RPG Forums

RPG Forums (https://forum.juhlin.com/index.php)
-   Twilight 2000 Forum (https://forum.juhlin.com/forumdisplay.php?f=3)
-   -   2nd Marine Division - Norther Poland (https://forum.juhlin.com/showthread.php?t=2479)

Fusilier 05-02-2011 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HorseSoldier (Post 33559)
circa 2000 I'd picture the rear echelon of the Marine divisions as just being a jumble of sailors and marines filling out necessary support functions as best they can. Probably with some drafts of USN volunteers (or "volun-tolds") pushed into front line units as well as replacement riflemen or whatever really late in the war.

I agree, but I think not just some being pushed up as combat arms replacements, but quite a lot. With most of the true marines dead, captured, deserted, separated, etc, I can see a lot of navy guys needing to be put out on the line - earlier than 2000 too.

James Langham 05-02-2011 11:23 AM

Cadet Brigade
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fusilier (Post 33577)
I agree, but I think not just some being pushed up as combat arms replacements, but quite a lot. With most of the true marines dead, captured, deserted, separated, etc, I can see a lot of navy guys needing to be put out on the line - earlier than 2000 too.

Checking the American Combat Vehicle Handbook (2.0) the Cadet Brigade of USAF trainees in January 1988 (I assume this is a typo and should read 1998). It is noted that this is theoretically an Air Force unit that is under army control. This would imply that the other services are being weeded of excess personnel earlier than we thought.

Legbreaker 05-02-2011 04:40 PM

We know that in mid to late 1997 Nato was being pushed back across Europe almost in a rout. We know from a variety of sources that they suffered extensive loss of manpower and equipment during this period. We know they used scorched earth tactics as they retreated.
We also know that the "last major naval fleet in being" was destroyed in June 1997 and that air power on both sides coped an absolute hammering in the early stages of the war.
Given that and the commencement of nuclear attacks in approximately July 1997, it's certainly no surprise that naval and air personnel were transfered/reorganised into ground assets.

Legbreaker 07-10-2012 06:09 PM

Rough draft
 
What follows is the result of about 200 hours of research, organisation, reorganisation, hair pulling and culling to get down to the 4,000 men listed as of the 1st of July 2000. There's still about another 50 hours of work to go before I'm happy.

Many units were cut completely and personnel redistributed to other units. A vast number of supporting units simply disappear as they're no longer needed (no supplies coming from the US for them to deal with). Many of the marines would have to take on the responsibilities of 2 or even 3 men (or more) in the prewar organisation - good thing the 2000 version of the 2nd Marines is a mere shadow of it's former power.

It's been a real shock to see just how many men are in the background - the 2nd Force Service Support Group has an authorised strength of approximately 7,600, and they don't even get CLOSE to the front lines!

2nd MARDIV
HQ Battalion 100 men

2nd Intelligence Battalion 40 men, 1x FQM-151 Pointer UAV
Headquarters Company
Counterintelligence/Human Intelligence Company (CI/HUMINT Coy)
Production & Analysis Company
Counterintelligence Support Company

8th Communication Battalion (inc. surviving personnel from 2nd Radio Battalion) 60 men

2nd Air Naval Gunfire Liaison Coy – disbanded. Surviving personnel transferred 10th Regiment

2nd Tank Battalion 80 men, 8 M1

2nd Light Armoured Recon Battalion 152 men total
H&S Company (Striker) 1x M-1042A2 Humvee, 1x M-939 5 tonne truck, 10 men
Alpha Company (Apache) 8x LAV-25, 48 men
Bravo Company (Black Knights) 7x LAV-25, 47 men
Charlie Company (Gunfighters) 7x LAV-25, 47 men

2nd Recon Battalion 160 men
H&S Company 20, M-1042A2
Alpha Company 40
Bravo Company 40
Charlie Company 40
Force Reconnaissance Company 20, LKW Wolf IFAV, M-1044A1 Humvee

2nd Combat Engineer Battalion 200 men
Headquarters & Service Company (including surviving Chemical Biological Incident Response Force members) 40 men, M-1042A2,
Engineer Support Company 40
Alpha Company 40
Mobility Assault Company 40
Route Clearance Company 40

2nd Assault Amphibian Battalion (218 men, 40 AAVP-7A1, 2 AAVC-7A1, 2 AAVR-7A1)
Headquarters & Services Company 4+20 men, 2 AAVP-7A1
Alpha Company
HQ sec 2+14, 2xAAVC-7A1
Comms sec 7 (rides with HQ sec)
Assault amphibian general support section 13 men, 1 AAVP-7A1
Command & control section 12 men, 1 AAVP-7A1
Maintenance section 1+28 men, 2 AAVR-7A1 ARV
Assault amphibian vehicle platoons x3 1+38 men, 12 AAVP-7A1
Other companies disbanded

2nd Low Altitude Air Defence Battalion 42 men
Battalion Headquarters
HQ section 2+1, M-1042A2
Logistics section 1+3+1, 1x M1097 + trailer
1st Battery 34 men
Battery HQ 1+3, 1 M-1044A1
1 Platoon – Avenger 10
Section HQ 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 1 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 2 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 3 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 4 2 men, 1 Avenger
2 Platoon – guns 20
Section HQ 3 men, M1097, twin M61 Vulcan, mounted
Team 5 4 men, M1097, M167 VADS, towed
Team 6 3 men, M1097, 20mm FK 20-2, mounted
Team 7 4 men, M1097, M167 VADS, towed
Team 8 4 men, M1097, 23mm ZUR-23-2S Jod, towed
Team 9 2 men, M1097, twin M61 Vulcan, mounted

2nd Marine Regiment (740 men)
HQ Coy 2nd Marines 66 men, M-1042A2
1/2nd Battalion 24 Officers + 313 Enlisted =337 men
H&S Company (aka BHQ) (6+31), M-1042A2
HQ Plt (4+6)
Comms Plt (5)
Service Plt (1+9), 2x M-939 5 tonne truck
Scout Plt (8)
Medical Plt (1+3)
Alpha Company 6+94 men
CHQ 2+4 men, 1 Humvee + trailer
1 Plt 1+25 men
2 Plt 1+25 men
3 Plt 1+25 men
Weapons Plt (1x 81mm Mortar, 1x .50 cal M2HB, 1x SMAW or Dragon) 1+15 men, 1 Humvee + trailer
Bravo Company
CHQ 2+4 men, 1 Humvee + trailer
4 Plt 1+25 men
5 Plt 1+25 men
6 Plt 1+25 men
Weapons Plt (1x 81mm Mortar, 1x .50 cal M2HB, 1x SMAW or Dragon) 1+15 men, 1 Humvee + trailer
Charlie Company
CHQ 2+4 men, 1 Humvee + trailer
7 Plt 1+25 men
8 Plt 1+25 men
9 Plt 1+25 men
Weapons Plt (1x 81mm Mortar, 1x .50 cal M2HB, 1x SMAW or Dragon) 1+15 men, 1 HUMVEE + trailer

2/2nd Battalion (organised as 1/2 battalion)

3/2nd Battalion - Disbanded, personnel transferred to 1/2 and 2/2

6th Marine Regiment 740 (organised as 2nd Regiment)
Headquarters Company 6th Marines

1/6th Btn (organised as 1/2 battalion)

2/6th Btn (organised as 1/2 battalion)

3/6th Btn - Disbanded, personnel transferred to 1/6 and 2/6

8th Marine Regiment 740 (organised as 2nd Regiment)
Headquarters Company 8th Marines

1/8th Btn (organised as 1/2 battalion)

2/8th Btn (organised as 1/2 battalion)

3/8th Btn -Disbanded, personnel transferred to 1/8 and 2/8

10th Marine Regiment 200 men
Headquarters Battery 10th Marines 50 men, M-1042A2

1/10th Btn –100 men, M-1042A2, M-1044A1
Headquarters Battery 10 men, 2x M-1042A2
Battery A – 30 men, 2 x M198 155mm, 2x M-809 5 tonne truck
Battery B – 30 men, 2 x M198 155mm, 2x M-809 5 tonne truck
Battery C – 30 men, 2 x M198 155mm, 2x M-809 5 tonne truck

5/10th Btn – 50 men
Headquarters Battery 17 men, 1 M1097, 1 Mk48 heavy truck
R Battery – 21 men 1 M110A2 203mm SP, 1 M-1050 FAASV
S Battery – 12 men 1 M109A2 155mm SP, 1 M-992A1 FAASV

2nd Force Service Support Group (FSSG)
Headquarters & Service Battalion 50 men, M-1044A1

2nd Combat Logistics Battalion 200 men
Headquarters & Support Company, M-1044A1
Engineer Company
Transportation Support Company M-939 5 tonne trucks
Military Police
Maintenance Platoon
Landing Support Platoon
Supply Platoon M-939 5 tonne trucks, 2x LMC-1500
Communications Platoon

8th Engineer Support Battalion 200 men
Headquarters and Service Company, M-1044A1
Engineering Support Company
A Company
B Company
C Company
Bulk Fuel Company
Bridge Company
2nd Explosive Ordnance Disposal Company

2nd Maintenance Battalion 68 men, 1 M-88A1 Hercules
Headquarters & Service Company, M-1044A1
Electronic Maintenance Company
Engineer Maintenance Company
General Support Maintenance Company
Ordnance Maintenance Company
Motor Transportation Maintenance Company

2nd Medical Battalion 100 men
Headquarters and Service Company 30
Alpha – Surgical 60, 2x MK48 heavy truck, 1x M-997 Ambulance, 2x M-997A2 ambulance
Bravo – Dental 10

2nd Supply Battalion (located at Kiel, Germany) – not included in 2nd MARDIV numbers
Specializes in distributing & warehousing military goods & equipment
Headquarters and Service Company
Ammunition Company
Supply Company
Medical Logistics Company

Graebarde 07-10-2012 09:41 PM

<Scratches head>
The 6th Marines were in NORWAY until when? And the 8th Marines were in the Med until when? Would 2 MarDiv be more than a Regimental Combat Team? This is not to say your OOB isn't good, it just got me to wondering how those forces got to Poland. Perhaps the 8th, the the 6th would still be tied up in Norway.

Legbreaker 07-11-2012 02:34 AM

The 2nd reformed in northern Germany in January 1998. There's no indication they were involved in any significant actions from then until Spring 2000 (which doesn't say they weren't of course).

My thoughts are in around late April, early May 2000, the 2nd moved to Kiel and embarked on transports to take them to their landings across the Wisla delta. At a guess the sea journey wouldn't have taken a day, the actual landing about three or four days (due to a shortage of landing vessels), and overland movement and securing of initial objectives another day or two.

Landing at Stegna, primary objectives might be the village & bridges at Rybina (and eventual location of DIVHQ and supporting units), Wisla river crossing at Dworek, the town & bridges at Nowy Dwor, and bridge at Jazowa.
Secondary objectives (to provide an alternate route for the 8th ID and following units) would be the bridge over Leniwka at the west end of Sobieszewo Island (east of Gdansk), the ferry at Sobieszewo (east of Gdansk), and the lock at the south eastern end of the island. Elbag might be taken a few days later depending on the overall situation while the remainder of the division digs in and sends out patrols against the expected Pact reaction.

Adm.Lee 07-11-2012 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legbreaker (Post 48394)
The 2nd reformed in northern Germany in January 1998. There's no indication they were involved in any significant actions from then until Spring 2000 (which doesn't say they weren't of course).

I think we discussed this a little in the last year. I suspect the division, now unified, was kept as an uncommitted reserve during the Soviet '98 offensive, or perhaps used as a raiding force on the Baltic, and/or as an amphibious decoy to threaten the Baltic coast.

Webstral 07-11-2012 12:48 PM

That's a lot of work and a lot of attention to detail, Leg. I wish I had the time to study you ORBAT in detail and give proper feedback, but I don't even have time for my own work right now. Thanks for keeping the creative light lit!

Rainbow Six 07-11-2012 01:01 PM

Leg, I enjoyed reading your orbat and it sounds plausible enough to me - well done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graebarde (Post 48384)
<Scratches head>
The 6th Marines were in NORWAY until when? And the 8th Marines were in the Med until when? Would 2 MarDiv be more than a Regimental Combat Team? This is not to say your OOB isn't good, it just got me to wondering how those forces got to Poland. Perhaps the 8th, the the 6th would still be tied up in Norway.

There's a relatively detailed timeline for Norway in the Boomer module (although it does have a big gap from the end of 1997 to autumn of 2000). It states that most NATO forces were withdrawn from Norway at some unspecified time after the end of 1997, and by the end of 2000 the only non Norwegian NATO forces in the country were British and Canadian.

Legbreaker 07-11-2012 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adm.Lee (Post 48413)
I think we discussed this a little in the last year. I suspect the division, now unified, was kept as an uncommitted reserve during the Soviet '98 offensive, or perhaps used as a raiding force on the Baltic, and/or as an amphibious decoy to threaten the Baltic coast.

I tend to agree and it makes sense. From memory, the only real action in 98-99 was down towards the south of Germany so the Marines plus most other units in the north make for a good reserve/occupation/defence force.
With the northern units basically sitting it out for a while, it's plausible the units in the south aren't in as strong a position having had less "free" time to reorganise and tend to maintenance and food production.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Webstral (Post 48414)
That's a lot of work and a lot of attention to detail, Leg.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six (Post 48415)
Leg, I enjoyed reading your orbat and it sounds plausible enough to me - well done.

Thanks! I'm fairly happy with the numbers now (although it's subject to tweaking as more facts appear). The next step is filling out vehicles and heavy weapons.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six (Post 48415)
It states that most NATO forces were withdrawn from Norway at some unspecified time after the end of 1997, and by the end of 2000 the only non Norwegian NATO forces in the country were British and Canadian.

With 7 nationalities included in the 2nd Marines as of October 2000, I'm guessing a few Norwegians and Danes may have either come back with the Marines, or been included in their 2000 landings to fill out specialist shortfalls.
It's hard to justify British, Czechs, Romanians, etc in their numbers, and near impossible for French, Dutch, Italians, Greeks and Turks. Logically only Germans, Americans and Canadians could readily be absorbed, although Poles and Russians and maybe Ukrainians may have a presence (in limited numbers due to security and trust issues).

Rainbow Six 07-12-2012 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legbreaker (Post 48438)
With 7 nationalities included in the 2nd Marines as of October 2000, I'm guessing a few Norwegians and Danes may have either come back with the Marines, or been included in their 2000 landings to fill out specialist shortfalls.

It's hard to justify British, Czechs, Romanians, etc in their numbers, and near impossible for French, Dutch, Italians, Greeks and Turks. Logically only Germans, Americans and Canadians could readily be absorbed, although Poles and Russians and maybe Ukrainians may have a presence (in limited numbers due to security and trust issues).

It's not impossible that a small number of British troops - either Royal Marines from 3 Commando Brigade (which I think has a different title in the books), or soldiers from the Parachute Regiment or the Royal Green Jackets could have found themselves attached to the US Marines whilst in Norway and never returned to UK command. It's probably more of a stretch for the Dutch, but still not impossible - IRL Dutch Marines would have been attached to 3 Commando Brigade for operations in Norway (I'm at work so don't have any books handy to confirm if that happened in T2K).

Legbreaker 07-12-2012 02:20 AM

While the British may have been with the marines in Norway, the marines have been in Germany for a couple of years by 2000. Chances are those Brits would have been reclaimed.
The Dutch never got out of Germany (Dutch government only stayed in Nato as long as their troops weren't sent into the offensive) before France moved in and the Dutch all went home.
Due to the strategic importance of the marine component of the offensive, I'm of the opinion the various Nato allies would have been requested to provide amphibious trained troops to form small platoon sized units within the 2nd Marine structure.

Rainbow Six 07-12-2012 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legbreaker (Post 48449)
Due to the strategic importance of the marine component of the offensive, I'm of the opinion the various Nato allies would have been requested to provide amphibious trained troops to form small platoon sized units within the 2nd Marine structure.

Yeah, makes sense, that's actually why I think there is a case to be made made for at least some Royal Marines to have stayed with the US Marines even after they moved to Germany and the option was there to bring them back under national command - it would be a way of keeping all amphibious trained troops together under a single command structure and provides the 2nd Dvn with experienced replacements for its losses so I definitely think there might be a few Royal Marines serving with the 2nd Marine Division in the summer of 2000.

Legbreaker 07-13-2012 06:19 AM

I'd think that they'd definitely been reclaimed in '98 but seconded back to the 2nd Marines during the organisational stages of the 2000 offensive. Makes no sense for them to stay with the US when nobody could possibly have any idea of the situation to occur later.

LAW0306 07-14-2012 12:19 AM

Sorry Leg you just spent two years getting alot of things wrong. you have units that would not even be in a division in one. you told me two years ago they only deployed as a division yet you have Combat logistic units and Marine air wing units in your order of battle. I'm sorry you wasted your time and now conterdict yourself.

LAW0306 07-14-2012 12:21 AM

you also use iraq war task force names like route clearance and mobile assault in 2nd CEB. They were only for Iraq war to make them fight as infantry to fall under foce caps.

Legbreaker 07-14-2012 01:50 AM

Oh dear.....

Once again Law you're overlooking an important fact. This is a game, it's set several YEARS after nukes and warfare wipe out real life organisations.

What is in the "real world" simply does not apply, especially since there's just 4000 people to fill in positions for which approximately four times that number are supposedly required.

I think I'll be ignoring your comments. Again. They're just not relevant to the situation.

LAW0306 07-14-2012 02:20 AM

you can ignore all you want but you stated that only 2nd Marine division was in europe . Right? well you have units from MEF, The WIng and the MLG Present. How did they get there? did they come by themselfs to europe? please enlighten me.

LAW0306 07-14-2012 02:21 AM

oh i forgot god bless you leg.

LAW0306 07-14-2012 02:26 AM

one last thing leg. We make SPMAGTF all the time and have plans to get bigger and smaller a war would not change this . its called doctrine. you just messed up. its cool we all do it. just take some advice and be better now that you have it.

Legbreaker 07-15-2012 11:43 AM

I've just about finished fleshing things out and did a quick calculation on the fuel requirements - it's scary! With every vehicle capable of carrying a medium still, or a trailer with one on it (about 80 stills) it will take a full month just to top off the fuel tanks!
One full load of ethanol in each vehicle gives just 3 hours of activity for the division. Naturally the tanks and other heavier vehicles are unlikely to move much after taking up position, but even so, it's likely to take a day or two to get everyone settled.
That's something like 200,000 litres of ethanol needed just to land and take the initial objectives!

2nd MARDIV
HQ Battalion, 100 men, 2x M-1042A2, 2x M-1044A1, 3x M-35A3

2nd Intelligence Battalion 40 men, 1x FQM-151 Pointer UAV, 4x M-1042A2, 2x M-1044A1
Headquarters Company (HQ Coy)
Counterintelligence/Human Intelligence Company (CI/HUMINT Coy)
Production & Analysis Company (P&A Coy)
Counterintelligence Support Company (CIS Coy)

8th Communication Battalion 60 men, 5x M-1042A2

2nd Tank Battalion 100 men, 8x M1, 3x FV-101 Scorpion-90 (Diesel)

2nd Light Armoured Recon Battalion 104 men total
H&S Company (Striker), 2x LAV-LOG, 16 men
Alpha Company (Apache) 8x LAV-25A1, 24 men
Bravo Company (Black Knights) 7x LAV-25A1, 21 men
Charlie Company (Gunfighters) 7x LAV-25A1, 21 men
Delta Company, 2x LAV-600 (105mm gun), 2x M-17 LAV-AT, 3x LAV-MA1 mortar carrier, 1x LAV-AD II, 27 men

2nd Recon Battalion 158 men
H&S Company 18, 1x M-1042A2, 1x M-35A3
Alpha Company 40
Bravo Company 40
Charlie Company 40
Force Reconnaissance Company, 20 men, 2x LKW Wolf IFAV, 2x M-1044A1

2nd Combat Engineer Battalion 200 men
Headquarters & Service Company, M-1042A2, 40 men
Engineer Support Company 40, 2 M-35A3
Alpha Company 40, 1x M-35A3
Bravo Company 40, 1x M-35A3
Route Clearance Company 40, 1x M-939 5 tonne truck, 1x M-58A3 MICLIC (Mine-Clearing Line Charge) trailer

2nd Assault Amphibian Battalion (218 men, 40 AAVP-7A1, 2 AAVC-7A1, 2 AAVR-7A1)
Headquarters & Services Company 4+20 men, 2 AAVP-7A1
Alpha Company (2+16+7+13+12+1+28+3x(1+38)=196
HQ sec 2+14, 2xAAVC-7A1
Comms sec 7 (rides with HQ sec)
Assault amphibian general support section 13 men, 1 AAVP-7A1
Command and control section 12 men, 1 AAVP-7A1
Maintenance section 1+28 men, 2 AAVR-7A1 ARV
Assault amphibian vehicle platoons x3 1+38 men, 12 AAVP-7A1

2nd Low Altitude Air Defence Battalion 42 men
Battalion Headquarters 2+4+1=7
HQ section 2+1, 1x M-1042A2
Logistics section 1+3+1, 1x M1097 + trailer
1st Battery 34 men
Battery HQ 1+3, 1 M-1044A1
1 Platoon – Avenger 10
Section HQ 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 1 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 2 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 3 2 men, 1 Avenger
Team 4 2 men, 1 Avenger
2 Platoon – guns 20
Section HQ 3 men, M1097, twin M61 Vulcan, mounted
Team 6 4 men, M1097, M167 VADS, towed
Team 7 3 men, M1097, 20mm FK 20-2, mounted
Team 8 4 men, M1097, M167 VADS, towed
Team 9 4 men, M1097, 23mm ZUR-23-2S Jod, towed
Team 10 2 men, M1097, twin M61 Vulcan, mounted

2nd Marine Regiment (740 men)
HQ Coy 2nd Marines 66 men, 3x M-1042A2, 1x M-35A3
1/2nd Battalion 24 Officers + 313 Enlisted =337 men
H&S Company (aka BHQ) (6+31), 1x M-1042A2
HQ Plt (4+6)
Comms Plt (5)
Service Plt (1+9), 2x M-939 5 tonne truck, 2x M-332 ammo trailers
Scout Plt (8)
Medical Plt (1+3)
Alpha Company 6+94 men
CHQ 2+4 men, 1 M-1044A1 + trailer
1 Plt 1+25 men
2 Plt 1+25 men
3 Plt 1+25 men
Weapons Plt (1x 81mm Mortar, 1x .50 cal M2HB, 1x SMAW or Dragon) 1+15 men, 1 M-1044A1 + trailer
Bravo Company
CHQ 2+4 men, 1 M-1044A1 + trailer
4 Plt 1+25 men
5 Plt 1+25 men
6 Plt 1+25 men
Weapons Plt (1x 81mm Mortar, 1x .50 cal M2HB, 1x SMAW or Dragon) 1+15 men, 1 M-1044A1 + trailer
Charlie Company
CHQ 2+4 men, 1 M-1044A1 + trailer
7 Plt 1+25 men
8 Plt 1+25 men
9 Plt 1+25 men
Weapons Plt (1x 81mm Mortar, 1x .50 cal M2HB, 1x SMAW or Dragon) 1+15 men, 1 M-1044A1 + trailer
2/2nd Battalion
Headquarters & Services Company
Easy Company
Fox Company
Golf Company
Weapons Company
3/2nd Battalion - Disbanded

6th Marine Regiment 740
Headquarters Company 6th Marines
1/6th Btn
Headquarters and Services Company – "Hawkeye"
Alpha Company – "Apache"
Bravo Company – "Black Foot or Black Iron"
Charlie Company – "Cold Steel"
Weapons Company – "Warrior"
2/6th Btn
Headquarters and Services Company (96th)
Echo Company (78th)
Foxtrot Company (79th)
Golf Company (80th)
Weapons Company (73rd)
3/6th Btn - Disbanded

8th Marine Regiment 740
Headquarters Company 8th Marines
1/8th Btn
Headquarters Company
Alpha Company
Bravo Company
Charlie Company
Weapons Company
2/8th Btn
Headquarters Company
Echo Company
Fox Company
Golf Company
Weapons Company
3/8th Btn -Disbanded

10th Marine Regiment (202 men)
Headquarters Battery 10th Marines 50 men, 2x M-1042A2, 2x MK 48/14 heavy truck
1/10th Btn (102 men)
Headquarters Battery 12 men, 2x M-1042A2
Battery A – 30 men, 2 x M198 155mm, 2x M-809 5 tonne truck
Battery B – 30 men, 2 x M198 155mm, 2x M-809 5 tonne truck
Battery C – 30 men, 2 x M198 155mm, 2x M-809 5 tonne truck
5/10th Btn (50 men)
Headquarters Battery 17 men, 1 M1097, 1 Mk48/14 heavy truck
R Battery – 21 men 1 M110A2 203mm SP, 1 M-1050 FAASV
S Battery – 12 men 1 M109A2 155mm SP, 1 M-992A1 FAASV

2nd Force Service Support Group (FSSG)
Headquarters & Service Battalion 50 men, 3x M-1044A1

2nd Combat Logistics & Engineer Battalion 300 men
Headquarters & Support Company (130)
HQ Platoon, 15 men, 3x M-1044A1
Military Police, 10 men, 5x M1114 armoured Humvee
Landing Support Platoon, 30 men
Supply Platoon 60 men, 10x M-939 5 tonne trucks, 2x LMC-1500, 2 MK 48/14 heavy truck, 2x M-107 water trailer, 10x M-105 trailer
Communications platoon, 15 men, 1x M-35A3
Transportation Support Company, 30 men, 15x M-939 5 tonne trucks
Engineering Support Company (80)
HQ Platoon, 20 men, 2x M-35A3
1 Platoon, 20 men, 1x D7G bulldozer w/ripper, 1x 1155 bucket loader, 1x M9 ACE, 1x M-54 dumper
2 Platoon, 20 men, 1x 1150 angle-blade bulldozer, 1x backhoe loader, 1x M-54 dumper, 260 CFM compressor (trailer)
3 Platoon, 20 men, 1x D7G bulldozer w/winch, 1x backhoe loader, 1x M-54 dumper
Bulk Fuel Company, 30 men, 3x M-939 tanker, 5x Rubber Fuel Bladders, NATO 9,460L
Bridge Company, 30 men, 1x M-60 AVLB, 5x M-809 bridge transporters, M9 ACE, 2x M-35A3

2nd Maintenance Battalion 101 men, 1x M-88A1 Hercules, 1x LAV ARRV, 1x MK 48/15
Headquarters & Service Company, 16 men, 2x M-1044A1
Electronic Maintenance Company, 8 men, 1x M-35A3
Engineer Maintenance Company, 15 men, 3x M-35A3
General Support Maintenance Company, 14 men, 2x M-35A3
Ordnance Maintenance Company, 18 men, 3x M-35A3
Motor Transportation Maintenance Company, 30 men 1x M-1070 HET, 1x M-1000 HET trailer, 3x M-35A3 mobile workshop

2nd Medical Battalion 100 men
Headquarters & Service Company, 30 men, 1x M-1044A1, 1x M-35A3, 1x M-105 trailer
Alpha – Surgical, 60 men, 1x M-997 Ambulance, 2x M-997A2 ambulance, MK48/17 heavy truck, 1x M-107 water trailer
Bravo – Dental, 10 men, 1x M-35A3

2nd Supply Battalion (located at Kiel, Germany) – not included in 2nd MARDIV numbers (Specializes in distributing & warehousing military goods & equipment)
Headquarters and Service Company
Ammunition Company
Supply Company
Medical Logistics Company

Legbreaker 07-18-2012 06:08 AM

The next stage of this project is to flesh out the details of the initial landing, movement to their presumed objectives, digging in and holding, and then withdrawing westwards to rejoin the XI Corps.

Anyone got any elements/ideas they'd like included? Can't promise anything, but if it fits, I'll see what I can do.

At this stage my notes consist of what's in the books, and my idea of the main landing being in the vicinity of Stegna with perhaps one regiment landing directly on Sobieszewo Island (west of the main Vistula mouth). Primary objectives of Village & bridges at Rybina, Vistula river crossing at Dworek, Town & bridges at Nowy Dwor and Bridge at Jazowa.
Secondary objectives being the bridge over Leniwka at west end of Sobieszewo Island, ferry crossing at across the Vistula from Sobieszewo island and the lock at the south eastern end of the island.
Approximately one battalion of infantry would be responsible for securing and patrolling from each of the bridges (except Rybina where the 2nd Marine HQ and support units would be located) and the lock.
Once those crossings where secure, the recon units, engineers, and possibly tanks could take Elblag, potentially with the assistance of the newly arrived 8th ID.
One artillery battery of 1/10th Battalion would be dedicated to support each infantry regiment, with the SPA of 5/10th Battalion assigned to support the attack on Elblag/or as required. 2nd Low Altitude Air Defence Battalion would be split up amongst the units to provide a small measure of AA defence beyond that integral to the supported units (tank commanders machineguns for example).

The Marines would be transported to the landing area by the USS Tarawa plus a collection of roughly half a dozen other ships scrounged from Nato sources - most would be civilian in origin, probably ex ro-ro ferries. Air assets consist of one Osprey (as per the plate in the 2.2 Naval & Aviation book) and perhaps a very limited number of other rotary aircraft severely restricted by a critical shortage of fuel (enough for maybe 20 hours flight time between them TOTAL!). Air cushion vehicles would not be involved because of their rapacious appetite for fuel - any which had survived this long into the war would have been left back in Germany.

Anyway, that's where I'm at so far.

robert.munsey 03-17-2018 09:36 PM

Some notes on the USMC from the NATO1989 OOB
 
Just wanted to post the notes and unit data from the 1988/89 NATO OOB for the USMC;

Iwill note that this would be the start point for building the OOB for the '2nd MARDIV' for the Baltic campaign.

NATO OOB;
d. II Marine Expeditionary Force (MAGTF/CE)
1) 4th Marine Expeditionary Brigade (MAGTF/CE), Amphibious, associated with Amphibious Group 2
2) 6th Marine Expeditionary Brigade (MAGTF/CE), MPF, associated with MPS Squadron 1
3) 2nd Marine Division (Designated GCE for II MEF)
a) HQ Battalion
b) 2nd Marine Regiment (Designated GCE for 4th MEB)
i) HQ Company: 24 TOW (AT-platoon), 258 men
ii) 2nd Battalion, 2nd Marine Regiment: 905 men
iii) 3rd Battalion, 2nd Marine Regiment: 905 men
c) 6th Marine Regiment (Designated GCE for 6th MEB)
i) HQ Company: 24 TOW (AT-platoon), 258 men
ii) 1st Battalion, 6th Marine Regiment: 905 men
d) 8th Marine Regiment (With Responsibility of sourcing 6th Fleet MEU)
i) HQ Company: 24 TOW (AT-platoon), 258 men
ii) 1st Battalion, 8th Marine Regiment: 1103 men
iii) 2nd Battalion, 8th Marine Regiment: 1103 men
iv) 2nd Battalion, 4th Marine Regiment: 1103 men
e) 10th Marine Regiment (including 48 M101A1 for contingency purposes )
i) HQ Battery, 359 men
ii) 1st Battalion, 10th Marine Regiment: 16 M198, 8 M114A1, 751 men (Direct Support for RLT 2)
iii) 2nd Battalion, 10th Marine Regiment: 16 M198, 8 M114A1 (Direct Support for RLT 6)
iv) 3rd Battalion, 10th Marine Regiment: 16 M198, 8 M114A1, 751 men (Direct Support for RLT 8)
v) 5th Battalion, 10th Marine Regiment: 12 M109A3, 12 M110A2, 709 men (General Support)
f) 2nd Tank Battalion
i) HQ and Service Company: 2 M60A1, 1 M88A1, 320 men
ii) AT (TOW) Company: 72 TOW HMMWV, 246 men
iii) 4 Tank Companies: 17 M60A1, 1 M88A1, 105 men each
g) 2nd Light Armored Infantry Battalion
i) HQ and Service Company: 4 LAV-25, 8 LAV-C2, 16 LAV-L, 2 LAV-R
ii) Weapons Company: 10 LAV-25, 16 LAV-AT, 8 LAV-M, 1 LAV-R
iii) 3 Light Armored Infantry Companies: 14 LAV-25, 1 LAV-R, 56 scouts each
h) 2nd Reconnaissance Battalion
i) HQ and Service Company: 102 men
ii) 3 Reconnaissance Companies: 79 men each (12 teams of 4 men each)
i) 2nd Assault Amphibian Battalion
i) HQ and Service Company: 15 AAVP-7, 3 AAVC-7, 2 AAVR-7, 237 men
ii) 4 Assault Amphibian Companies: 43 AAVP-7, 3 AAVC-3, 1 AAVR-7, 226 men each
j) 2nd Combat Engineer Battalion
i) HQ and Service Company: 143 men
ii) Engineer Support Company: 259 men
iii) 4 Combat Engineer Companies (1 in cadre status): 114 men each
4) 2nd Marine Aircraft Wing (Designated ACE for II MEF)
a) Marine Wing Headquarters Squadron-2
b) Marine Air Control Group 28 – Cherry Point, NC
i) 3rd Light Antiaircraft Missile Battalion: 18 I-Hawk, 751 men
ii) 2nd Low Altitude Air Defense Battalion: 90 Stinger, 377 men
c) Marine Air Group 14 – Cherry Point, NC (Designated F/W host MAG for 4th MEB ACE)
i) VMGR-252 “Otis”: 8 KC-130F, 4 KC-130R
ii) VMAQ-2(-) “Panthers”: 18 (of 19 authorized) EA-6B
iii) VMA(AW)-332 “Polka Dots”: 10 A-6E
iv) VMA(AW)-533 “Hawks”: 10 A-6E
v) VMGR-252 “Otis”: 4 (of 12 authorized) KC-130R, 9 KC-130F
vi) VMGRT-253 “Titans”: 6 KC-130F
d) Marine Air Group 26 – New River, NC (Designated R/W host MAG for 6th MEB ACE)
i) HMM-261(C) “Raging Bulls”: 12 CH-46E
ii) HMM-264 “Black Knights”: 12 CH-46E
iii) HMM-266 “Fighting Griffons”: 12 CH-46E
iv) HMH-362 “Ugly Angles”: 18 CH-53D
v) HMH-461 “Sea Stallions”: 12 (of 16 authorized) CH-53E, 4 CH-53D
vi) HMLA-167 “Warriors”: 13 AH-1T, 11 (of 12 authorized) UH-1N
vii) HMT-204 “Raptors”: 10 CH-46E
e) Marine Air Group 29 – New River, NC (Designated R/W host MAG for 4th MEB)
i) VMO-1(-): 8 OV-10A, 5 (of 14 authorized) OV-10D
ii) HMM-263 “Thunder Eagles”: 12 CH-46E
iii) HMM-365 “Blue Knights”: 12 CH-46E
iv) HMH-464(-) “Condors”: 12 CH-53E
v) HMLA-269(-) “Gunrunners”: 12 (+2 detached) AH-1T, 3 (+9 detached) UH-1N
f) Marine Air Group 31 – Beaufort, SC (Designated F/W host MAG for 6th MEB ACE)
i) VMFA-115 “Silver Eagles”: 12 F/A-18
ii) VMFA-122 “Crusaders”: 12 F/A-18
iii) VMFA-251 “Thunderbolts”: 12 F/A-18 (converted 86)
iv) VMFA-312 “Checkertails”: 12 F/A-18 (converted 86)
v) VMFA-451 “Warlords”: 12 F/A-18 (converted from F-4S in 87)
g) Marine Air Group 32 – Cherry Point, NC
i) VMA-223 “Bulldogs”: 20 AV-8B
ii) VMA-231 “Ace of Spades”: 20 AV-8B
iii) VMA-331 “Bumblebees”: 20 AV-8B
iv) VMA-542 “Flying Tigers”: 20 AV-8B
v) VMAT-203 “Hawks”: 16 AV-8B, 10 TAV-8B

Note 1: The infantry battalions have rifle companies, a HQ and service company, including a reconnaissance platoon in HMMWV, a weapons company with a heavy machine gun (6 .50-cal M2), a grenade launcher (40mm Mk19), a antitank (24 Dragon ATGM) and a mortar (8 81mm M252) platoon. The rifle companies are organized in three rifle platoons and a weapons platoon with 6 M60E3 machine guns, 6 83mm Mk153 SMAW and 3 60mm M224 mortars. In 1988/89 three infantry battalions were placed in cadre (3/4, 2/1, 2/6) and a fourth rifle company was added to the structure of the eight infantry battalions assigned to the MEU(SOC) rotation. There were plans to have a Reserve rifle company affiliate to fill out the four company battalion structure for the 16 remaining active duty infantry battalions.

Note 2: Battalions, companies and squadrons rotate for 6-month periods to MEU(SOC) deployments and to Okinawa, under the Unit Deployment Program (UDP).

Note 3: The Tank Battalions were the controlling headquarters for the TOW vehicles, but the ATGMs would have generally been farmed out to other commands and not used en masse. The Tank Battalion had 3 “platoons” of TOWs, each with 24 launchers.

Note 4: The peacetime organization and garrrison distribution of the Marine Corps units does not reflect the wartime organization. Marine formations deploy as integrated Marine Air-Ground Task Forces (MAGTFs) of various sizes: Marine Expeditionary Unit (MEU) commanded by a colonel, Marine Expeditionary Brigade (MEB) commanded by a brigadier or major general, and Marine Expeditionary Force (MEF) commanded by a lieutenant general. Each has a Command Element (CE), a Ground Combat Element (GCE), an Aviation Combat Element (ACE), and Combat Service Support Element (CSSE, not shown).

Note 5: A Marine Expeditionary Unit (MEU) is the smallest of the three Marine air/ground task forces. MEUs are made up of about 1,900 Marines and are transported on three to five amphibious ships. They have weapons, helicopters, and AV-8B attack jets, but no fighter aircraft. In contrast to the larger task forces, MEUs are deployed routinely in peacetime. Two MEUs are always forward deployed: one in the Mediterranean and one in the Western Pacific or Indian Ocean. These units form, train, deploy, and then disband to ensure rotations of people and equipment about every six months.

Note 6: The Marine Expeditionary Brigade (MEB) is a MAGTF built around a reinforced infantry regiment and an aircraft group composed by both fixed and rotary wing aircraft. Notionally, there were nine MEBs in the active force structure, although only six MEB headquarters were permanently staffed in peacetime. During a war in Europe, the Marines would send a brigade to Norway and thirty days of supplies and the equipment for one MEB are located in central Norway. The MEB deploys with 30 days of accompanying supplies and is capable of conducting combat operations of limited scope. The Amphibious MEB embarks aboard Naval ships to destinations throughout the world, where it can make an amphibous assault, take a beachhead and open a lane to project offensive combat power ashore. An Amphibious MEB would deploy aboard Naval vessels with more than 4,000 Marines. About 20 amphibious ships would be required to transport a brigade. An Maritime Prepositioning Force MEB can be much larger, and project offensive combat power throughout its theater of operation. An MPF MEB would deploy to a theater where it would offload the required equipment from an MPF ship. Because this is a land-based force, it can be much larger than an amphibious MEB, bringing more than 16,000 Marines and Sailors to the theater of operation quickly. One MEB per MEF is required to be ready for embarkation within four days of notification.

Note 7: A Marine Expeditionary Force (MEF) consists of about 50,000 Marines. It also has a substantial number of weapons including tanks, light armored vehicles, howitzers, helicopters, and fighter and attack aircraft. About 55 amphibious ships would be required to transport a
MEF. The size and composition of a deployed MEF can vary greatly depending on the requirements of the mission. It can deploy with not only its own units but also units from the other standing MEFs, the Marine Corps Reserve, or the other Services and the Special Operations Command. A MEF typically deploys by echelon with 60 days of sustainment. The MEF is required to be ready for embarkation within ten days of notification.

Note 8: Marine Corps and Navy planners divide MEFs and MEBs into three parts or echelons. The assault echelon (AE) comprises the troops and equipment that would be needed to sustain the task force for an amphibious landing and the first 15 days of combat. It consists of about two-thirds of all troops in the task force and about half of all vehicles, but only one-quarter of needed cargo. The assault follow-on echelon (AFOE) and the fly-in echelon (FIE) carry enough supplies to support the task force for an additional 15 to 45 days, after which the landing force would require further reinforcement.

Note 9: The most likely role of the Marine Corps Reserve upon mobilization will be to augment or reinforce an active duty MEF. "Augmentation" refers to filling the unmanned structure of a MEF while "reinforcement" adds additional capabiltties to a MEF. The remainder of 4th Marine Division and 4th Marine Air Wing could be mobilized to field a Marine Expeditionary Brigade to
reinforce a MEF or to provide a nucleus to reconstitute a division and airwing. If augmentation or reinforcement is not ordered, the Reserves could be used to field a division and a wing with reduced capability.

Note 10: Each active-duty Marine Division previously had five artillery battalions: three direct support with M198s, one General Support with M198s and one mixed mechanized artillery battalion. In 1987-1989, however, the M198 General Support battalions were transferred to the Reserves.

Note 11: Marine Fixed Wing Aircraft Holdings (some deliveries ongoing): 120 F-18A, 20 F-18B, 36 F-18C, 10 F-18D, 134 AV-8B (plus 5 in storage), 7 TAV-8B, 21 RF-4B, 98 A-4M, 15 OA-4M, 9 TA-4F, 54 A-6E, 4 EA-6A, 18 EA-6B, 36 OV-10/A/D, 13 F-21, 42 KC-130 (Flight International reports 50+ F-4S, 25+ RF-4B, 20+ A-4E/F, 130+ A-4M/OA-4M, 20+ TA-4F, 75+ A-6E, 6 EA-6A, 12 EA-6B, 64+ OV-10A/D)

Note 12: Marine Rotary Wing Aircraft Holdings (some deliveries ongoing): 84 AH-1J/T/W, 80 UH-1N, 206 CH-46E, 94 CH-53A/D, 76 CH-53E (Flight International reports 165+ AH-1J/T/W (deliveries ongoing), 50+ CH-53A, 85 CH-53D, 98 CH-53E (deliveries ongoing), 300+ CH-46E (may also include CH-46F, other models), 92+ UH-1N, 40+ UH-1E)

Note 13: Marine Equipment Holdings: 716 M60A1, 416 LAV-25, 96 LAV-AT, ~190 other LAV variants, 1,323 AAVP-7A1 (may include command and recovery variants), 54 AAVP-7R recovery vehicles, 143 M109A3, 108 M110A2, 335 155mm M101A1, 468 155mm M198, 438 81mm mortars, 1,117 TOW (generally HMMWV mounted), 1,700 Dragon, 1,929 SMAW, Redeye, Stinger, IHAWK

robert.munsey 03-17-2018 09:51 PM

Some notes on the USMC from the NATO1989 OOB just a suggestion
 
I made the post and then thought other might take it the wrong way, so first off I was just placing data so the great work accomplished by others could use this as a frame to update their work,
Second others could come up with reasons or concepts of what happened to all of the men and women of the 2nd Marine Aircraft Wing (the ACE of the IIMEF). Just me I would surmised that a lot of the ground crews became the fillers for the 6th REGT when it came out of Norway (IIRC) and the 8th REGT.
You have to hand it to Leg for creating the 2MARDIV OOB, he did an pretty good job. I would say that certain units would not be 'dsibanded', but reduced. certainly Isuspect that the 2/4 Marine would still be around in some fashion still serving with the 8th REGT.

I was really posting this to assist with OOB refinement. (We are about to start a game and I researching a character....)

rcaf_777 03-21-2018 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legbreaker (Post 48639)
The Marines would be transported to the landing area by the USS Tarawa plus a collection of roughly half a dozen other ships scrounged from NATO sources - most would be civilian in origin, probably ex ro-ro ferries.

Would you need the USS Tarawa? Looking on the map you will see a great German seaport near the polish coast that you could use Peenemünde, the birthplace of the V-2 Rocket. The Germans and the US would then be able to conduct the whole landing using LCM or LCU's and maybe a few ro-ro ferries. Most landing craft and other small craft could be brought in using the Kiel Canal to transit from one side of Germany to the other and then down the coast.

You can also use this same method for troops leaving Poland for Germany during Omega. Szczecin is NATO in hands in 2000 so it could serve as evacuation assembly area.

robert.munsey 03-23-2018 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcaf_777 (Post 77510)
Would you need the USS Tarawa? Looking on the map you will see a great German seaport near the polish coast that you could use Peenemünde, the birthplace of the V-2 Rocket. The Germans and the US would then be able to conduct the whole landing using LCM or LCU's and maybe a few ro-ro ferries. Most landing craft and other small craft could be brought in using the Kiel Canal to transit from one side of Germany to the other and then down the coast.

I am not to sure that the LCM would have the range or it would be a one way ticket (190 nautical mile range), the LCU, yes, but would they have any or enough? Lets say they do (German and US or others) and then add the RO-RO ferries. The civilian ships would be the ticket and allow for this, if you could convince the Captains that they would be reimbursed for such a voyage and insured against loss. Lets say NATO accomplished that (It happened in the cannon, so they must have). You would need enough ships to transport 4200 Marines and others to includes the 8 tanks, 'X' amount of AAV, LAVs, arty and trucks. A single RO-RO ferry could transport that, the 4200 Marines, or at least 4000 you would need many smaller ships as one big ship would be a big target for one missile (such as a SCUD or half a launcher of 220mm rockets). I would venture that they did 'persuade' the Captains of these vessels (most likely through the greed of the Captains - promise of future traffic, fuel, food, etc - all of the above) to get the Northern Flank or the 26th MEU there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcaf_777 (Post 77510)
You can also use this same method for troops leaving Poland for Germany during Omega. Szczecin is NATO in hands in 2000 so it could serve as evacuation assembly area.

I would say yes, except the price would be very high if there was any threat to the ships, like for instance, a SCUD came crashing down on the USS TARAWA or the large RO-RO with all of the vehicles during the landing. That would be incentive for the smaller ship Captains to stay away/
However
lets say that it was something not so drastic, something simple as improper trained crew and the RO-RO rolls over during the final landing stages, as they off loaded the RO-RO improperly (it happens) and it rolled over in the bay with the Marines and Germans looking at it thinking;
"Okay, No what, that was our meal and fuel ticket. Now what?"
Hence the start of the USMC version of the 'Good Luck you are on your own adventure.....

robert.munsey 03-23-2018 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robert.munsey (Post 77546)
I would say yes, except the price would be very high if there was any threat to the ships, like for instance, a SCUD came crashing down on the USS TARAWA or the large RO-RO with all of the vehicles during the landing. That would be incentive for the smaller ship Captains to stay away/
However
lets say that it was something not so drastic, something simple as improper trained crew and the RO-RO rolls over during the final landing stages, as they off loaded the RO-RO improperly (it happens) and it rolled over in the bay with the Marines and Germans looking at it thinking;
"Okay, No what, that was our meal and fuel ticket. Now what?"
Hence the start of the USMC version of the 'Good Luck you are on your own adventure.....

I would use something like the Zeebrugge ferry disaster as inspiration for the Ro-Ro ferry roll over to paint the story for the players.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4283156/Survivors-relive-Zeebrugge-ferry-disaster-30-years-later.html

rcaf_777 03-23-2018 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robert.munsey (Post 77546)
I am not to sure that the LCM would have the range or it would be a one way ticket (190 nautical mile range), the LCU, yes, but would they have any or enough?

It only a 70 nautical mile trip from the east German coast to Polish Coast at Kołobrzeg. Given the location of 2nd Marine Division at Bialogard, Poland landing by LCM/LCU there makes sense. Both the US Navy and US Army have landing craft that could make the 70 nautical mile trip and return safely.

Quote:

Originally Posted by robert.munsey (Post 77546)
if you could convince the Captains that they would be reimbursed for such a voyage and insured against loss

What a civilian Captain to do when a bunch of navy and marine types show and enlisted your ship and crew

Quote:

Originally Posted by robert.munsey (Post 77546)
I would say yes, except the price would be very high if there was any threat to the ships, like for instance, a SCUD came crashing down on the USS TARAWA or the large RO-RO with all of the vehicles during the landing. That would be an incentive for the smaller ship Captains to stay away

Again do to the fuel shortage any evacuation would us smaller craft (think a force of small boat like at Dunkirk) and only transport men as far as the east German coast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by robert.munsey (Post 77546)
lets say that it was something not so drastic, something simple as improperly trained crew and the RO-RO rolls over during the final landing stages, as they offloaded the RO-RO improperly (it happens) and it rolled over in the bay with the Marines and Germans looking at it thinking; "Okay, No what, that was our meal and fuel ticket. Now what?"

Or something as a simple as “headquarters says there isn’t any fuel left for the landing craft to return. This could be followed by an incepted 5th Infantry Div “you're on your own” order or the omega order. The Div then has to make its way down the coast to Szczecin (which is close to German border). There they hope to evacuate back into Germany by sea or land.

pmulcahy11b 03-24-2018 09:10 AM

There's a canon mention in the color plates of the V2/2.2 NATO Combat Vehicle Handbook that the 2nd Marine Division has a Leopard 3 in Poland in 2000.

rcaf_777 04-03-2018 08:16 PM

MAP
 
1 Attachment(s)
MAP


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:10 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.