Animal Encounters

[Raellus]

TIL I learned that there are more tigers in captivity in the USA than there are in the wild, combined, in the rest of the world.

As of 2006, there were an estimated 12,000 Tigers in the US (4,000 in Texas alone)- the vast majority of these animals in the hands of private owners! Add in African lions and hybrid 'Ligers' and that number goes even higher.

In a T2k scenario, it's likely that a lot of private owners would not be able to take care of their big cats. Many will starve to death, or be put out of their misery, but it's not beyond the realm of possibility that quite a few lions and tigers and bears, etc., will get loose (especially in the chaos following the TDM)- it happens more than you might think, IRL.

The point that I'm getting at is that encounters with Tigers and other big cats in the CONUS would not be terribly unrealistic. Has anyone encountered big cats in a game?

What Ref hasn't thrown a pack of feral dogs at their players? Or wolves? Inspired by stories of "Hogzilla", I threw a huge feral pig at my players in a campaign set in Arkansas. I also created a travelling merchant NPC whose caravan featured a camel he rescued from a zoo in Poland. The players encountered it during a winter snow storm.

What animal encounters have you designed, as a Ref, or played through as a PC?

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[pmulcahy11b]

TIL I learned that there are more tigers in captivity in the USA than there are in the wild, combined, in the rest of the world.



I read that and became deeply sad.

[rcaf_777]

Didn't TDW make an adventure on this I think a challenger article?

[.45cultist]

Didn't TDW make an adventure on this I think a challenger article?

"Tyger, Tyger", or something like that.
Also due to efforts to stop various illnesses, the U.S. has more Vietnamese Pot Bellied Pigs than Vietnam, Thailand , though they are trying to bring them back.

[Olefin]

TIL I learned that there are more tigers in captivity in the USA than there are in the wild, combined, in the rest of the world.

As of 2006, there were an estimated 12,000 Tigers in the US (4,000 in Texas alone)- the vast majority of these animals in the hands of private owners! Add in African lions and hybrid 'Ligers' and that number goes even higher.

In a T2k scenario, it's likely that a lot of private owners would not be able to take care of their big cats. Many will starve to death, or be put out of their misery, but it's not beyond the realm of possibility that quite a few lions and tigers and bears, etc., will get loose (especially in the chaos following the TDM)- it happens more than you might think, IRL.

The point that I'm getting at is that encounters with Tigers and other big cats in the CONUS would not be terribly unrealistic. Has anyone encountered big cats in a game?

What Ref hasn't thrown a pack of feral dogs at their players? Or wolves? Inspired by stories of "Hogzilla", I threw a huge feral pig at my players in a campaign set in Arkansas. I also created a travelling merchant NPC whose caravan featured a camel he rescued from a zoo in Poland. The players encountered it during a winter snow storm.

What animal encounters have you designed, as a Ref, or played through as a PC?

-

Feral pig encounters can be very bad news indeed - they are unbelievably dangerous and could easily take out a couple of PC's in the right conditions

[pmulcahy11b]

Feral pig encounters can be very bad news indeed - they are unbelievably dangerous and could easily take out a couple of PC's in the right conditions

From what I've heard, their meat can also be a bit stringy, and tough if not cooked carefully (there's a procedure). It's not like the pork we're used to.

[Olefin]

From what I've heard, their meat can also be a bit stringy, and tough if not cooked carefully (there's a procedure). It's not like the pork we're used to.

I looked on your site and didnt see them -have you ever done stats on a feral pig?

[kcdusk]

As a kid, when i first got T2K, i laughted at animal encounters.

Now though, much older and experienced, i think they add a good, different dimension to the game.

I've used wild dogs to generate noise and spook players. i might have had them steal food or boots left out over night to be a nuisance.

In australia, dingos are common but not really a threat. Wild dogs are generally a dangerous mix of dingo and / or domestic dogs gone wild. Pack animals, i know of kangaroo shooters who have been scared of wild dogs at night, just the real life threat they pose.

Re feral pigs or any animal, even a light wound can be an issue for player characters. If left untreated it becomes infected quickly. Turning to a medium wound?!

A good chance for the medic or wanna-be medic to get involved!

[Olefin]

As a kid, when i first got T2K, i laughted at animal encounters.

Now though, much older and experienced, i think they add a good, different dimension to the game.

I've used wild dogs to generate noise and spook players. i might have had them steal food or boots left out over night to be a nuisance.

In australia, dingos are common but not really a threat. Wild dogs are generally a dangerous mix of dingo and / or domestic dogs gone wild. Pack animals, i know of kangaroo shooters who have been scared of wild dogs at night, just the real life threat they pose.

Re feral pigs or any animal, even a light wound can be an issue for player characters. If left untreated it becomes infected quickly. Turning to a medium wound?!

A good chance for the medic or wanna-be medic to get involved!

Considering how much time characters spend searching for food and stuff to make fuel wild animal encounters should be part and parcel of any T2K campaign. Plus they offer great ways to work their way into campaigns as specific "adventurers" a la the Challenge Article that has been mentioned before

[.45cultist]

Feral hogs are leaner than their civilized cousins, less fat and longer looking legs and an odd appearance as a result. But even domestic animals can be interesting. I'm going to have a company that goes to farms with pigs to root and turn up land and geese to weed maturing crops as a no fuel ag alternative. They may get a contract to develop a farm crop for a cantonment or a colony. Keeping the non food critters safe from men and beasts might be assigned or contracted to the players.

[Raellus]

Feral hogs are leaner than their civilized cousins, less fat and longer looking legs and an odd appearance as a result. But even domestic animals can be interesting. I'm going to have a company that goes to farms with pigs to root and turn up land and geese to weed maturing crops as a no fuel ag alternative. They may get a contract to develop a farm crop for a cantonment or a colony. Keeping the non food critters safe from men and beasts might be assigned or contracted to the players.

Great idea. IRL, there's a company here in my neck of the woods that rents out goats- mostly to farmers- to weed fallow fields prior to planting. I've also heard that goats are great for "mowing" lawns.

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[Olefin]

Feral hogs are leaner than their civilized cousins, less fat and longer looking legs and an odd appearance as a result. But even domestic animals can be interesting. I'm going to have a company that goes to farms with pigs to root and turn up land and geese to weed maturing crops as a no fuel ag alternative. They may get a contract to develop a farm crop for a cantonment or a colony. Keeping the non food critters safe from men and beasts might be assigned or contracted to the players.

Also pig waste is being looked at as a way to make bio fuel - I know there experiments with it in the 80's as well as more modern efforts

https://projects.ncsu.edu/project/swine_extension/swinereports/2001/03manbrett.htm

https://www.thepigsite.com/articles/manure-to-energy-the-utah-project

[Raellus]

Also pig waste is being looked at as a way to make bio fuel - I know there experiments with it in the 80's as well as more modern efforts

It worked for Barter Town in Mad Max: Beyond Thunderdome (a very underrated entry in the franchise, IMHO, featuring some of the best world-building in post-apoc film).

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[Olefin]

It worked for Barter Town in Mad Max: Beyond Thunderdome (a very underrated entry in the franchise, IMHO, featuring some of the best world-building in post-apoc film).

-

I am very surprised that no one has ever done a Barter Town type sourcebook or module - and that method to produce fuel is realistic - and if you read the book adaption it mentions specifically how a lot of the trade was people bringing in various things for them to repurpose for use in the "new" world - i.e. it wasnt just fuel that was making that town important it was the various craftsmen and smiths that were there

[swaghauler]

I am very surprised that no one has ever done a Barter Town type sourcebook or module - and that method to produce fuel is realistic - and if you read the book adaption it mentions specifically how a lot of the trade was people bringing in various things for them to repurpose for use in the "new" world - i.e. it wasn't just fuel that was making that town important it was the various craftsmen and smiths that were there

Methane is VERY hard to liquify. It is about four times harder than Propane. Most of the Methane gas "Digestors" on farms are producing the gas and immediately burning it (like natural gas piped into your home) to make electricity, which is then dumped into the power grid. The Northwestern Rural Electric Cooperative here where I live in PA gets almost 20% of its power that way.

[swaghauler]

Ok, I can't resist since shark week just ended...:rolleyes:

https://youtu.be/hhmKfpKM8bw

[pmulcahy11b]

I am very surprised that no one has ever done a Barter Town type sourcebook or module - and that method to produce fuel is realistic - and if you read the book adaption it mentions specifically how a lot of the trade was people bringing in various things for them to repurpose for use in the "new" world - i.e. it wasnt just fuel that was making that town important it was the various craftsmen and smiths that were there

What about the Free City of Krakow?

[Olefin]

What about the Free City of Krakow?

Free City comes close - I was meaning more like the movie itself but not set in 2000 or 2001 - more like several more years in the future after civilization has really had a chance to break down even more (keep in mind what Sydney looked like by the time of Barter Town - we arent talking a couple of years after the start of the game timeline)

[mpipes]

Feral hogs are WAY different from farm animals and damn dangerous critters. A wild boar is both ill tampered and equipped with fair sized tusks. They can kill or seriously injure humans easy enough if they want to, not to mention the average dog, horse, or cow.

[.45cultist]

Methane is VERY hard to liquify. It is about four times harder than Propane. Most of the Methane gas "Digestors" on farms are producing the gas and immediately burning it (like natural gas piped into your home) to make electricity, which is then dumped into the power grid. The Northwestern Rural Electric Cooperative here where I live in PA gets almost 20% of its power that way.

Another point of interest for farms and communities.

[.45cultist]

Feral hogs are WAY different from farm animals and damn dangerous critters. A wild boar is both ill tampered and equipped with fair sized tusks. They can kill or seriously injure humans easy enough if they want to, not to mention the average dog, horse, or cow.

Yep! This is why they were real life monsters in the forests of Europe.

[Brit]

A wild boar is both ill tampered and equipped with fair sized tusks. They can kill or seriously injure humans easy enough if they want to, not to mention the average dog, horse, or cow.

Pop superstar Shakira says she was the victim of a random attack by a pair of wild boars while walking in a park in Barcelona with her eight-year-old son. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-58747464

[Raellus]

[I]Pop superstar Shakira says she was the victim of a random attack by a pair of wild boars while walking in a park in Barcelona with her eight-year-old son.

Whoa! When I woke up this morning, kind of groggy, for some weird reason, I thought about Shakira. I have no idea why. I'm not a fan and can't remember the last time I heard one of her songs. Weird. :confused:

On a slightly related note, here in southern Arizona, we have a critter called a Javelina. It looks like a boar, but it's not even a wild pig (it's a peccary). Anyway, they have terrible eyesight will sometimes attack humans if they feel threatened. It happens once every couple of months in the Tucson area. Javelinas have tusk-like canines that can tear right through clothing and flesh. They can do some damage, but I can't recall any fatalities (besides a few small dogs).

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[Brit]

AKA the Skunk Pig so cute!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peccary

[3catcircus]

It doesn't even need to be a large animal or a pack of smaller ones.

I've had players searching a home run into a dog (typically some relatively benign breed like a poodle or corgi) eating its now-deceased former owner - and that pup is now none-too-pleased to be interrupted at mealtime. The dichotomy of a small dog suddenly launching itself with extreme violence at a PC, resulting in the need to shoot poor little Muffy...

Somebody that the PCs are either trying to avoid or surprise is going to hear the gunshot.

[Raellus]

It doesn't even need to be a large animal or a pack of smaller ones.

I've had players searching a home run into a dog (typically some relatively benign breed like a poodle or corgi) eating its now-deceased former owner - and that pup is now none-too-pleased to be interrupted at mealtime. The dichotomy of a small dog suddenly launching itself with extreme violence at a PC, resulting in the need to shoot poor little Muffy...

Somebody that the PCs are either trying to avoid or surprise is going to hear the gunshot.

Reminds me a bit of the Rabbit of Caerbannog scene in Monty Python & the Holy Grail. :D

Agree with your point. A single, small critter with rabies still poses a deadly threat to PCs.

AKA the Skunk Pig so cute!

They are definitely ugly-cute, IMHO. And you really can smell a pack coming if you're downwind of them.

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[3catcircus]

Reminds me a bit of the Rabbit of Caerbannog scene in Monty Python & the Holy Grail. :D

Agree with your point. A single, small critter with rabies still poses a deadly threat to PCs.



They are definitely ugly-cute, IMHO. And you really can smell a pack coming if you're downwind of them.

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After the last 12 months of raising a labradoodle from the age of 12 weeks, and seeing how she isn't mean, she's just crazy (she's a people person who, if you let her, literally greets you at the door by standing on two legs, slapping her paws on your shoulders, and demanding chin scratches), I could easily see an animal encounter gone wrong - accidentally shooting the pet of the NPC you are trying to find.

[pmulcahy11b]

Whoa! When I woke up this morning, kind of groggy, for some weird reason, I thought about Shakira. I have no idea why. I'm not a fan and can't remember the last time I heard one of her songs. Weird. :confused:
-

She's supremo hot -- maybe that's why.

Anyway, to stay on topic, what about a swarm of killer bees or murder hornets -- how would you stat that?

[Raellus]

Anyway, to stay on topic, what about a swarm of killer bees or murder hornets -- how would you stat that?

Great call! We have Killer Bees here in S. AZ. Thankfully, no Murder Hornets... yet. We also have a couple of species of scorpions, variety of rattlesnakes, and Gila Monsters, all venomous. The rest of CONUS has its fair share of dangerous reptiles and insects. It'd be a pretty cool resource to have stat blocs for them. Anyone looking for a T2k-related project?

I would venture to say that most T2k campaigns take place in Europe. AFAIK, there aren't a lot of venomous critters native to that particularly continent, especially in the central part where a lot of T2k action takes place. Have Africanized bees made their way to Europe yet?

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[mpipes]

After the last 12 months of raising a labradoodle from the age of 12 weeks, and seeing how she isn't mean, she's just crazy (she's a people person who, if you let her, literally greets you at the door by standing on two legs, slapping her paws on your shoulders, and demanding chin scratches), I could easily see an animal encounter gone wrong - accidentally shooting the pet of the NPC you are trying to find.

Even worse, you kill the adored pet of an assassin, who tracks the team with the goal to kill each and everyone.

Sounds like a movie!

[mpipes]

There is an even worse scenario that dawned on me.

The group encounters a sick bat, and one of the characters manages to get bitten. That triggers an emergency, high priority quest to track down a viable rabies treatment protocol in their current predicament.

[pmulcahy11b]

After the last 12 months of raising a labradoodle from the age of 12 weeks, and seeing how she isn't mean, she's just crazy (she's a people person who, if you let her, literally greets you at the door by standing on two legs, slapping her paws on your shoulders, and demanding chin scratches), I could easily see an animal encounter gone wrong - accidentally shooting the pet of the NPC you are trying to find.

I had a Black Lab/Great Dane about 30 years ago who sounds just like her! Except -- 125 pounds...

[.45cultist]

My pet Vietnamese Pot-Bellied pig, Princess bangs on the door making horrible noises wanting her dinner. It sounds horrible and a city slicker wouldn't know what is behind the door!

[3catcircus]

I had a Black Lab/Great Dane about 30 years ago who sounds just like her! Except -- 125 pounds...

I think I'll stick with Cammie at 65 lbs. She's strong enough that my wife and daughter can't really walk her when her nose is on something. The nose follows the scent, the dog follows the nose, and if you begin walking, she assumes you'll keep up... No problem when you stop as she'll just sit and wait, but when she's walking, it's at a fast pace.

And with the pandemic, meeting new people has been tough, resulting in her assuming that *everyone* she sees when we're on a walk absolutely wants her to run over and say hello.

[.45cultist]

I think I'll stick with Cammie at 65 lbs. She's strong enough that my wife and daughter can't really walk her when her nose is on something. The nose follows the scent, the dog follows the nose, and if you begin walking, she assumes you'll keep up... No problem when you stop as she'll just sit and wait, but when she's walking, it's at a fast pace.

And with the pandemic, meeting new people has been tough, resulting in her assuming that *everyone* she sees when we're on a walk absolutely wants her to run over and say hello.

Pigs are like dog sized bulldozers and require one to child proof their home, but I love them. When I get a dog again, I plan on one raised to not harm the pigs and poultry.

[pmulcahy11b]

Another critter among the same vein as killer bees (more properly called Africanized Honeybees) is fire ants. Here in South Texas, they are responsible for the deaths of many pets and even some little kids. Some adults also get heavily stung or killed, often by mowing the grass. CPS workers are very careful when servicing electrical equipment; fire ants love to make nests in those places (a note to Scroungers in a T2K setting).

[3catcircus]

Another critter among the same vein as killer bees (more properly called Africanized Honeybees) is fire ants. Here in South Texas, they are responsible for the deaths of many pets and even some little kids. Some adults also get heavily stung or killed, often by mowing the grass. CPS workers are very careful when servicing electrical equipment; fire ants love to make nests in those places (a note to Scroungers in a T2K setting).

Encountered them when I lived in Florida. They wait until they've covered your unsuspecting foot then sting altogether at the same time. Luckily jumping in the pool made quick work of them, as did boiling water poured down their nest.

[Raellus]

Rats have long been viewed as dangerous to humans, and not without reason, but rats can also help them. Here's a positive animal encounter idea:

https://www.apopo.org/en/what-we-do/detecting-landmines-and-explosives?gclid=CjwKCAjw2P-KBhByEiwADBYWCuxduy21u-xkgKD9jrTpuMXXqRIgs7DwjkKzAsIe-GlcNdcCV9TNtRoCf-0QAvD_BwE

The locales where this appears to be going on are somewhat exotic, by T2k standards, but perhaps some enterprising Pole (or other nationality) could start their own rat-assisted mine-detection enterprise.

Credit to my teenage daughter for bringing this to my attention.

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[.45cultist]

Encountered them when I lived in Florida. They wait until they've covered your unsuspecting foot then sting altogether at the same time. Luckily jumping in the pool made quick work of them, as did boiling water poured down their nest.

All ants seem to like the 60HZ cycle of electronic stuff.

[Brit]

"Barcelona tackles roaming wild boar problem".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-59352740

[Matt Wiser]

Call me a reluctant cat guy. Oh, I love dogs, and do want a Golden Lab in time, but my last two pets have been cats. Unfortunately, I live in a rural area, and outdoor cats and coyotes do not mix....Yet the last cat lived for twelve years in an area with a lot of coyotes. He just didn't see 13.

Here's a very rare animal encounter you could use... Whether one's party is in the Pacific NW, the Sierras or SoCal Mountains, Florida/Georgia, East Texas/Louisiana, Ohio, the Appalachians, Rockies, or anyplace swampy/wooded/mountainous. Bigfoot, Sasquatch, Grassman, Skunk Ape, the Fouke Monster, or whatever you want to call him/it. The Skunk Ape was in Urban Guerilla (but no stats provided), if you'll recall. With human numbers reduced, their numbers might increase slightly, so the chances of encountering one would be increased, especially if one's party or the community they are located does a lot of deer or other hunting. Or you're camped in an area where a BF considers it to be his territory, and he sure doesn't want you there!

What do you fellows think?

[.45cultist]

Call me a reluctant cat guy. Oh, I love dogs, and do want a Golden Lab in time, but my last two pets have been cats. Unfortunately, I live in a rural area, and outdoor cats and coyotes do not mix....Yet the last cat lived for twelve years in an area with a lot of coyotes. He just didn't see 13.

Here's a very rare animal encounter you could use... Whether one's party is in the Pacific NW, the Sierras or SoCal Mountains, Florida/Georgia, East Texas/Louisiana, Ohio, the Appalachians, Rockies, or anyplace swampy/wooded/mountainous. Bigfoot, Sasquatch, Grassman, Skunk Ape, the Fouke Monster, or whatever you want to call him/it. The Skunk Ape was in Urban Guerilla (but no stats provided), if you'll recall. With human numbers reduced, their numbers might increase slightly, so the chances of encountering one would be increased, especially if one's party or the community they are located does a lot of deer or other hunting. Or you're camped in an area where a BF considers it to be his territory, and he sure doesn't want you there!

What do you fellows think?

Yes, for most homestead animals, coyotes are horrible pests.

[Raellus]

What do you fellows think?

In the draft stage, I suggested to Tegyrius that he add a Sasquatch encounter option to his amazing Pacific Northwest Sourcebook, but I think he thought it would be too hokey or seem out of place. AFAIK, it didn't make into the final draft.

I think it would be interesting/funny for a campaign "bigfoot" to end up actually being a recluse wearing an ape suit (probably trying to keep strangers out of his territory).

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[Tegyrius]

I considered it, but the book was already so big that I didn't want to shoehorn any more in there.

To do the Pacific Northwest's supernatural landscape true justice, I would've also needed to cover its UFO history, the profound weirdness of Crater Lake, the PNW's high number of unexplained wilderness disappearances, several distinct water monsters, and the Pacific Northwest tree octopus.

- C.

[.45cultist]

I considered it, but the book was already so big that I didn't want to shoehorn any more in there.

To do the Pacific Northwest's supernatural landscape true justice, I would've also needed to cover its UFO history, the profound weirdness of Crater Lake, the PNW's high number of unexplained wilderness disappearances, several distinct water monsters, and the Pacific Northwest tree octopus.

- C.

So enough for another "Twilight Nightmares" book.

[Brit]

the Pacific Northwest tree octopus. - C.

What!

It's on The Internet! It must be true!

https://zapatopi.net/treeoctopus/

[Tegyrius]

So enough for another "Twilight Nightmares" book.

Perhaps. A quarter-century of World of Darkness work makes me think I could do a decent job of it. I'm not sure it would sell enough to justify a commercial release, though, and I have several other things in the hopper that I think would sell better and be received better.

(Sales in this market and to this audience being, of course, relative. As of right now, Pacific Northwest has moved 363 copies, the majority of those sales occurring within the first month of its release. By comparison, the best-selling print project on which I was the solo or primary author was the revised edition of Clanbook: Assamite. That sold out two print runs of 10,000 copies each over its lifetime. But the market at the turn of the millennium was entirely different, and I was an entirely different writer then.)

(The original Twilight Nightmares ranked in the bottom 40% of GDW's customer opinion survey. The print run was 7,113 copies. On DriveThru, it's a gold seller - between 501 and 1,000 copies.)

(Edits: Grammar, clarity, and more parentheses.)

- C.

[rcaf_777]

what about snake bites?

[pmulcahy11b]

In the draft stage, I suggested to Tegyrius that he add a Sasquatch encounter option to his amazing Pacific Northwest Sourcebook,

-

My personal opinion is that, while 90% of Sasquatch (or what it's called in different parts of the country) sighting or photos are bogus/something the person thought they were but wasn't, but I think that the Sasquatch is a real creature, which is adept at hiding from and avoiding us humans. Though I think there are few legitimate sightings, Sasquatch is a real creature that is out there.

I don't think Sasquatch is related to humans, however. A more likely ancestor is Gigantopithicus, greatly evolved.

[pmulcahy11b]

what about snake bites?

That's a good one. I don't think the BYB or even my site handles this very well.

[pmulcahy11b]

Call me a reluctant cat guy. Oh, I love dogs, and do want a Golden Lab in time,

If your idea of a Golden Lab is the same as mine (a Golden Retriever/Lab mix), I had one until about three years ago, when he died at the age of 13 of liver cancer. If indeed you and I are talking about the same thing, the
AKC has recognized this as a distinct breed (though the official name is a Goldador -- a ridiculous name in my opinion -- Golden Lab would have a much better official name. They take a lot of upkeep because thay have a shorter version of the Golden's coat, and monthly trips to the groomer are a must.

I've had a lot of dogs, but Sam is one of those that I miss the most.

[pmulcahy11b]

Encountered them when I lived in Florida. They wait until they've covered your unsuspecting foot then sting altogether at the same time. Luckily jumping in the pool made quick work of them, as did boiling water poured down their nest.

The CPS and Cable company workers in San Antonio and Bexar County generally carry multiple cans of really, really strong inset killing spray.

Note that I didn't say insect repellent. Their spray is designed to kill fire ants and some other insects on contact.

[pmulcahy11b]

Rats have long been viewed as dangerous to humans, and not without reason, but rats can also help them. Here's a positive animal encounter idea:

https://www.apopo.org/en/what-we-do/detecting-landmines-and-explosives?gclid=CjwKCAjw2P-KBhByEiwADBYWCuxduy21u-xkgKD9jrTpuMXXqRIgs7DwjkKzAsIe-GlcNdcCV9TNtRoCf-0QAvD_BwE

The locales where this appears to be going on are somewhat exotic, by T2k standards, but perhaps some enterprising Pole (or other nationality) could start their own rat-assisted mine-detection enterprise.

Credit to my teenage daughter for bringing this to my attention.

-

African Pouched Rats are excellent for mine detection. They are bigger than most rats and have more endurance, and their brain-to-weight is better than your standard rat and their convolutions in their brain are deeper. As a result, they are also much smarter and more easily trainable than your average rat. And though they are a rather large rat, they are still light enough that they can sit on antipersonnel mines and not trigger them and brush up against of cross tripwires without triggering them either.

[.45cultist]

During my research, I've found there are several pig adoption farms around the country. A good scenario for civilians might be the relocation and evacuation of these to prevent their destruction and consumption. I was going to mention such an operation in my material as background filler. a convoy of biodiesel or alcohol trucks. The pigs might be abandoned minis, Pot-Bellies or full sized
heritage breeds or a mix of sizes. given their easily spooked natures and meat starved men, a small adventure to just get them to safety can be had.

[unipus]

The CPS and Cable company workers in San Antonio and Bexar County generally carry multiple cans of really, really strong inset killing spray.

Note that I didn't say insect repellent. Their spray is designed to kill fire ants and some other insects on contact.

I was volunteering on a clean-up crew in Texas after Hurricane Harvey. We got to this widow's house. Her husband had apparently been a hell of a mechanic/engineer -- place had a gigantic car garage with lifts and all. It also had a workshop in a totally separate structure, which had seen the worst of the flooding. We opened it up and there was just buzzing. The whole place had become a hornets nest.

A certain ex-Navy SEAL I was working with who has somehow gone on to be a notable politician said "NOPE" and wouldn't go in there until he had pieced together a spray-can flamethrower followed quickly behind by some serious high-power spray insecticide. It was a long afternoon.

[Heffe]

what about snake bites?

This depends so heavily on what part of the country you're in and what kind of snake bites you. I used to research this a bit when I was into back-country backpacking when I was younger.

In the southwest US where I live, the most common and dangerous type of snake is one of a few species of rattlesnake (Mojave and Western Diamondback in the far southwest afaik). A bite from those can have some pretty serious, and even fatal effects. From my understanding (at least what I was always told growing up), the babies are far more dangerous than the adults, as they don't have the same capacity to regulate the amount of venom they inject, and just give a full dose on every bite.

A bite from an adult rattlesnake usually has one of four effects, all about equal in chance (maybe do a 1D4 roll for in-game purposes). The snake either injects no venom, a little venom, a medium amount of venom, or a lot of venom. A bite with no venom isn't an issue at all outside of a couple of small punctures at the site of the bite. A little venom is going to suck for the person bit, as they'll experience some combination of lightheadedness, sweating, some weakness, a little nausea, swelling at the site of the bite, and just general discomfort. If the bitee gets a significant dose, things escalate with shortness of breath and difficulty breathing (often due to swelling), likely more vomiting, blurred vision, etc. If the rattler injects a full dose, the victim's life will be in jeopardy, with worse versions of all of the above symptoms, along with possible long term organ damage (parts of the victim's intestines dying, eventually going septic, etc) and even death.

I'd say that if you get bit with one of the first 3 types, chances are you'll live with varying amounts of discomfort over the following days/weeks (or even months if it was a strong bite) without any treatment. With the strongest bites, the victim will almost certainly live so long as they receive treatment at a hospital and possible antivenin dose - without treatment, I'm not sure what the chance of death is, but it's probably at least somewhat significant.

Interesting fact that I just learned, for most rattlesnake bites in the US, the recommended course of action for hospitals is to give the victim some Antihistamines (Benedryl) and monitor them for 24 hours. Often that and pain relievers are enough to stave off some of the worst immediate effects. If it isn't, then they'll proceed with the course of antivenin.

Finally, an obscure adage from fellow hikers in the southwest - "When hiking in single file, try to never be the third person in line. Because if you come across a sleeping rattlesnake, the first person in line is going to wake it up. The second will piss it off. And it'll bite whoever's in third."

edit: As an added bonus, Rattlesnakes can grow to be fairly long - I've seen a couple of larger ones that were 6ft or longer. Throw some spices on em and toss em on a bbq, they also make for a pretty decent meal - If memory serves, they taste somewhat like chicken (doesn't everything) but with some small fish-like bones.

[ChalkLine]

Snakes are fascinating things.

When I was in Tasmania (southernmost Australia) the wildlife guy came around and explained the snake we'd inadvertently antagonised to the point it was almost sending us nasty e-mails.

Because it was so cold it had tried a 'dry bite' at us. This is where the snake doesn't load up its fangs with venom, and it does this because loading those fangs is very energy-intensive for Mr Snake. This is a sort of 'bugger off' bite that still uses a lot of energy but not as much as a toxic bite.

Because my idiot mate was so tired he then actually stepped on the snake while I was warning him about it so the snake then loaded up a full venom-load and bit him on his work boot. Now he's got the problem where he's got one of the most poisonous creatures on the planet biting him and can't take his foot off it in case it goes even more ballistic. Luckily our local snake wrangler, mandated by government policy, was right there.

So he grabs the snake, tosses it in the snake bag and then shows us the snake is literally dying in front of our eyes it had so little energy left. At this point I found out that biologists are absolute lunatics because he went over to his truck, put the heater on and let the snake out in the cab. When I in horror asked him where the hell he'd expect the snake to be after that he replied "usually under the seat or wrapped around the steering column", strongly implying the nutter has done this more than once. After ten minutes he nabbed it with his snake-grabbers and took it down to the creek and let it go.

I have hundreds of snake stories of which this is just one.

[Raellus]

I'm not even going to try to top that story, Chalk!

Rattlesnake encounters are so common here in S. Arizona that the fire department will no longer handle snake removals, unless the snake is inside the home. We citizens are left our own devices when a snake is encountered in a garage or yard.

I used to live on an acre in the sticks. I had two small kids back then. If a rattler got into our yard, and wouldn't leave, I killed it (usually with a shovel). Birdshot literally disintegrates snakes. Don't ask me how I know that. I almost always felt guilty, afterwards, though. Those snakes were just living their rattler lives, and our homestead was built on their turf. I've not deliberately killed a rattler since we moved back into town.

I currently live in a relatively new subdivision on the current northwest edge of the city. We thought moving closer to the city would be the end of our rattlesnake encounters. Not so. Investing in some snake fencing for the back yard helped, but one still got in somehow. We've had so many rattlers on our property over the past six years that I invested in a snake stick ($25 on Amazon a couple of years ago). I've removed at least half-dozen of the little blighters, the most recent reptilian intruder being just a few weeks ago (from my front driveway, right by a garage door). I should be used to it by now, but it's still extremely nerve wracking. That rattle triggers an atavistic fear response (in me, at least). My wife even stepped on one in my backyard, but it didn't strike (or even rattle). I thanked the merciful snake by removing it as gently as possible.

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[Matt Wiser]

Had that happen to me-INSIDE THE BLOODY HOUSE. It was a rattler, and a baby one at that. How it got in, I have no idea. Wound up calling 911, and they said to call a snake recovery outfit that's 45 miles away! Said OK, but then called someone a LOT closer; the chief of our local Volunteer FD. He was here in five minutes. He got the snake, threw it into a black trash bag, and turned it into a good snake: he put the bag with snake inside behind one of the tires on his truck and ran over it. Twice. Threw what was left over the fence for the coyotes or raccoons.

[Targan]

Snakes are fascinating things.I have hundreds of snake stories of which this is just one.

As we both know, highly venomous snakes are just part of life across most of Australia. Including in suburbia. When I was a kid most second-or-more generation Australian parents would teach their kids common sense precautions.

[ChalkLine]

As we both know, highly venomous snakes are just part of life across most of Australia. Including in suburbia. When I was a kid most second-or-more generation Australian parents would teach their kids common sense precautions.

Yep. I find it astounding when people mess with snakes. When you're a little kid in Oz you get the mantra of "if you leave the snake alone it will leave you alone".

We had some guys on the pipeline that were the kind of people that of they saw wildlife they had to try and kill it. Of course down here you're messing with something far better at killing (and probably in this case smarter) than you are

[.45cultist]

This depends so heavily on what part of the country you're in and what kind of snake bites you. I used to research this a bit when I was into back-country backpacking when I was younger.

In the southwest US where I live, the most common and dangerous type of snake is one of a few species of rattlesnake (Mojave and Western Diamondback in the far southwest afaik). A bite from those can have some pretty serious, and even fatal effects. From my understanding (at least what I was always told growing up), the babies are far more dangerous than the adults, as they don't have the same capacity to regulate the amount of venom they inject, and just give a full dose on every bite.

A bite from an adult rattlesnake usually has one of four effects, all about equal in chance (maybe do a 1D4 roll for in-game purposes). The snake either injects no venom, a little venom, a medium amount of venom, or a lot of venom. A bite with no venom isn't an issue at all outside of a couple of small punctures at the site of the bite. A little venom is going to suck for the person bit, as they'll experience some combination of lightheadedness, sweating, some weakness, a little nausea, swelling at the site of the bite, and just general discomfort. If the bitee gets a significant dose, things escalate with shortness of breath and difficulty breathing (often due to swelling), likely more vomiting, blurred vision, etc. If the rattler injects a full dose, the victim's life will be in jeopardy, with worse versions of all of the above symptoms, along with possible long term organ damage (parts of the victim's intestines dying, eventually going septic, etc) and even death.

I'd say that if you get bit with one of the first 3 types, chances are you'll live with varying amounts of discomfort over the following days/weeks (or even months if it was a strong bite) without any treatment. With the strongest bites, the victim will almost certainly live so long as they receive treatment at a hospital and possible antivenin dose - without treatment, I'm not sure what the chance of death is, but it's probably at least somewhat significant.

Interesting fact that I just learned, for most rattlesnake bites in the US, the recommended course of action for hospitals is to give the victim some Antihistamines (Benedryl) and monitor them for 24 hours. Often that and pain relievers are enough to stave off some of the worst immediate effects. If it isn't, then they'll proceed with the course of antivenin.

Finally, an obscure adage from fellow hikers in the southwest - "When hiking in single file, try to never be the third person in line. Because if you come across a sleeping rattlesnake, the first person in line is going to wake it up. The second will piss it off. And it'll bite whoever's in third."

edit: As an added bonus, Rattlesnakes can grow to be fairly long - I've seen a couple of larger ones that were 6ft or longer. Throw some spices on em and toss em on a bbq, they also make for a pretty decent meal - If memory serves, they taste somewhat like chicken (doesn't everything) but with some small fish-like bones.

In Missouri they found a 9ft/ 60lb Diamond back at a park a few years back. Experts said it was strong enough to break a thigh bone even if the fangs missed! A snake that size or larger like a King Cobra might actually need to get a melee strike impact damage as well.

[Raellus]

Military-trained dolphins could make for an interesting nautical encounter (especially one that got loose and was no longer under "orders").

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/43827/assassin-dolphin-hamas-says-it-caught-continues-tradition-of-wild-claims-about-israels-animal-spies

The article includes links to similar US and Russian programs.

In the William Gibson short story, Johnny Mnemonic, there's a supporting character who is a sentient dolphin veteran of WWIII.

[Vespers War]

About fifteen years or so ago a friend's wife was killed in Florida by a pygmy rattlesnake. She was trimming bushes when it bit, it only hit with one fang and she never saw it, and the bite was misdiagnosed as a wasp sting. The dusky pygmy rattlesnake is one of six venomous snakes in Florida, the others being the eastern diamondback rattlesnake, timber rattlesnake, cottonmouth, copperhead, and coral snake.

In thirty years of living in Florida the only venomous snake I ran across was a coral snake, and that only once (I got a photo from a respectful distance and sent it to a herpetologist friend because I wasn't sure if it was coral or king). They're pretty timid and their fangs aren't directly connected to the venom duct, so they typically have to chew on things a bit in order to inject venom. Bites are rare enough that the antivenin stopped being made a few years ago because it wasn't being used (although checking up on that, apparently production resumed last year).

[Raellus]

What self-respecting T2k Ref hasn't thrown a pack of feral dogs at their PC's at least once in a campaign?

Canines are amazing survivors, and might even thrive in the post-apocalyptic world. The dogs of Chernobyl seem to prove this.

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2023/03/chernobyl-dog-radiation-exposure-genome-research/673273/

This may have been brought up here before (I've neglected to look back through this thread before posting), but has anyone ever included a canine NPC in their campaign?

4e has a stat block for Wild Dogs which includes skills (Mobility B, Close Combat C, Recon A), so it shouldn't be too hard to run a military or police working dog (maybe bump Close Combat to B?) in that edition.

Thoughts?

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[Raellus]

From Twitter:

"In Donbass, Ukraine, the once domestic and now feral pig population is booming at an alarming rate."

The video shows a herd of supposedly feral pigs fleeing a UAF SPAG.

https://twitter.com/intermarium24/status/1637759369944223747?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1637759369944223747%7Ctwgr% 5E35d7657ee74e07c63711fb7bea8694b2114792f8%7Ctwcon %5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thedrive.com%2Fthe-war-zone%2Fukraine-situation-report-explosions-rock-russian-occupied-crimea

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[kcdusk]

I once had a dog in a DnD game i was in. It turned out how you'd expect. I protected and cared for the dog more than i cared for the other PCs in the game.

Animal encounters can be a bonus to characters. Feral pigs can provide a quick fun encounter, picture a team building exercise chasing them down through bog pits. While also providing much needed food.

A snake encounter can give the medic a chance to step in and be valued.

A bear or other more dangerous encounter can force a group to march further through the night to avoid them, adding to fatigue, or forcing them into an encounter earlier than they wanted.

Even a simple bird encounter. A bird loudly taking flight. Did the PC scare them, possibly giving away their own position, will anyone notice? Or did an enemy NPC group scare that bird?

[chico20854]

Animal encounters can be a bonus to characters. Feral pigs can provide a quick fun encounter, picture a team building exercise chasing them down through bog pits. While also providing much needed food.

A snake encounter can give the medic a chance to step in and be valued.

A bear or other more dangerous encounter can force a group to march further through the night to avoid them, adding to fatigue, or forcing them into an encounter earlier than they wanted.

Even a simple bird encounter. A bird loudly taking flight. Did the PC scare them, possibly giving away their own position, will anyone notice? Or did an enemy NPC group scare that bird?

Once upon a time I was on guard duty with a buddy, middle of the night on an exercise. He heard something, I told him it was just an animal, he was sure it was the OPFOR coming to attack. He sounds the alarm, wakes up the entire company. First Shirt comes running over "What's going on men???". Top goes to investigate, an armadillo runs off into the bushes.

Buddy was less than popular the next day....

[pmulcahy11b]

What self-respecting T2k Ref hasn't thrown a pack of feral dogs at their PC's at least once in a campaign?



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Dogs? Never!!

I love dogs too much -- I'd never want to see them hurt, even in game play.

Feral pigs, rabid bears, angry deer, I've used all of those and more. But never dogs!

[Raellus]

If Central Europe's boars are this radioactive, IRL, imagine how much more radioactive they'd be c.2000.

https://www.science.org/content/article/germany-s-radioactive-boars-are-bristly-reminder-nuclear-fallout

It'd probably be a good idea for hunters to equip themselves with Geiger counters.

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[.45cultist]

About fifteen years or so ago a friend's wife was killed in Florida by a pygmy rattlesnake. She was trimming bushes when it bit, it only hit with one fang and she never saw it, and the bite was misdiagnosed as a wasp sting. The dusky pygmy rattlesnake is one of six venomous snakes in Florida, the others being the eastern diamondback rattlesnake, timber rattlesnake, cottonmouth, copperhead, and coral snake.

In thirty years of living in Florida the only venomous snake I ran across was a coral snake, and that only once (I got a photo from a respectful distance and sent it to a herpetologist friend because I wasn't sure if it was coral or king). They're pretty timid and their fangs aren't directly connected to the venom duct, so they typically have to chew on things a bit in order to inject venom. Bites are rare enough that the antivenin stopped being made a few years ago because it wasn't being used (although checking up on that, apparently production resumed last year).

And the small rattle snake make a buzz, it does sound like the big boys.

[Ursus Maior]

If Central Europe's boars are this radioactive, IRL, imagine how much more radioactive they'd be c.2000.

https://www.science.org/content/article/germany-s-radioactive-boars-are-bristly-reminder-nuclear-fallout

It'd probably be a good idea for hunters to equip themselves with Geiger counters.

-

If one looks at the fallout patterns, it's really a limited problem in actual history. However, the problem is literally dying out. Boars usually die of bullets around here, but those kept in wildlife reserves can reach ages beyond 20 years old. So the population of boars suffering from primary fallout radiation is gone by now.

The problem are indeed the, however, the mentioned mushrooms. Those seem to retain the irradiation for much longer than previously thought, irradiating wildlife - and especially boars - that feeds on them.

Consequently, Twilight mushrooms would do the same, but on a much grander scale, since fallout is and was ubiquitous in the Twilight Universe. This would mean that not only hunters and their customers would have to be aware of boars and their irradiation. Additionally to the boars, their favorite food, mushrooms, would also irradiate those who feed on them, including humans. The problem was well known in the immediate post-Chernobyl phase in Bavaria, where harvesting mushrooms was warned against.

The news here is that the problem would still be existant after almost 40 years. That is something which referees could include in their games.

[Homer]

A couple of ideas for animal encounters:

1. Have a boar or horse trigger a mine/trip flare. Especially if your party is in the habit of leaving them without an overwatching OP/LP. They’ll either spend time patrolling and reacting, or start putting out OP/LPs. Could also be used by a wily enemy or PC to clear the way for a raid, etc.

2. Waterfowl and Guinea hens, make great natural burglar alarms. A roosting flock of them are great to work into the setup of a scenario: was that a fox or a raiding party that spooked them?

3. Pigs, dogs, and birds will all find their way to corpses and the immobilized. You can play up atmosphere by having PCs listen to the sound of pigs or dogs tussling over enemy dead all night.

4. Any large animal in moving fast in heavy cover is going to make some noise. Always good for a chance contact to break up the monotony of two legged encounters.

[Raellus]

As if life on the front line weren't hard enough...

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/ukraine-situation-report-deluge-of-rodents-a-common-enemy

Reminds me a bit of D&D's rat swarms.

They get into rations, chew cables, seek warmth in vehicle engines/exhaust systems, and somehow even manage to ruin artillery charges! Worst of all, they have the potential to spread disease.

Makes me think that soldiers in the T2kU would be quick to adopt mousers (eg cats, terriers, ferrets, and possibly birds of prey) to help deal with rodent infestations.

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