[Louied]

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

Louie, thanks for sharing this.

Trying to come up with a workable T2K orbat for the British Army has always been a challenge in my experience and often ends up being a case of robbing Peter to pay Paul, particularly if one tries to pay lip service to the mess that is the canon British Army order of battle (or at least Regular Army order of battle).

I agree, but I can't fault the developers, I have almost every book from the 1980's and a fair few U.S. Army/Rand/CIA papers that had anything to do with the British Military of the time....none get it exactly correct. I didn't realize this until I started buying Regimental Journals, they gave me clues that I used to start FOI requests. Between documents from Kew
and the FOI answers I have discovered a whole new level of information.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

I do have some reservations about your suggestion to boost numbers with Gurkhas and Eastern European immigrants. I guess I don't see the latter providing the numbers required to make good any shortfalls. In the case of the former I completely agree that there would be a steady stream of potential recruits available but I see large scale recruitment of additional Gurkhas being a potential political issue - there's always been the argument that Gurkhas are mercenaries (for the record they're not. Period) and the larger the numbers the stronger I think that narrative becomes. Unless you're talking about only raising Gurkha incremental Companies to back fill British Battalions so the same numbers are recruited but they're more spread out so not so noticeable...

Rainbow, I'm not suggesting wholescale recruitment of Gurkhas, but according to SGTTUK, when the Sino-Soviet War started in August 1995 and the Army went on full alert, I can see the return of all the 2nd Bns (which would give us eight), perhaps a Para Bn or Coy, and full Engr, Logs, & Signal Regts/Sqns. Additionally perhaps an artillery regt. Basically all this had existed prior to 1969 and the artillery regt was planned but the Malayan Emergency put it into abeyance.

I am thinking along the lines of some Bns possibly getting Gurkha Incremental Coys.

As for the Eastern Europeans, I was just trying to point out that IRL the Demographic Trough that was expected did not occur because of this immigration. Though it did not occur I don't think it would have boosted numbers in any meaningful way. For T2K purposes I would say that it just let the Army soldier on without having to make any cuts.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

Another potential solution is incremental companies drawn from areas where recruitment was strong - there's a passage in (I think) Sir Richard Dannatt's autobiography where he discusses how during his time with the Green Howards they put an emphasis on recruiting to the point where they were the most overstrength Battalion in the entire Army so 'loaned out' a Company to another Battalion. if that could be replicated Army wide (possibly with an increase in salary / benefits to make an Army career more attractive) that could go some way to resolving manpower issues (if it's not Dannatt's book it's Mike Jackson's).

Yes, the Green Howards put so much effort into recruitment (each Regt had a Recruiting Team, even though evrryone was trained at The King's Div Depot) that they were able to form an additional (fourth) Rifle Coy in 1990/91. I agree, if replicated Army wide Regts such as the Queen's, which was in a parlous state even though it had three Bns, could be rectified.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

Of course, all of these solutions come at a cost, which brings us back to the political aspect and is why I don't see any major efforts to do anything about lack of manpower until we're almost at the eve of War (possibly the start of the Sino - Soviet War could be the catalyst, in the same way that the Ukraine War prompted Germany to increase defence spending).

I agree, assume that during the August-October 1995 alert the UKCICC looks at what they need and begins to implement modest changes before November 1996.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

Another solution is attempts to achieve peace in Northern Ireland earlier (bearing in mind the equivalent of a Division of Infantry were usually in NI at any given point in time) but that gets into a much bigger picture.

I see NI being the same as it was IRL

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

I can't wait for the home defence part...that's one circle that I could never really square.

Slowly working my way there.