Poll - Favorite Small Arm

[chico20854]

What type of small arm (.50 and under, man-portable) do you like to equip your PC with as his primary weapon? (I know folks like to keep a GPMG, a shotgun, a Barret .50 and a PPSH in the HMMWV for those special situations, but on an everyday basis)

A shotgun for really cleaning rooms up and for the occasional fresh fowl for dinner?
A SMG for carrying in and out of armored vehicles and handy CQB work?
An assault rifle that does a pretty good job from 15 to 300m for every soldier?
A 7.62mm battle rifle that can stop somebody at more than 200m?
A sniper rifle so you can take down that Marauder leader when he crosses the far ridge?
Only a pistol, because that's how officers show their status?
A light machinegun (SAW, RPK, L-86 or the like) so you have more firepower than the average joe but can still move a bit?
A medium machinegun to really lay down some firepower?
Or something else????

I understand, of course, that what your PC carries also depends on the rest of the party... if your group all had sniper rifles it might be tough to storm a building....

[fightingflamingo]

M14 or M1A hands down. Mostly because I'm a 7.62 fanatic, and secondly because I am very, very familiar with the operation, and employment of this platform, both on and off of the range. I like the ability to put down without question those I shoot at, which goes well with the 7.62's ability to defeat most personal body armor. I might favor the L1A1 or the G3 but I really lack significant experience with either of those platforms, so I can't say I'd prefer, even if in some aspects they may be superior. Regardless, my first and final choice would always be a 7.62 semi auto or select fire battle rifle...

[Targan]

Battle rifle. Both for me personally and for any PC. G3, FN-FAL/SLR, M14, all good. In the words of my very first Army range instructor "7.62 f**ks things".

[Raellus]

I'd like to cheat and pick the H&K G8. It can be used as both a SAW/LSW/LMG and as a marksman's rifle. I saw some pics of it being carried by German KSK commandos and fell in love with it. It's a wee bit munchkinish but I built a PC around the gun.

The following is an excerpt from Wikepedia:

"The German Army, German Navy and the Federal Police use a variant of the HK11 designated the Gewehr-8 (or G8). It is tapped for telescopic sights and has a quick-change barrel with a bipod that uses either a heavy match-grade bull-barrel or a heavy barrel for automatic fire. It was designed to use G3-type 10- or 20-round box magazines in the designated marksman role, but could also use a special 50-round drum magazine for sustained supporting or suppressing fire. The modified G8A1 adopted the improvements of the HK11A1 series and was only able to feed from magazines and drums."

It's listed as the HK 11E under German machineguns on Paul's site.

Sweet.:cool:

[pmulcahy11b]

I had to vote Medium Machinegun; what can I say? I love The Pig!

[jester]

I went with light machinegun! You can do almost as much with it as you can with a medium. And you can also do most of what you can do with an assault rifle. And a good gunner can get off single shots as well.

[Legbreaker]

Well, if it's got to be a small arm, then an automatic rifle / light machinegun is the preference for the ability to lay down sustained fire at a high rate.
First option though is a grenade launcher, preferably something along the lines of a Milkor MGL or similar.

[Dog 6]

M-14 FTW

[Ramjam]

I went with Battle Rifles.

If I shoot someone I want to know he's not going to get back up that quick.

Bring back the L1A1 SLR.

[Targan]

I went with Battle Rifles.

If I shoot someone I want to know he's not going to get back up that quick.

Bring back the L1A1 SLR.

Well done that man.

[Jason]

I went light mg, as I love to play a SAW gunner. In the 2.2 rule set the SAW lays down a sick number of shots without over-encumbering my character. I basically never play though, because I am the only GM for this game system.:p

[Targan]

I basically never play though, because I am the only GM for this game system.:p

I know how that feels.

[weswood]

M14 for the range and knock down power, plus the full auto option, even if it is only 20 rounds.

[Mohoender]

I went for the SMG as I really liked it. Like Jester said about the LMG, single shots are possible too. I used to drive my instructor crazy doing that.;)

[pmulcahy11b]

I went for the SMG as I really liked it. Like Jester said about the LMG, single shots are possible too. I used to drive my instructor crazy doing that.;)

I used to drive ROTC cadets crazy using an M-60 as an ad-hoc sniper rifle. Easy to squeeze off single shots using an M-60.

[Haven]

Battle rifle 1) cause they're cool 2) cause the v2.2 sucks for autofire so you might as well have a rifle that packs some serious semi-auto punch.

[Legbreaker]

Automatic weapons are usually not intended to be accurate although there are a few which are (I've heard old soldiers complaining that the Bren gun for example was too accurate and therefore not much good for suppressive fire).

I do believe though that the autofire rules in V2.0 and 2.2 are a bit harsh. As Paul can attest, anyone with a little experience firing proper automatic weapons (that is, anything with a bipood or tripod and actually intended for burst fire), should be able to get most of their rounds on target, most of the time.

Perhaps bursts should be allowed to take advantage of an action spent Aiming before squeezing the trigger, but only from a supported position (not standing from the hip or shoulder but with the weapon resting on something solid).
Assault rifles, SMGs and other lighter weapons would continue to use the existing rule...

Another way of approaching it is using the recoil attribute. If the total recoil is less than say 6, Aiming will have some benefit. Exceed this total recoil and it's basically back to "spray and pray".

Thoughts anyone?

[Targan]

Thoughts anyone?

Use a better combat rules system. I do :D

Its ok, I've got my mouthguard in and I know I deserve a beating for that one.

[Legbreaker]

*Swings at Targan with a baseball bat using T2K rules and......misses!*

[Cpl. Kalkwarf]

Use a better combat rules system. I do :D

Its ok, I've got my mouthguard in and I know I deserve a beating for that one.

:p Nut check!!!!

forgot yer nut-cup

;)

[headquarters]

Use a better combat rules system. I do :D

Its ok, I've got my mouthguard in and I know I deserve a beating for that one.

GM : "TARGAN aquired - he is close and pestering on about HarnF**ker"

player: "gaargh..I cant stand it! 5 bursts of autofire using V.2.0 rules!"

:firing::firing:

"rolls 15 D6 for 11 1`s and 4 5`s "

Player :"WHAT THE F***!"

GM : "eehh.. well the rules arent meant to actually portray reality but try to give a meaningful system to resolve a complex blahblamutter...."

;)

[General Pain]

It basically depends if your'e on foot, in a car, beeing airdropped, how strong the character is, if it's a stealthy mission etc...

My usual weapons of choice usually is:

2 x 10g Sawed of shotguns (double barreled) (with buck and slug in each shotgun)
2 x .666 PainTek Knucklebusters (oversized deserrt eagle design)
1 x VSK-94 fullauto-sniperrifle with long range and good penetration dam 2 1-1-1
Apart from that I'd like to have a carbine able to shoot RAW-HE or RAW HEAT

or

(depends on situation) a autorifle of same calibre as enemies (cuz of the ammo)

[TiggerCCW UK]

I only get to GM Twilight these days, but when I was a PC it was usually an SLR with an HK69 for me :)

[Matt Wiser]

Assault rifle for day-to-day work. The trusty FNC.

[Targan]

I only get to GM Twilight these days, but when I was a PC it was usually an SLR with an HK69 for me :)

Bless you my son :D

[jester]

You FAL lovers,

I have a question, how often are they in a carbine variant? I saw it once in the movie "Wild Geese" and that is it. However, they would be a cool system for gamming if your PCs operated in vehicles or close in areas or wanted the full firepower of the heavier weapon but needed concealability. I am thinking, a short barrel of about 12 inches and a folding stock. Would it work? Granted range would be highly reduced, but still a bada$$ system, at least I think.

[pmulcahy11b]

I've never fired a FAL, but I'm guessing a 12-inch-barrel FAL would have huge muzzle flash and possibly recoil (a regular FAL already has high recoil on automatic). Mounting a good muzzle brake would help, though muzzle brakes tend to re-direct the actual muzzle flash rather than reducing it much. I wouldn't want to shoot such a weapon at night -- instant night blindness.

[Ramjam]

Didn't the Aussies try a carbine version of the L1A1 during Vietnam. If I remember rightly they nicknamed them 'Bitches' because they had a hell of a kick.

Here's the info on it from wiki :

Another interesting product of Australian participation in the conflict in South-East Asia was the field modification of L1A1 and L2A1 rifles by the Australian Special Air Service Regiment SASR for better handling. Nicknamed "The Bitch", these rifles were field modified, often from heavy barrel L2A1 automatic rifles, with their barrels cut off immediately in front of the gas block, and often with the L2A1 bipods removed and a XM148 40 mm grenade launcher mounted below the barrel. The XM148 40 mm grenade launchers were obtained from U.S. forces. For the L1A1, the lack of fully-automatic fire resulted in the unofficial conversion of the L1A1 to full-auto capability by simply filing down the selector, which works by restricting disconnecter movement.

-------------

Now the L1A1 had I nice solid kick to it even on single shot so I'm betting this thing earned it's nicknamed well lol.;)

[James Langham]

In Vietnam the Australian SAS used an L1A1cut down to juyst ahead of the gas regulator for short range work. It was called "the beast" from the recoil. They also produced a shortened SLR for the smaller Aborigine troops, the L1A1F1. Neither had a folding stock (as per standard SLR). If I was making one I would start with the FAL.

Personallt I would take an L85A2 (SA80). Never had a problem with it, it's what I'm trained on and the sling is a fantastic piece of work. Less happy with the bayonet though so I would carry a pistol for close in (very close with my pistol skill - far less than half my rifle skill!).

[James Langham]

No need to get the file out - a strategically applied match-stick does the trick!

[TiggerCCW UK]

I've seen the match stick trick done, wouldn't fancy firing it full auto though, I reckon you'd be cloud punching :)

IIRC in the Falklands the Argentinian special forces (Buzo Tactico?) used the FAL Commando which was a shorter barreled version with a folding stock.

Courtesy of wikipedia;

[jester]

Nice, but I am thinking smaller, making it similiar in size to a MP5 in size just with a bigger bullet.

I remember in the 80s they did conversions of HK91s <Civi Model of the G3> where they turned them into what was essentaily an MP5 in 7.62 and I had a NPC who was a excellent gunsmith who made himself one. Just wondering if it had been done with the L1 series.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Nice, but I am thinking smaller, making it similiar in size to a MP5 in size just with a bigger bullet.

I remember in the 80s they did conversions of HK91s <Civi Model of the G3> where they turned them into what was essentaily an MP5 in 7.62 and I had a NPC who was a excellent gunsmith who made himself one. Just wondering if it had been done with the L1 series.

Not the L1 series but definitely to the FAL in semi-auto and select fire as done by DSA Inc.
http://www.dsarms.com/Mini-SA58-FAL-OSW-Rifle-Select-Fire-NFA-Registered-308Cal---SA58OSWNFA/productinfo/SA58OSWNFA/ Select fire
http://www.dsarms.com/Mini-SA58-FAL-OSW-Rifle-Semi-Auto-308-Cal----SA58OSW/productinfo/SA58OSW/ Semi-auto

Others have done similar work, http://impsec.org/~jhardin/wishlist.html has an image of a short carbine FAL listed as number 6 on his wishlist.
This thread shows a few pics but the interesting one is of the woman firing a shortened FAL - lots of muzzle blast but apparently recoil is okay http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=26519

[Medic]

Depending on the character concept, most characters would probably use an assault rifle, unless the requirements of the group placed them in support weapon duty. A more sniper-style inclined character would most probably use a 7.62 or .338LM sniper rifle as primary with a smg, pdw or a pisto, as a secondary. And should the nation of origin be using M203 or similar system, shotgun can easily be replaced by an APERS round (a canister round, similar but larger than a single shell from a shotgun). :cool:

[B.T.]

I'd use a battle rifle, if I could lay my hands on one. The stopping ability of the larger projectile is the main argument.

The G3 is a weapon, I'm familiar with. Some were used as DMRs. A scope was added, that can easily be removed. The rifle is not as accurate as a sniper rifle, but I think it would be a good compromise. The G3/SG1 even has a bipod on it. If you like, you can attach a grenade launcher underneath the barrel.

If I were serving with an armoured unit, I might use a G3 carbine. Never shot one IRL, so I don't know, if the recoil would be problematic.

I had no trouble entering or leaving the M113 with a G3. A shorter version might be handier, but I never had any trouble with the G3, even in build-up areas or in woods. I think, it all depends a lot on the practice, you had with your weapon.

The differences between G3 and FN FAL/SLR are significant, but I'd still pick one up, if I could not get a G3. The SLR would not be my first choice, though - no automatic fire! It is an option, that is not allways so important, but I'd like the possibility, to do bursts, if the need arises!

[Badbru]

Had to go with sniper rifle as the poll asks what is your characters favourite small arm and I prefer to play snipers. Specificly an M21 usually gets my vote.

It was a tough choice though as I've allways felt an RPK (7.62x39) would be ideal. Only a kilo heavier than it's more popular brother the AK. Out ranges it and still has single shot fire but also a higher ROF auto fire, and in Poland in 2000, ammo would be almost, if not the most, common available.

[Cpl. Kalkwarf]

SVD all the way, it may not have more then 10 rds at a time, but its enough. Let some one else on auto fire attract the attention of the enemy.

[B.T.]

... the poll asks what is your characters favourite small arm ...

Darn, I've overread this :o
But still: If I had a character to play, I'd let him use a battle rifle. In game terms the differences are not that big, so I could easily add the M14 or M21 to my list.

[LBraden]

The differences between G3 and FN FAL/SLR are significant, but I'd still pick one up, if I could not get a G3. The SLR would not be my first choice, though - no automatic fire! It is an option, that is not allways so important, but I'd like the possibility, to do bursts, if the need arises!

I take it you did not learn the "matchstick trick" that practically half the serving squaddies knew to make the gun automatic fire.

[B.T.]

I take it you did not learn the "matchstick trick" that practically half the serving squaddies knew to make the gun automatic fire.

My PC would have learned the trick, if I was ever to portray a Brit (or Aussie or New Zealander) :cool:

[Antenna]

SMG - M45 Bertil

Easy to clean some, details is still something youneed to master.
Good up to 100 m, been there. Never tried beyond.
Did the Guard test. They tried me twice. If you wanna know why those who understand so PM me.

Antenna

[Apache6]

My favorite is the M-16A2 with M-203 and advanced combat optical gunsight.

The rifle is light, accurate and lethal enough. The M-203 gives you a huge advantage in many situations.

The advanced combat optical gunsight gives you improved opportunity for target acquistion/identification and improves chances of hitting targets with rapid engagement. The ACOG is 'mostly grunt proof.'

During the 199Os each USMC squad had 3 M-203s, most had an ACOG, though who 'got it' depended a lot on the leaderships decisions. It might be used by the squad leader or the best shot in the squad might be used as the designated marksman.

[CDAT]

When I play I try to play "as real" as I can. Yes the M14 is nice, but carrying one for a long time it gets heavy. But more I just do not have the experience with it that I do the AR. So I would pick the AR, I am not sure why so many want full auto on the battle rifle. For anything less than suppression it is not that effective in real life.

[Sanjuro]

Some of those are stretching the term "small arm"... you didn't have the option of my preferred weapon system, two Redtop missiles and a pair of Aden cannon!

[Raellus]

Based on the new responses on the Favorite APC/IFV thread, I thought a bit of thread necromancy might be in order.

[micromachine]

I would use anything I could get reliably obtain ammo for, be it barter. scrounging, pilferage, or issue. Commonality with the unit would play a part as well.
All things being equal, I would opt for a battle rifle (SKS-M14-FN FAL, in that order) or assault rifle (AK series-M16 series-SA80 series, in that order).

[Ursus Maior]

I used to drive ROTC cadets crazy using an M-60 as an ad-hoc sniper rifle. Easy to squeeze off single shots using an M-60.

Works great with the MG3 as well. We even were trained in that technique by our instructors.

[Ursus Maior]

For me, this depends on what the group carries. Personally, I'd go with a G3. Know it, good weapon, reliable and hefty punch. If the group is fire-team sized or above, it needs a main support weapon system with high rate of fire. I was good with a MG3, but a small group benefits more from a LMG I thin than a GPMG. I'd go with a RPD over the RPK, because I think it's cooler. In case the group gets about squad-sized, I'd go with a MG3.

If all weapon categories are already covered, I'd go with an assault rifle and probably be the squad leader. ;)

[Nyrond24]

I have done the matchstick trick, it does work but i can say its a very, very bad idea and would never do it again, but I've allowed players to use the trick but with the penalties i dont think anyone ever hit the broad side of a barn.🤣

[Harlsser50]

Battle rifles like the G3, FN-FAL/SLR, and M14 are cannacraftcorner (https://cannacraftcorner.com) excellent choices, both for personal use and for any PC. As my very first Army range instructor pureplantpleasures (https://pureplantpleasures.com) used to say, "7.62 f**ks things up."

[Homer]

The AKM is heavy, harder to shoot accurately at range than some western designs, has a weird (to western usage) magazine well, mounts optics poorly, and the safety/selector lever is counterintuitive to anyone trained on western designs, but…

7.62x39 is a pretty good cartridge- pretty similar to the middle of the road .30-30 load- for anything inside 200 yards, which is a pretty good combat distance in all but open or mountain terrain. The rifle runs well with a little TLC, even if you’re lubing it with motor oil and using wire and a hammer to repair it; and ammo is very easy to come by anywhere east of the IGB. Not to mention the mags are commonplace and pretty durable on their own.

For a small group trying to evade major engagements it’s probably just the level of self defense required, while providing enough power to kill a deer or hog for dinner with decent shot placement.

Throw in an RPK and maybe an RPG you’ve got enough firepower for your group to resolve most small encounters or at least break contact. Plus you keep a common round and mags, don’t need to worry about links for belts, and there is even limited commonality in parts and the possibility of resupply from local sources. If you can track down one of the better made ones from the DDR or other satellites even better.

[Red Diamond]

M4A1 SOPMOD was just coming out. I'd go with that for overall versatility. That's my gal!