A decent list, but one I feel could benefit from a local perspective.
Primary Targets

SS-18
Adelaide, SA (State Capital, Major Population and Industrial Centre, Submarine Building, Military Vehicles, International Airport and Sea Port, Army Base) - As far as I am aware, no subs have been built here for some time.

Canberra, ACT (National Capital and International Air Port, NASA Deep Space Communications Station) - The "international air port" is barely worthy of the name. It's not a lot more than a landing strip and a few supporting buildings. As for the politicians in Canberra, nuke away - it'd be no great loss! ;)
I would miss that very cute woman I used to see there though. :(

Geelong, VIC (Industrial Centre, Oil Refinery, Airport and Sea Port)
Melbourne, VIC (State Capital, Major Population and Industrial centre, Oil Refinery, Warship Building, Military Aircraft, International Air Port and Sea Port, Army and Airforce Base) - Geelong and Melbourne could potentially be hit with one missile. Might take two warheads though to be sure. Warship (or any ship) building capacity is very limited (when compared to other locations). The various military bases are relatively small affairs and well dispursed.

Sydney, NSW (State Capital, Major Population and Industrial Centre, Oil Refinery, Nuclear Reactor, International Air Port and Sea Port, Major Army Base, Garden Island Navy Base) - I spent nearly ten years in Sydney. It would require multiple warheads to strike at all the listed targets. One may take out the majority of the port facilities, air port and garden island, but Holsworthy, Ingleburn, Richmond etc are quite a distance away (Richmond would require a nuke of it's own, but it's not much of a target.

Woomera, SA (Air Force Air & Space Test Range) - Don't know a lot about this one, but I believe there's not a lot there to nuke. I think it's more of an open space than actual facility.

SS-11 & SS-25
Newcastle, NSW (Industrial Centre, Airport and Sea Port, Army Base) - The Newcastle area would require several warheads at least to cover all probable targets, however some of those targets simply aren't worth the effort. Singleton for example is the Infantry Training Centre for the Australian Army, but consists of a small collection of buildings housing around a thousand people (at most) the majority of whom are usually out in the field at any given time. And those fields, well, they're BIG!

The remaining "target"s I don't really know enough about to comment on effectively. Some, like Darwin, I haven't laid eyes on in over twenty years, others such as Perth I've never been to.


As for the "total war" list...

Alice Springs, NT (Airport, Radar Station) - Is it really worth nuking an airstrip and radar dish?

Devonport, TAS (Airport and Sea Port) - probably two nukes required although neither needs to be very big. The port facility is incapable of major work being barely more than docks.

Launceston, TAS (Airport, Army Base) - two warheads required as there is at least 15 km between them. The two army bases are barely worthy of the name however, both are reserve units no larger than about an acre in size (0.4 hectares) with a standing staff counted on one hand. One is an infantry company, the other in the CBD is Artillery and support units (medical, supply, admin).

Orange, NSW (Army Base) - reserve unit only. No more than a handful of standing staff in BHQ plus thousands of sheep...

Richmond, NSW (Major Airforce Base) - Hmm, major.... If you consider C-130's and a hospital unit as a major combat asset...

Wagga Wagga, NSW (Airport, Airforce Base) - definately nukable since 1RTB is located at Kapooka, a short drive away. 1RTB is the recruit training centre for the entire army, everyone besides officers goes through there.
HOWEVER, it is only a training centre...

VERY rare. In all my years in the infantry I've seen a total of, one, count 'em, 1 L2A1 in working condition plus one in the infantry museum at Singleton near Newcastle.
This doesn't mean that they aren't relatively plentiful in other areas, just that they're not standard issue in the units I was in or associated with.

I do find it very interesting the way the Army seemed to hand out it's equipment. One of my friends joined an armoured recce regiment in Sydney and they had about 12 L2A1s apparently and the infantry unit in Western Australia he was in later had about 6 but that unit also had a Series III Landrover while all the other units had 110s and had complained that support units were getting the Austcam uniforms while his infantry unit was still in JGs!

Well were do the Collins Class subs go to be serviced or repaired if HMAS Stirling at Garden Island WA cant do the job or is nuked then?

Still an airport that handles 2.8 million people a year and that has a 3,270M runway and secondary 1,679M runway would be of some use.


My thinking exactly


I think any shipyard that can build and repair modern warships is worth targeting.


A 20MT warhead might do the job, but I still would be open to a second missile strike on Australia's largest city. I think RAAF Richmond is home to much of Australia's military airlift resources, although its unlikely that all would be based there.


Woomera Test Range is the largest defence systems test and evaluation range in the western world and to be honest I'm not sure what there either as its sort of an Australian White Sands, so I believe a 20MT warhead would be needed to at least disable operations from it.

A MIRV strike then perphaps?

No its just a potential target.

I wouldnt bother with Tasmania myself, as its of no strategic value.


Again just a potential target.

Not all military resources are frontline combat ones.


Worth a nuke then?

Based maybe, but unlikely to remain there in the event of a war. Unless the nukes were sent as the opening shots of the war, I can't see a nuke hitting more than a handful of transport aircraft plus the servicing facilities (which I'm sure are duplicated elsewhere in various forms).

Newcastle, Woolongong and especially Sydney would need multiple warheads to take out completely. Unlike cities in the northern hemisphere (especially Europe), Australian cites are spread over a very wide area. Sydney, with only approximately 4 million people (a little under a 1/5th of the total Australian population) takes about an hour to drive across even taking the motorways and cruising at around 110 kph.
Richmond is approximately 50km from Garden Island/CBD, Orchard hills is 20km from Richmond, Holsworthy 45km from Richmond and Holsworthy to the CBD/Garden Island area is about 30km.
It is my estimate that you'd need at least five warheads to significantly damage just those targets mentioned.

I'm on the fence about this one actually. Being primarily just a training centre, it would be relatively easy to set up again elsewhere and be up and running within a short period or time (provided instructors could be found).
During WWII and Vietnam, other locations also conducted recruit training, so...
It's be worth a nuke if there were a few free, but it's not a location I'd have on my primary list (even though personally I'd LOVE to see it as a smoking, radioactive hole in the ground, but then so would anyone else who's ever been subjected to it's horrors).

It always good to get a local prospective on things. Would be great if we could do some target lists for other countries and get some local knowledge as well from people who live there.



I live in Dublin, Ireland which is a relatively small city compared to some of the bigger cities and conurbations in Britain and Europe, yet it would take nearly an hour to drive from the northern end to the southern end of it at a steady speed as the suburbs are huge, and the Dublin area has now spread well beyond Co. Dublin and out into four other counties.

Well this getting beyond the Australia discussion Mohender.

I doubt bombers would used in a first strike by either America or Russia, particularly against each other. Although boomers may be used in conjunction with land based ICBMs.


Probably right here.


They may use some, but there are other targets (Australia) that need to be hit as well.


I think they would be largely used against American and NATO targets closer to the USSR.


Well they dont really need to use the SS-18 (R-36M2) to hit the US as other ICBM's have the range, but to cause the most damage they would be well suited.


I don't think we will ever know will we.


If the Soviets launched a first strike on the US I think its highly probable that most if not all of the US silo based ICBMs would be launched before they were destroyed by the incoming Soviet missiles.

I'll answer that one on the What is Cannon? thread started by Leg.:)

Same here. I've only ever seen one in working condition and I never actually saw it fired.

Weren't you producing the F1? What would be of these?

Oops realized that the L2A1 was a version of the FN-FAL/L1A1 produced in very little number by Australia:D.

What about the F1, nevertheless? Are there still some Owen around?

I trained briefly with the F1 SMG waaaaay back in early 91. They were withdrawn from my unit within months of my arrival. A very simple weapon, although being a 9mm, I can't speak all that highly of effectiveness.

As for the Owen, I believe they went out of service back in the 60's. The F1 replaced it with the vast majority of Owens being destroyed. A few might be found "off the books" in unit armouries, but don't count on them being in working order (hard to ask the armourer to maintain them without parts and authorisation).

Besides the issued L1A1 SLRs, M60's, handful of M16A1s and the odd M203 (the latter two received as hand-me-downs from another unit which had received their F88 Steyr AUG earlier), my first unit had a Bren gun, two SMLEs and an ancient Martini Henry tucked away up the back of the company armoury.

Australia for dummies
 

I'd add and important addition just below "Sharks" and just above "Stinging Jellyfish" on the left hand side of the map - "TARGAN".

:D

I think "deranged gunmen" on Tasmania is right on the money.

:D

My two cents is there is nothing saying that a ANZAC Division could organized and trained and sent somewhere ethier the middle east or Europe in the later stages???

I also think that eveybody needs to take a look at target list for nukes and remember that, they are just lists, many factors have taken into account for actually nukes fired off durring TW2000

The Targets Are

US Forces in Europe and Misslie Launch feilds in the CONUS

Then Staging/Training areas for troops for US Forces in CONUS (cause that were the bulk of it Military is)

War Industrials CONUS

Now comes tragets outside the CONUS but still covering the same areas

But we must remmber the following

how much was used before the counter attack ?
how missile fail to go off ?
how many were used againist new targets?

Been reading this discussion (very interesting one) and frankly I think that the GDW 2300 nuking of Australia doesnt really agree with the T2K canon as to its extent.

The Russians in their attack on the US and the UK really didnt go for city busting - they went after industrial targets mainly - after all if they were going for a city buster then why is NY still standing and why are large areas of LA intact? Heck they barely touched Chicago.

The attack on Australia seems to be overkill compared to the rest of the nuclear strikes in general - i.e. if you are going to hit Australia that bad then the nuclear exchange is a lot worse than anything painted in Howling Wildnerness or the timeline in general.

Plus look at the size of warheads used in the rest of the attacks - the biggest in the US was a total yield of 1.75 MT - if you are taking out Sydney with a 20MT attack then there is no way that any major US city is still there.

Frankly what I saw Leg post a long time ago is the reality as far as I am concerned - a single nuclear attack on the one US facility there to take it out and try to convince Australia to stay out of the war.

And I agree with the comments about the US using Australia as a supply center for its forces in Kenya and the Middle East - especially since Australia uses much the same weapons as the US.

I see them as staying neutral initially in the war until and then possibly coming in late, but with Australian contingents of volunteers fighting in Europe, the Middle East and Kenya.

I will have a small contingent of Australian troops in the Kenya sourcebook I am writing now based on Frank Frey's notes - not much more than a company - and based on similar Australian deployments during the War on Terror.

Just the small conflict with Indonesia which happens to have a much greater manpower than Australia (if somewhat lacking in decent aircraft and ships).
There's also the small matter of Australia only having 2 Divisions total with only about 2/3rds of 1st Division being regular army and the balance made up of reserve units which can have as little as 10% of their full strength.

Umm, what?
This is from the 2.2 BYB
The previous comments in this thread I think you'll find are all hypothetical.

Not likely!
One of the scenarios in Twilight Encounters (What's Polish for G'day) has a small Australian SAS unit and the PC's are supposed to be taken by complete surprise at Australians being anywhere near Europe.
Only one Challenge mag has Australians serving anywhere, and that's just a brief note about a presence in Korea (I've been working on fleshing that out for a while with some difficulty - best unit appears to be the reserve 9th Brigade from 2nd Div after being brought up to strength with fresh recruits). With the situation at home, the limited numbers of troops, and the war with Indonesia, it's just not going to happen that Australians are going to be sent anywhere else. Might be a few freelancers/mercenaries, but don't count on any serving military personnel unless it's the odd individual caught overseas on exchange, on holiday, or deserted.

I don't have the quote immediately to hand (am at work at the moment) but when I was researching the Anglo German Brigade I'm pretty sure I came across a reference to Australian troops being in Korea in the Challenge article on Canada (Issue #30).

Edit - just saw that Leg beat me to this one...

Leg, am pretty sure that article places Australian troops in Korea in early 1997 - would Reserve forces be ready to deploy overseas that early on in the War?

Unlikely, but I think I proposed in a thread on Korea that regular army units would have been sent initially and rotated home as soon as the reserves were ready and the Indonesian situation had hotted up.
The reserve brigade (mostly light, foot mobile infantry) would have been used in Korea as rear area security most likely and supported by M113's and M113MRVs (Scorpion turrets). I'd like to see some New Zealanders there too as part of the Brigade, probably an artillery battery as occurred in Vietnam, or their light tanks (Scimitars?).

I think it also comes down to what is canon - I use the original release as canon so version 2.0 or 2.2 isnt canon to me anymor than 2013 is

I will take a look at the challenge articles - thanks for the heads up on those Leg! (by the way I hope you dont take offense at my using Leg - if you want I can use the full Legbreaker)

And I also agree with you that Australian forces overseas will be either volunteers who went to serve with British units or will be small in size - i.e. a battalion at most, posssibly just scattered companies


face it - even if they dont get into a shooting war with Indonesia they have a lot of coastline to patrol and a lot of refugees who will be trying to get there

The most likely Australians to be in Europe are in the British Army as part of the "Commonwealth Soldier" programme that would have been about 10% of the Army by 1995. Gives scope for a few fun characters.

Regarding the apparent inequality of Soviet nuclear distribution, I think it's fair to have a look at how we hung the Turks, Jugoslavs, and Romanians out to dry once the tactical exchange began as a rationale for why Australia got hit. Once the Soviets get the idea that the US isn't going to stand up for all the allies equally, the equation changes. Just look at the treatment Canada gets. Is GDW making a very unfavorable statement about the US and her willingness to stand up for her allies in the worst circumstances? Quite possibly. Alternatively, the nuclear exchange logic might be that an attack on Canada merits an attack on Czechoslovakia; an attack on Australia merits an attack on Vietnam. If so, then the Soviets have every reason to cut Australia's throat and dump the body in the river. What do they have to lose, really? Anyway, these are just speculations.

Could be a few exchange personnel here and there as well. I remember an issue of "Soldier" magazine not long after Gulf War 1 that had a picture of an Australian officer in Aussie camo uniform and slouch hat (is that the right term?) who had served with the 1st UK Armoured Division during its drive into Iraq.

Actually Vietnam may have been an afterthought in the GDW timeline - those three divisions sent there looked awfully tacked on the way they are presented

as if they forgto them earlier and put them there intending to have a module deal with them (possibly a Southeast Asia one involving Australia, Indonesia and Vietnam) and then never got it released

Considering how far out on a limb those troops are you would figure they would have been nuked for sure by the Chinese or the US - but they never got touched. (and frankly you would think the US would love to nuke northern Vietnam in a "lets get even with those SOB's" kind of event but we can say its really to get those pesky Russians)

Agreed. The nuclear exchange is the opportunity for the US to settle the score once and for all. What Agent Orange failed to do, 20-30 megatons distributed liberally across Vietnam might accomplish. Payback is a b****, the Joint Chiefs might say.

V2.x is a direct cut and paste from V1 for the most part. V2.x has only expanded on V1 and made a handful of adjustments to account for changes in equipment (the LAV-75/M8 for example). As far as the timelines are concerned. There's almost NO difference from November 1996.
Nope, try a platoon at best, and they certainly won't be sent anywhere after war with Indonesia breaks out, and even before then won't be sent to remote places such as Kenya where Australia has absolutely no interests to worry about.
We manage. Sometimes not well due to political interference, but when tensions increase, refugee boats tend to get "accidentally" sunk. Our greatest defence against an influx of refugees is the vast empty deserts refugees are likely to encounter. They may make it here, but it's extremely unlikely they'll survive long if they're not picked up by the authorities.
Yes, Slouch hat is the correct term.
WWIII is a lot different to WWII. 70 years ago, Australia still had a lot of emotional ties to the UK, today that's a distant memory for the most part. This is due mainly to the inability of the UK to assist Australia against the Japanese and Australia building closer defence ties with the US.

There will always be a few exchanges of officers and NCOs (there was a British Captain attached to my unit back in '91), but they're fairly few and far between - maybe one in a thousand. Given Australia's current regular army numbers just 30,000 personnel, we're talking about 30 on exchange. Add in Naval and RAAF and it's 59,000, so maybe 60 or so on exchange.
And that's world wide, not just to the UK.

Come WWIII a few observers may be deployed, and the 2.x Nautical & Aviation book has Australian UN peacekeepers in Cyprus, but besides that and the Australians mentioned as being in Korea (probably UN also) Australia simply doesn't have the manpower available, especially with the Indonesian conflict closer to home.

And besides small arms production and ship building, I don't believe we have any serious military industrial capacity. We're not going to be producing tanks, APCs, artillery, missiles, etc to equip additional forces (light infantry is the best we could manage). We don't even have enough APCs now to go around the reserve units (usually a single Squadron has to service an entire infantry Brigade) - most of the heavier equipment (rightly) being with the regular army.

I seem to recall the question of Australian / New Zealand (and other Commonwealth troops) fighting in the Twilight War under UK command has come up a few times before. Leg is spot on - the nature of the relationship between the UK and the Commonwealth has changed significantly since WWII and the days of Empire. With the exception of a handful of British overseas territories (such asthe Falklands) Commonwealth members are all independent States who would be under no obligation to get involved in the War (with the obvious exception of Canada, which is a member of NATO as well as the Commonwealth). Where Australian soldiers are serving overseas (including Korea) I agree that it would be under the auspices of the UN.

What you might see are ANZAC troops undertaking UN duties that would normally have been done by the UK to allow the UK troops to be deployed elsewhere - for example Leg references Australian forces in Cyprus. The UK usually has a number of troops assigned to UN duties in Cyprus (in addition to the Sovereign Base garrisons) - it's possible the Australians may have agreed to send some troops to Cyprus so the British forces could be sent elsewhere. There is past precedent for this - during the Falklands War the Royal New Zealand Navy took over the Royal Navy's Caribbean patrol so the RN ship tasked with that duty could join the South Atlantic Task Force.

Just to add further weight to this, I work with a guy who used to be a senior radar operator in the RAN. In 1982 the ship he was on was tasked to take over the Hong Kong patrol (or whatever it's called) to free up the RN frigate that was stationed there so it could join the Falklands taskforce.

While we weren't doing this in the timeframe of the Twilight War, we could have been producing light armoured vehicles. The facilities existed and the precedent had already been set in WW2 when we needed tanks and couldn't get them so we designed and manufactured the Sentinel cruiser tank. In 1996 British Aerospace Australian had the rights to the Shorland armoured car design. There was never enough demand for them so manufacture never commenced.

I agree with much of what you said Leg but I think they will send more like company size based on their current dispositions in Afghanistan. May be as little as an MP company or a single infantry company but you dont use the fuel it takes to send men over for just 30 men.

And Australia does have good production facilities for ships and subs - i.e. the current series of frigates and the Collins subs. So that could be where they prove beneficial to the US - as a place to repair their ships and refit them.

It could be where the special US/Australian relationships comes from that was in 2300AD. I.e. keeping the USN in business (especially if the US helped with Indonesia) was where it all started.

By the way - starting to put down some words on screen (who puts down words on paper anymore by the way?) about the Papuan New Guinea armed forces and a possible start to an Indonesian Australian War based on Papua New Guinea with Australian help doing an all out offensive to end the secession in Bougainville in early 1997 - and leaving themselves wide open to the Indonesians invading, thus starting that conflict.

Definitely a start in looking at an area that really wasnt in the game at all - and could make a great area for adventuring in 2000-2001 time period for Australian and New Zealand characters.

Someone put this T2K Australian ORBAT up a while back. Its very detailed but does anybody think its realy sustainable?


1st Australian Armoured Division
Subordination: I Australian Corps
Current Location: Ahvaz, Iran
Manpower: 5,000
Major Weapons: 46x Waler-120, 7x M1A2, 2x M1A1

History: A pre-war regular division known as the 1st Division with 1st Brigade (Mechanised) based in Darwin, NT, 2nd Brigade (Motorised) in Sydney, NSW and 6th Brigade (Motorised) in Brisbane, Qld. The full division was upgraded to armoured status and brought to a combat ready state during the defence build-up of 1995 and 1996. In early 1997 the division was deployed to the Middle East as the core component of the Australian contribution to the widening war between the West and the Soviet Union. The division came under the control of the US Central Command when it arrived at Saudi Arabian ports in February 1997. Attached to the US XVIII Airborne Corps the division was deployed to Iran, disembarking at the port of Abadan on May 3rd and deploying to combat straight off the boat. The division passed through the hard pressed US 82nd Airborne Division to drive the Soviet 104th Guards Air Assault Division out of its positions at Khorramshahr. Several Soviet counter attacks against the Khorramshahr/Abadan pocket were repelled after the 82nd Airborne was withdrawn. In concert with the US 24th Infantry Division (Mechanised) the division attacked northwards from early June towards Ahvaz as part of the US Congress mandated offensive. The attack stalled at the end of July when Soviet forces counterattacked. The division covered the withdrawal of the 24th Infantry from Ahvaz and was itself forced back to Khorramshahr. Tactical nuclear weapons were first used in late August and the division suffered heavy casualties from these weapons. After repelling a Soviet 7th Guards Army attack on October 6th the division launched limited counterattacks to tie down Soviet forces in support of Operation Pegasus II, the allied deep offensive. In late October the division began its drive on Ahvaz, overrunning the Soviet 261st Motorised Rifle Division and cutting off the badly mauled Soviet 24th Guards Motorised Rifle Division which was destroyed by the 24th Infantry. While the 24th Infantry took Ahvaz, the division leapfrogged northwards capturing Dezful. By the new year the two divisions had secured the entire Khuzestan Plain and linked up with the 82nd Airborne. On 26/1/98 the division linked up with the newly deployed 2nd Australian Armoured Division and the New Zealand Division to form I Australian Corps. Most of 1998 was spent in local security missions attempting to deal with the growing crisis caused by the GNE of late 1997. The Soviet 7th Guards Army launched another offensive in early August but this attack was repelled. In June 1999 the Soviets again launched an offensive but this faltered because of the collapse of their Iraqi allies leaving the Australians in control of the Khuzestan Plain.

2nd Australian Armoured Division
Subordination: I Australian Corps
Current Location: Dezful/Shushtar, Iran
Manpower: 5,500
Major Weapons: 48 x Waler-AGV

History: The division headquarters was formed 18/11/95 at Holsworthy Barracks, NSW and took under command the pre-war reserve 11th Brigade based in Townsville, Qld and the 13th Brigade from Perth, WA. The newly formed 1st Armoured Brigade in Sydney, NSW, brought the division to full strength. Mobilised under the general mobilisation order after the first US troops crossed the East German border in December 1996, the division was brought to full strength and began intensive training for conversion to armoured levels. The division was deployed along with the headquarters of I Australian Corps to Saudi Arabia during June/July 1997 to reinforce US Central Command and the 1st Australian Armoured Division. The division was responsible for security of the vital Saudi Arabian ports and oil fields along the north west coast of the Persian Gulf. Deployed to Iran on the eve of 1998 the division linked up with the 1st Australian Armoured under I Australian Corps control. After defeating two separate Soviet attacks the division has remained as a security force for the Khuzestan Plain, vital for its agriculture.

3rd Australian Armoured Division
Subordination: III Australian Corps
Current Location: Central NSW
Manpower: 14,000
Major Weapons: 98 x Waler-AGV

History: The division was formed 26/1/96 at Victoria Barracks, Brisbane with three brigades, the 2nd Armoured based in Wagga Wagga, NSW, the 3rd Armoured based in Woodside, SA and the 4th Armoured based in Puckapunyal, VIC. The division was deployed to South Australia, where it took advantage of this state’s large military training areas and defence infrastructure to train and equip for mechanised combat. SA was hit the hardest by the GNE with eight nuclear warheads detonating within 24 hours on "Ash Sunday," November 2, 1997, causing considerable destruction and nuclear fallout. The GNE and subsequent chaos decimated 7th Division and it was almost destroyed during its attempts to bring order to SA. The division was pulled out as part of the general evacuation of Adelaide during the summer of 97/98 and was transferred to Puckapunyal, Vic for rest and refitting. Once it was ready for operations again, in late 1999, the division was used to cover the general evacuation from the interior of Australia. Since then the 7th Division has provided the primary covering force for the line of control through central NSW and south eastern Queensland. The divisions main role is long range fire sweeps into uncontrolled areas, assisting local governments and trying to wipe out marauder groups and challenges to Australian Theatre’s authority.

1st Australian Division
Subordination: III Australian Corps
Current Location: Victoria
Manpower: 16,000
Major Weapons: 14x Leopard 1

History: The division was formed as a reserve formation on 26/1/96 at Victoria Barracks, Melbourne with three brigades; the 14th based in Melbourne, Vic, the 15th based in Puckapunyal, Vic and the 16th with units across SA, WA and Tas. The division was mobilised on 1/1/97 and tasked with the security of southern and central WA including Perth, Kalgoorlie and the Pilbara. The division was severely damaged by the nuclear strikes on the Perth region and suffered heavy casualties trying to quell civil disturbance during the summer of 97/98. After the division’s positions in the west became untenable it was withdrawn to Victoria in late 1998. The division was brought up to full strength during a spell of rest and recovery at Puckapunyal Barracks, Vic. Australian Theatre then allocated the division the ‘fire brigade’ role for security in the 3rd Military District area.

2nd Australian Division
Subordination: II Australian Corps
Current Location: Ceram, Ambon, Morotai, Halmahera and Timor
Manpower: 7,500
Major Weapons: 10x Leopard 1, 8x OH-58D

History: A pre-war reserve division with 5th Brigade based in Sydney, NSW, 7th Brigade in Brisbane, Qld and 8th Brigade in Newcastle, NSW. The division was upgraded to ready reserve status (about half full time personnel) and brought to a combat ready state during the defence build-up of 1995 and 1996. Mobilised in December 1996 as the US entered the war against the Soviet Union the division was deployed in security roles across North Eastern Australia. The division deployed its 7th Brigade to Papua New Guinea (PNG) in late 1997 to quell increasing urban and rural violence caused by the global destruction of the general nuclear exchange (GNE). When Indonesia attacked PNG in January 1998 the 7th Brigade held of the Indonesian 17th and 18th Airborne Brigades’ assault on Port Moresby. Reinforced by the rest of 2nd Division the Australian and PNG counterattack overrun the remaining Indonesian forces south of the highlands during operations in February. 2nd Division, reinforced by the 1st and 3rd Battalions of the Royal Pacific Islands Regiment then began a series of amphibious and airmobile strikes against the Indonesian cantonments across the northern shore of PNG. On the 3rd July 1998 the division captured Jayapura in West Papua (Irian Jaya) nominally Indonesian territory. Coming under II Australian Corps, the now veteran 2nd Division became the main force in the 1999 offensive into Eastern Indonesia. This offensive quickly captured the rest of West Papua, the Moluccan Islands and East Timor. The Australian forces meet little effective resistance as most of the Indonesian battle ready units, warships and combat aircraft had been destroyed the year before in Papua New Guinea. In fact many of the local communities greeted the Australians as liberators from Javanese control. 2nd Division spent the rest of 1999 and most of 2000 establishing II Corps authority across the newly occupied Indonesian territory. With the growing schism between II Corps commanding general MAJGEN Thurston and the Governor-General, Australian Theatre Commander and effective head of what is left of a central Australian government, GEN Walker, 2nd Division has declared its support to II Corps. The division is no longer responding to orders directly from Northern Command or Australian Theatre, it is only loyal to II Corps.

3rd Australian Division
Subordination: Northern Command
Current Location: North and North West Australia
Manpower: 10,000
Major Weapons: 10x Leopard 1, 6x OH-58D

History: A pre-war reserve division the 3rd included the 4th and 12th Brigades in Melbourne, Vic and the 9th Brigade in Adelaide, SA. The division was called out on 20 December 1996 as the war in China and Germany escalated into global conflict. Deployed to the Northern Territory and North West WA the division became the primary security force of Northern Command. The GNE hardly effected the division, as all nuclear strikes on Australia were to the south of its operational area and prevailing monsoonal winds at this time were northerly. Also the low population of northern Australia meant the division was spared the heavy toll of the post GNE disease outbreaks and civil disruption. The division is still controlling the Northern Command enclaves at the vital resource extraction centres across North Western Australia.

4th Australian Division
Subordination: II Australian Corps
Current Location: Papua New Guinea, Irian Jaya, Far North Queensland
Manpower: 10,000
Major Weapons: 4x OH-58D

History: The division was formed 26/1/96 at Victoria Barracks, Sydney with three brigades, the 16th based in Sydney, NSW, the 17th based in Brisbane, Qld and the 18th based in Newcastle, NSW. The division was filled with many ready reserve soldiers and recalled ex-servicemen, all with at least one years full time service, which enabled the division to come to a combat ready level reasonably quickly. The division took over security roles for the South Eastern corner of Australia during 1997 and was being prepared for service in the Middle East when the GNE caused considerable destruction. The division was able to avoid direct damage from the nuclear exchange but was heavily pressed in diaster relief and, at sometimes, quite brutal suppression of civil disorder. With the south east generally calm after the summer of 97/98 and with the 3rd Australian Armoured Division, 5th and 6th Australian Divisions deployed in the area, the 4th was moved by sea to PNG to reinforce II Australian Corps for the counteroffensive against the Indonesian forces. While 2nd Australian Division moved down the northern coast of PNG, 4th Division assaulted Indonesian forces on Manus Island and then prepared for the assault against Rabual. The two Australian brigades that landed at Rabual, not only faced the defending Indonesian brigade but the full fury of a volcanic eruption. The Rabual area was evacuated after 4th Division quickly offered diaster relief to the local population and most of the Indonesian forces that had surrendered after being caught between the ‘the frying-pan and the fire-place’. While 2nd Division moved into Eastern Indonesia in early 1999, 4th Division took up a rear area security task. This was no easy mission since it was responsible for the entire New Guinea Island; the world’s second largest island with the most rugged terrain in the world. 4th Division is still in control of New Guinea and is in fact the only effective authority in this region, something which II Corps exploits to the full. The division is no longer responding to orders directly from Northern Command or Australian Theatre; it is only loyal to II Corps.

5th Australian Division
Subordination: III Australian Corps
Current Location: East NSW
Manpower: 16,000
Major Weapons: 0

History: The division was formed on 25 April 1997 and was primarily made up of newly trained conscripts, though its 28th Brigade and some divisional elements comprised pre-war reserve training units. The division was tasked with security for the state of New South Wales and was intended to relieve the 3rd Australian Division in northern Australia, so that this formation could be deployed to the Middle East. The GNE and the Indonesian invasion of PNG ended these plans and the 5th Division has stayed on in NSW providing local security and disaster relief since its formation. The division was brought up to strength in early 1999 by comb-outs of surplus Navy and Air Force personnel. The division currently forms a border guard force across the ‘Newell Line’ in central NSW.

6th Australian Division
Subordination: III Australian Corps
Current Location: South East Queensland
Manpower: 14,000
Major Weapons: 0

History: The division was formed on 25 April, 1997 and was primarily made up of newly trained conscripts, with some divisional elements comprising pre-war reserve training units. The division was tasked with security for the state of Victoria and was intended to relieve the 2nd Australian Division in northern Australia and PNG, so that they could be deployed to the Middle East. The GNE and the subsequent Indonesian invasion of PNG ended these plans and the 6th Division was deployed to Queensland to secure the supply lines to II Corps in PNG. While the division was readied to deploy to PNG, the success of the Australian counter invasion meant it wasn’t required and since the required transport wasn’t available anyway the division stayed in South and Central Queensland. The division was forced to withdraw to the south east corner of Queensland due to increasing lawlessness and now forms a powerful guard force against any incursions into the controlled zone.

The New Zealand Division
Subordination: I Australian Corps
Current Location: Khorramshahr, Iran
Manpower: 3,500
Major Weapons: 10x M1A1

History: The ‘fireball’ division was formed on 10 February, 1997, comprising the 4th and 7th Brigades and was deployed to the Middle East as reinforcements to the 3rd Australian Expeditionary Force later in the year. All division elements had arrived in Saudi Arabian ports by October 1997. The division is made up of motorised and mechanised infantry, equipped with HMMWV and M113 vehicles, the divisional armoured regiment is a mix of Scorpion light tanks and M1s supplied by the US Army. The division has been under I Australian Corps since early 1998 and has partaken in all the battles for the Khuzestan Plain area of Iran.

1st Military District
Subordination: Australian Theatre
Current Location: South East Queensland
Manpower: 10,000
Major Weapons: 6x Leopard 1

History: A pre-war administrative command responsible for an area roughly aligned to the state of Queensland. Headquartered in Victoria Barracks, Brisbane the district took over all remaining civil authority as well as local naval and air forces in Queensland on 1/1/99. Given the regional security role several battalions of local infantry were raised across the district to provide local defence. These forces operated on a one month active/one month inactive rotation. Due to infrastructure damage and increasing lawlessness the districts area of authority has been reduced to an area south east of a line from the town of St. George to the coast at Bundaberg with a small enclave around Rockhampton and Gladstone.

2nd Military District
Subordination: Australian Theatre
Current Location: East NSW
Manpower: 45,000
Major Weapons: 0

History: A pre-war administrative command responsible for an area roughly aligned to the state of New South Wales. Headquartered in Victoria Barracks, Sydney the district took over all remaining civil authority as well as local naval and air forces in NSW on 1/1/99. The district’s area of authority has been reduced to the area east of the Newell Highway in central NSW. Several inland cantonments are under military authority but beyond these areas and the periodic fire sweeps most of NSW is on its own.

3rd Military District
Subordination: Australian Theatre
Current Location: Victoria
Manpower: 40,000
Major Weapons: 0

History: A pre-war administrative command responsible for an area roughly aligned to the state of Victoria. Headquartered in Victoria Barracks, Melbourne the district took over all remaining civil authority as well as local naval and air forces in Victoria on 1/1/99. The district controls virtually all of the state of Victoria, except for a few isolated areas.

5th Military District
Subordination: Northern Command
Current Location: South West Western Australia
Manpower: 6,000
Major Weapons: 0

History: A pre-war administrative command responsible for an area roughly aligned to the state of Western Australia. Headquartered in Irwin Barracks, Perth the district took over all remaining civil authority as well as local naval and air forces in Western Australia on 1/1/99. The 5th Military District has been reduced to the area between Perth and Albany in the south-west corner of WA. Also some cantonments in the north centred on the Pilbara are under the control of a brigade from the 3rd Australian Division. The district is under heavy pressure from the wild lawless elements operating out of Kalgoorlie-Boulder and is maintaining its area of control through particularly harsh martial law.

6th Military District
Subordination: None
Current Location: Tasmania
Manpower: 5,000
Major Weapons: 0

History: A pre-war administrative command responsible for an area aligned to the state of Tasmania. Headquartered at Battery Point, Hobart the district took over all remaining civil authority as well as local naval and air forces in Tasmania on 1/1/99. However after this date the district ceased responding to central authority on the Australian mainland. The district controls most of Tasmania on a collective basis with local civilian authorities and is intent on ignoring the rest of the world, beyond the odd mainland, Japanese and French trading vessel.

1st Cavalry Brigade
Subordination: I Australian Corps
Current Location: Khuzestan Plain, Iran
Manpower: 800
Major Weapons: 20x Waler-AGV

History: The brigade headquarters was formed 17/10/95 at Puckapunyal, Vic and took under command pre-war reserve armoured regiments from NSW and newly formed units. The brigade was structured and trained as an armoured reconnaissance formation on a TO&E very similar to a US Army Armoured Cavalry Regiment. Fully equipped with modern vehicles the brigade deployed to the Middle East with Headquarters I Australian Corps to act as its heavy reconnaissance and screening force. While I Corps secured Saudi ports the brigade was attached to 1st Australian Armoured Division in Iran. The brigade entered combat against Soviet mechanised forces in support of Pegasus II offensive. 1st Cavalry Brigade operated as far north as Kabir Kuh in support of 1st Armoured Division’s drive on Dezful. In 1998 the brigade patrolled the Iraqi border with frequent cross border operations to disrupt Iraqi logistic support of Soviet forces. The brigade suffered heavy casualties in the July 1999 Soviet offensive and it was temporary cut off by advancing Iraqi divisions. However remaining a fighting force behind Iraqi lines contributed to their collapse and the depleted brigade was able to link up with the rest of I Corps. After rest and refit the brigade has taken on a ‘fire brigade’ mission to reinforce threatened areas of the Khuzestan Plain.

2nd Cavalry Brigade
Subordination: Northern Command
Current Location: Darwin, NT
Manpower: 2,500, 1,000 cavalry
Major Weapons: 14x Waler-AGV

History: The brigade was formed 26/1/96 at Robertson Barracks, Darwin, NT as Northern Command’s reconnaissance formation. The 2nd Cavalry was never brought up to full mechanised scales with half of its squadron’s relaying on motorised transport.

3rd Cavalry Brigade
Subordination: III Australian Corps
Current Location: Dubbo, NSW
Manpower: 2,000 cavalry
Major Weapons: 0

History: The brigade was raised on 12/3/99 at Puckapunyal, Vic as a fully horse mounted formation.

3rd Infantry Brigade (Airborne)
Subordination: II Australian Corps
Current Location: Cairns, Queensland
Manpower: 1,500
Major Weapons: 10x OH-58D

History: A pre war regular brigade headquartered at Lavarack Barracks, Townsville, Qld. The 3rd Brigade was kept at a high state of readiness as Australia’s strategic reserve until April 1996 when it was deployed in a lightning strike against Bougainville separatists in PNG. The brigade combined with local forces and carried out a successful strike on the separatists and was able to re-open the contested Pangua copper mine. The brigade returned to Townsville, Qld in early 1997 and resumed its role as a regional ready reaction force. In response to the Indonesian invasion of PNG the brigade launched a successful airborne assault on Wewak, PNG. From this base the brigade was able to disrupt Indonesian lines of communication through the successful counterattack by PNG forces and the 2nd and 4th Divisions. During the successful counter invasion of eastern Indonesia in early 1999, the brigade was responsible for capturing East Timor. The brigade launched its second airborne assault on the town of Biablo from where it interdicted East and West Timor. Local counterattacks from Indonesian security forces were defeated by the brigade linking up with local anti Indonesian forces. The brigade was withdrawn to Cairns, Qld in October 1999 and replaced in East Timor by units of the 2nd Division. The brigade now serves as a reserve force for II Australian Corps and is no longer accepting orders from Northern Command or Australian Theatre.

The Special Air Service Regiment
Subordination: I Australian Corps
Current Location: Dezful, Iran
Manpower: 350
Major Weapons: 0

History: The regimental headquarters of the Australian SAS was deployed to the Middle East to take operational control over several special forces sub-units.

1st Commando Regiment
Subordination: II Australian Corps
Current Location: Port Moresby, PNG
Manpower: 250
Major Weapons: 0

7th Commando Regiment
Subordination: Australian Theatre
Current Location: Sydney, NSW
Manpower: 400
Major Weapons: 0

The Tactical Assault Group (SAS)
Subordination: Australian Theatre
Current Location: Melbourne, Vic
Manpower: 200
Major Weapons: 0

The Tasmanian Defence Brigade
Subordination: 6th Military District
Current Location: Tasmania
Manpower: 2,500, 1,000 cavalry
Major Weapons: 0

Afghanistan is not a good basis for comparison, it's nothing like the commitment we'd have with the Twilight War (we can concentrate resources in Afghanistan that would not be available in the Twilight War).
However, I agree that it simply would not be worth the fuel to send anything smaller than a Company anywhere.

Our Military Police don't operate in the same manner as US Army MP Companies do, the MPs are usually sent in small groups to where ever they are required. They don't have the assets or personnel to do something like convoy escort like the US MPs do.

It's very nice but too much of a "wish-list" I think. While Australia in that timeline might be able to raise the levels of manpower listed here, there's too many vehicles. The mention of the Waler vehicle infers some level of local manufacture and considering the numbers quoted it would be significant manufacture.

I think that the Waler listed here is meant to be the new armoured vehicle from Project Whaler of the mid-1980s. In real-life, bureaucrats and arm-chair strategists decided the Australian Army didn't need a medium/heavy protected troop carrier so the project went nowhere.

I just don't see that with the disorganized state of Australia (and lack of central control) as listed in the main books, that the Federal Government could muster the resources or manpower to supply such a massive army (these figures total about 220,000) in the Twilight War.

I looked at the order of battle and I think its too big for what Australia could put in the field unless they totally mobilized the country and even then not sure they could equip it.

And I dont see Australia getting hit by nukes in the timeline - they just arent that good a target for nukes when places like Chicago never got touched - let alone important military production facilities like the United Defense plant in York PA or Anniston Army Depot.

They just arent a real threat to the Soviets as they are.

Now once Australia starts being very important to the US once a lot of their facilities in the US are getting either abandoned or overrun by marauders - sure - but thats not till late 1998 early 1999 - and by then both countries are done with using nukes for the most part.

Plus - if Australia is wiped out by nukes or collapses I dont see the special relationship in 2300 AD happening - but having them there to help the US restart again thats different - even if a lot of the interior of the country ends up looking like Mad Max due to fuel shortages for a few decades.

Could I see Australia raising perhaps 5-6 Divisions of men - yes that could be done as long as arms could be found for them - even if a lot of them are armed with civilian weapons initially or civilian vehicles converted to military use (they sure have enough good off road vehicles)

And with the coal reserves they have getting power for their industry shouldnt be that much of an issue.

Australia actually does have a significant vehicle production capacity. General Dynamics builds the ASLAV in Adelaide and Thales Australia makes the Bushmaster & Hawkei in Bendigo and Wingfield, and there are commercial car and light vehicle factories in Adelaide (GM-Holden), Melbourne (Ford, IVECO, Toyota) and Geelong (Ford), a truck factory in Brisbane (Mack) and engine factories in Geelong (Ford) and Melbourne (GM-Holden).

You have to take into account that for the armoured vehicles mentioned, the factories were not even in the construction phase let alone ready for production in the time period covered by Twilight: 2000. Also, some of the truck plants mentioned didn't come about until the mid-late 1990s and later and they don't produce a lot of vehicles - production has only risen to 7000/year in the late 2000s.

There was also significant loss of production in the 1990s due to the growth of the Korean car manufacturers and the end of Nissan production in Australia in 1992. The cheaper Korean imports caused major losses for local car makers and they cut the number of models offered and staff numbers to save money. It was widely felt in the early 1990s that the Australia auto industry would be in major decline by the 2000s

We are undoubtedly able to produce armoured vehicles, design studies were conducted in the 1980s when Project Whaler was being examined and they found that we had all the necessary infrastructure but were somewhat lacking in experience.
Having the infrastructure was one thing, political will and military necessity are other things again and at the time the political will was lacking. Nothing was really done to address this until the late 1990s - outside the timeframe of Twilight: 2000.

For example, I believe the ASLAV production in South Australia was begun in the early 2000s. The Global War On Terror gave the Australian Government the political will to invest in these facilities but for the Twilight War, I'd argue that the Australian Government would probably feel insulated from the war in Europe and would not see any urgent need to commence our own armoured vehicle production until the war with Indonesia.

By that time, it would be too late. By 2000, the country as described in the books, is in a state of chaos with significant breakdown of central government. Starting a project to build armoured vehicles would be very much a localized affair suffering all the problems that that would entail. Certainly some projects may have been started in the 1996-2000 period but with the gradual breakdown of central authority, I can't see them having much more than a limited run of vehicles at best.

Small arms, grenades & other explosives, uniforms and light vehicles are another matter again. The infrastructure for these has existed for quite some time but they too would suffer after the breakdown of central authority because their components are often sourced from either outside the nation or in areas within the nation separated by large distances.

I think the plant at Bendigo was around during the Twilight War period and run by ADI Ltd. The Mack truck factory in Wacol QLD was built in 1972 and is now owned by Volvo. Also I think FIAT-IVECO were building trucks and plant machinery in Australia in the 1990s.


Chrysler and the British car makers are long gone but GM Holden and Ford have been in Australia since well before WW2 and are still going strong, in fact they seem to be doing better than the Japanese as Nissan and Mitsubishi are now gone leaving only Toyota.


Australia's defence industry has certainly been on an upswing since 2000, their even building ships for the US Navy at the moment. Although a lot of the infrastructure is new, a lot of it was also around in the 1990s. Outside of the 2300AD timeline there is little of nothing about what happens in Australia during the Twilight War from canon, so we dont know if it was nuked or how heavily it was nuked. But 2300AD does state that the Australian military survived and took control of the country, and if that is the case then factories that produced its guns, munitions, uniforms and sundaries are likely to have been well defended.