my notes on hand; when I talk below about “settlements” as they pertain to the Pathfinder RPG game; this is the kind of template and guidance I have in mind, that would make my job as a TMP 4E GM much easier.

Pathfinder Settlements

Pathfinder Settlement Tools


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello All!

I recently purchased and I am currently reading The Morrow Project 4th Edition, as a new GM with no prior experience I have some questions, any assistance welcome.

SNIP

4- Which of the many TMP fan sites forums are more TMP 4E new GM friendly and conductive to good discussions and gaming resources?

SNIP
Welcome!

I like to think that my stuff is fairly "4th ed-friendly" https://morrowproject.wordpress.com/


Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook Chapter 13: Survivors
-Some more information about Prime Base, Regional Bases, and bolt-holes/team locations that can be used for running a campaign would be very useful and welcome. Also, more maps and blueprints/layouts of interior spaces, pre-generated NPCs and settlements, player handouts, and plastic minis or pawns would all be good candidates for future supplements/expansions.
As far as I know, the only "official" details about Prime Base are in the module "Prime Base". However, this is generally disliked by the fandom and there are numerous unofficial variants. A few Google searches should yield results. Regional Bases have not been officially described

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook Chapter 14: Survivors Equipment and Economics
-This section is VERY math heavy and intimidating to me as a new GM. More detailed example on how to build settlements step by step (like Hope and Grinder), an empty/default settlement template/sheet AND a completed version (of Hope and Grinder), and “upgrade templates” (showing cost, time, labor, resources) for different tech levels for each of the eight identified sectors [Agriculture, Extraction, Manufacturing, Transport, Energy, Communications, Healthcare, Weapons] would be very, very useful and help me to better understand the material.
I would treat this as EXTREMELY optional. Just create the settlement as you see fit. The objective is to entertain, after all. No player is going to check your maths.

SNIP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook P. 205; The image is very blurry and I can’t read some of the numbers, do you have a better image available to print?
You must have been unlucky. My edition is clear. Which bits need more details?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook P.304: The Day the World Begin (Sample Scenario)
-As a new GM, this section feels rushed and incomplete. As the only non-rules/background section of the book, it is my view it falls short in assisting a new GM to get a campaign off the ground. Where are the maps of the surrounding area showing the location of the bolt holes, the supply catches, the town of Evanstown and the nearby settlements and points of interests? Where are the handy list of Evanstown NPCs, available supplies for sale or trade, and map of the town? This section could use a bit of expansion to make it more new GM friendly.
I suspect that maps were omitted deliberately - to allow you to place Evanstown wherever you wish. I recommend using an area that you are familiar with and using "real world" maps (using the PD's home town is a common approach)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giorgio View Post
Core Rulebook P.305: Evanstown
-The info on the town is a good starting point yet I feel that its missing a one page printable “settlement block” info that summaries the info in a GM friendly way.

-The focus of this game is rebuilding America, and I feel like the book is lacking guidance in how to get that implemented in game. For example, Evanstown is stated up, but it is not clear how it can be “upgraded” once TMP personnel get involved. Let’s say the PCs find all 6 supply catches, and decide that this town will be their base of operation and will be “upgraded”. How many people can be involved in improving the town (manpower/labor), what areas can be improved (defense, education, health, trade, infrastructure) at a cost of what effort(time/resources/labor), and how will it affect the surrounding settlements once word gets of “the rich and powerful strangers from the past” as the PCs start hiring local labor, trading, and brining new knowledge and technology to the world? More clarifications and example would be very useful.

Thanks for everyone who has read this far and provided feedback!
"Upgrading" the survivor community is IMMENSELY complex. As far as I know, none of the official and canon modules give any real guidance on this. Also, I suspect that it would be more complex than your players would enjoy. But - of course - you know your players better than I do. I would suggest that you plot out a couple of things that might interest your players and let them "own" those projects

Here is a (partial) list of ideas
https://morrowproject.wordpress.com/...l-initiatives/

Here is my (totally unofficial) 2-page checklist for Recon Teams
https://morrowproject.files.wordpres...cklistcard.pdf
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  #9  
Old 02-07-2017, 11:34 AM
WaltShumate WaltShumate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
Good luck.

We have been waiting two years for an answer.

My copy of 4th is in a box, and I haven't looked at it in over a year.

If I could return it and get my $50 back I would in a heart beat.
From the response I had from the publisher regarding rules questions it is obvious 4th edition The Morrow Project s yet another kickstarter project for which the only goal seems to be an entry for somebody's CV / Resume.

Last edited by WaltShumate; 02-08-2017 at 02:21 AM.
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  #10  
Old 02-12-2017, 07:48 PM
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RandyT0001 RandyT0001 is offline
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While looking at drivethru rpg for new MP material I can across this reference:
https://plus.google.com/communities/...01515445497429
Looks like a Google plus community for MP
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  #11  
Old 02-13-2017, 04:21 AM
WaltShumate WaltShumate is offline
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I posted rules questions on there 3 weeks ago and had zero response. Apart from the links to the To Tomorrows End podcasts it is useless.
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