Quote:
Originally Posted by dragoon500ly
In any discussion of the Pacific War, sooner or later it turns into a discussion of just what might have happened had the largest Japanese battleship, HIJMS Yamato had met the largest USN battleship, USS Iowa in a toe-to-toe fight
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I've always wondered what might have been built if it the war had started a year later, or if the emergence of the aircraft carrier as the most important warship had been delayed a few years. If it had the Yamato would not have been the largest battleships affoat. Consider the opponents.
1) The British Lion Class: The Lions were the most restrained of the planned super battleships, and would have looked very much like the King George V class and were designed for a new pattern 16in triple gun mount that was never produced. 4 ships were planned and 2 were laid down before building was halted in 1940, and was cancelled in 1942.
Displacement: 40,550t standard; 46,300t deep load
Dimensions: 740ft pp, 785ft oa x 104ft x 30ft
Machinery: 4-shaft Parsons geared turbines, 8 Admiralty 3-drum boilers, 130,000shp = 30kts. Oil 3720t
Armor: Belt 15in-5.5in, bulkheads 13in-4in, barbettes 15in-12in, turrets 15in-6in, CT 4.5in-2in, main deck 6in-5in
Armament: 9-16in/45 (3x3), 16-5.25in/50 DP (8x2), 48-2pdr AA (6x8), 2 aircraft
The protection scheme of these ships was similar to the King George V, but with larger guns. These ships would have been formidable, not too different from the American North Carolina class but better protected and faster, and in fact better protected than the American Iowas, but with less range than both. There was also plans to build two later Lion Class in 1946 with a 50,000t standard displacement (56,500 full load). This version would have carried 9-16in guns (3x3) of a newer type with a firing interval of only 20 seconds. The secondary battery would have been 24-4.5in DP (12x2), and the AA battery was to be 60-40mm Bofors (10x6). Speed was intended to be about 29kts. The increased beam would have allowed better underwater protection than and the armor protection included a 14in belt and 4in-6in deck.
An even larger Super Lion was also planned of 59,100t standard, and 69,140 full load, but still retained the same basic armament with more AA guns. The area of ship protected by armor would have been increased, and fuel oil capacity was increased for greatly increased range. The Lion Class would have contested their ground with a Yamato, although maybe not beaten it. But the later Lion Class versions would certainly have.
2) German H Class: The H class were a part of Germany's Z plan to build a balanced fleet and challenge British supremacy at sea. The first two ships were laid down in 1939, but were canceled shortly after. It was planned to build six of these ships.
Displacement: 55,453t standard; 62,497 deep load
Dimensions: 872ft wl, 911ft 5in oa x 122ft x 33ft 6in
Machinery: 3-shafts, 12 MAN double-acting 2-stroke 9cyl diesels, 165,000shp = 30kts
Armor: belt 11.75in-7in, deck3.25in-2in, armored deck 4.75in-4in,
torpedo bulkhead 1.75in,armored bulkheads 8.75in, main turrets 15.25-5in, secondary turrets 4in-1.5in, CT 15.25in
Armament: 8-16in/47 (4x2), 12-5.9in/55 (6x2), 16-4.1in/65 DP (8x2),
16-37mm/83 AA (8x2), 24-20mm AA (6x4), 6-21in TT (submerged), 4 aircraft
Considered to have been enlarged versions of the Bismarck Class. They had improved diesel machinery and 16in guns, but also some of Bismarcks faults with single purpose secondary guns, and poorly distributed armor, and the placement of the armored deck too low in the ship to protect her vital fire control and communications. They also had underwater torpedo tubes that compromises a ship's watertight integrity. However they also had internal subdivision which made them so difficult to sink, excellent fire control, a steady gun platform and excellent anti-torpedo protection. Hitler in one of his mad moments wanted to radically change later versions of this ship with 20in guns and a dispacement of over 100,000t. The H Class would have been formidable ships but not as good as the Lion Class.
3) Soviet Sovyetskiy Soyuz Class: Four ships was authorized in 1938, and three were actually laid down. Construction was halted in 1940 after two were 75% complete. All three hulls were broken up in later 1940's.
Displacement: 59,150t standard; 65,150t deep load
Dimensions: 889ft 1in oa x 127ft 7in x 33ft 6in
Machinery: 3-shaft turbo-electric drive, 231,000shp = 28kts
Armor: Belt 16.75in, deck 8.75in, turret faces 19.5in
Armament: 9-16in/50 (3x3), 12-6in/50 (6x2), 8-4in/56 DP (4x2),
32-37mm/67 AA (8x4), 8-.50in MG, 4 aircraft
The Sovyetskiy Soyuz class would have been formidable opponents, although they sacrificed some speed and retained only a 9 gun main battery. With their huge beams they would have been very steady gun platforms, and their armor protection approached the Yamato class. However their fire control systems and rangefinder would likely have been inferior to both German and Japanese opponents. The Sovyetskiy Soyuz Class was the nearest of the super battleships to have been actually built, and statisticaly would have been a match for the German H Class although maybe not a Yamato.
4) American Montana Class: Five Montana's were authorized in 1940 but construction was suspended in 1942, and canceled in 1943.
Displacement: 60,500t standard; 70,500t full load
Dimensions: 890ft wl, 925ft oa x 121ft x 36ft 8in full load
Machinery: 4-shaft turbines, 8 boilers, 172,000shp = 28kts full load. Oil 7300t, range 15,000nm at 15kts
Armor: Belt 16.1in-10.2in on 1in STS, internal belt 7.2in-1in, armor deck 6in-7.35in with 2.25 in weather deck and. 62-.75in splinter deck, bulkheads 15.3in, barbettes 18in-21.3in, turrets 22.5in face, 9.15in roof, 10in side, 12in rear, CT 18in with 7.25in roof
Armament: 12-16in/50 (4x3), 20-5in/54 DP (10x2), 32-40mm AA (8x4), 20-20mm AA (20x1), 3 aircraft
The Montana's were the best American battlehips ever designed, and their 16in/50 gun was probably the best battleship gun ever produced. It threw the super heavy 2700lb armor piercing shell 42,345 yards. For comparison, the Japanese 18.1in/45 gun threw a 3200lb armor piercing shell 45,960 yards. The American gun weighed less, allowing the Montana's to carry 12 of them, for a broadside weight of 32,400lbs. The Yamatos could only carry nine of the 18.1in guns on a similar size hull with similar armor and speed. Yamato's broadside weight was 28,800lbs. Montana's new 5in/54 DP secondary guns were superior in range and striking power to the older 5in/38. Her AA battery was well laid out with good arcs of fire for the guns. And the 40mm Bofors was better than anything the Japanese Navy had, and her light battery was superior to Yamato's. Montana and Yamato were protected to similar standards, but the quality of American armor was considered to be of a higher standard. Also Montana's were protected against their own 2700 lb shells between 18,000 and 31,000 yards. Montana's great beam and a reversion to a scheme similar to the North Carolinas gave it protection against torpedo attack. U.S. fire control with radar control, outclassed any German or Japanese battleship, although the 15 meter rangefinders of the Yamato class ws still the best optical design. The Montana was the best of all the super-battleships designed or built, and would have proven too great of an opponent for the Yamato. The only battleship that might have realy taken it on was one of the later British Lion Class.