Japan in Twilight 2000

[kato13]

IMO in 1996 Japan will begin cranking out military materials and Supplying them to China. Once the Korean peninsula goes hot they would supply that theater as well.

Japan produced military materials to support the United States during the Korean war which IIRC amounted to more than a quarter of their exports for a few years.

I cannot see them ignoring such a ripe economic plum of China if the Americans and Europeans are getting rich. If the US is willing to pay top dollar for supplies for the Korean theater I think Japan would be happy to take economic advantage of that situation. The reduced distances to both Korean and Chinese ports would make Japan's trade even more profitable.

This would move them up the Sov's target priority list IMHO.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

I think one should not under-estimate the bad feeling that the Russian have towards the Japanese due to a string of Russian defeats during the Russo-Japanese war along with the disputes over several islands. Nor the Japanese feelings towards the Russian for the capture of those islands, the dispute still causes tension 60 years after the Russians seized them.

I'm not saying that alone would cause the Soviet Union to use nuclear weapons against Japan but it would probably make any decision to attack Japan a little easier.

[General Pain]

I own a copy of the Finnish Sourcebook, it's in Finnish but it's ok for me because I'm bilingual in Finnish and English and can translate the text, like I did with the bit about Japan. If people like, I can post translated segments of the book. It's just that I'm not sure how the copyright laws work, and am afraid that I might be breaking some laws if I posted them here.
[/QUOTE]


I promise not to tell if you mail me a translated copy or a finish copy...preferably a translated copy...I don't think babelfish will do so much good

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by RN7

Well I don't understand your logic. On one hand your saying the Japanese constitution and general Japanese pacifism and apathy towards the military would deter a Soviet attack, yet on the other hand your saying that Japanese industrial centres, military targets and cities would still be attacked.

Of course it's nukeworthy. It's just not wipe of the face of the planet worthy.
There are far more important targets out there for a relatively limited number of nukes than attacking what may well be secondary, or even tertiary targets in an officially "pacifistic" country.

[headquarters]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

Of course it's nukeworthy. It's just not wipe of the face of the planet worthy.
There are far more important targets out there for a relatively limited number of nukes than attacking what may well be secondary, or even tertiary targets in an officially "pacifistic" country.

destroying several major metropolitan areas as well as targeting industry and disrupting imports will send the nation into a downward spiral that will quagmire it in anarchy and horror for decades .

No need to bring it down to 0 meters above sea level I would think .

all imho .

On the other hand , there could be made valid points that if this and that occurred the Japanese would be spared by the Soviets - for instance if they renounced their tie sto the west and bared their throats so to speak in submission to Kremlin.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

John, I'd like to ask if you could translate the following please: -

"TK-Kustannus otti käyttöön hienomman nimen FGH (Finnish Game House). Se teki ensimmäisen pelinsä kääntämällä GDW:n pelin Twilight 2000, joka käsittelee ydinsodan jälkeistä aikaa. Siihen julkaistiin myös kaksi suomalaisten tekemään lisäosaa . Twilight ilmeisesti rokotti resursseja niin paljon, että Seikkailijaa ilmestyi vain yksi numero (7)."

The best I can come up with using Google Translate is: -

"TK-cost imposed a fine name FGH (Finnish Game House). It was the first game by turning the GDW's game Twilight 2000, which deals with the post-nuclear war. It also released two additional part of the Finns do. Twilight apparently rokotti resources so much that the adventurer appeared in only one number (7)."

While that makes some sense, it isn't clear enough to really understand
I got the paragraph from here http://web.archive.org/web/200710130...&theme=Printer

The reason I ask is because I am trying to find if Finnish Game House still exists, (they published the Finnish Twilight: 2000 books) because it may be possible to get their permission to translate the important parts of the book. The best information about them I have been able to find is "A small Finnish publisher from 1990's. Has published mostly RPG's, such as Finnish versions of Cyberpunk, Paranoia and Stormbringer, but also some boardgames, like Illuminati." from http://72.233.16.130/boardgamepublis...ish-game-house


Even if they don't exist anymore, I think under fair use you could translate a certain percentage (I think it's approximately 30-40%) without worry as long as the appropriate credit is given and you aren't trying to make money from it.

[headquarters]

the Finnish books have always been especially alluring as they deal with Scandinavia and other aspects that the core books do not .

Any material translated would be great - so good luck to those working on this - all of us appreciate it .

As for the rights - perhaps an agreement could be made.

[Rainbow Six]

Originally Posted by RN7

Well if the Soviets respected Japanese neutrality why would they be using cruise missiles or airstrikes against Japan. And if you take out the space facilities your probably going to have to go after the nuclear programme as well and Japan's nuclear power stations.

I can't recall the exact quote, but canon makes it clear that several neutral nations are targeted by one side or the other during 1997, so neutraility in itself isn't going to protect any nation from nuclear attack. If a country has something worth nuking there is a high likliehood that it will be nuked...

Also, wouldn't the presence of US bases on Japanese soil seriously undermine any claim by the Japanese to be neutral? They are hosting beligerent forces, so I would have thought that makes them fair game for Soviet attack, be that nuclear or conventional.

[John Farson]

Originally Posted by StainlessSteelCynic

John, I'd like to ask if you could translate the following please: -

"TK-Kustannus otti käyttöön hienomman nimen FGH (Finnish Game House). Se teki ensimmäisen pelinsä kääntämällä GDW:n pelin Twilight 2000, joka käsittelee ydinsodan jälkeistä aikaa. Siihen julkaistiin myös kaksi suomalaisten tekemään lisäosaa . Twilight ilmeisesti rokotti resursseja niin paljon, että Seikkailijaa ilmestyi vain yksi numero (7)."

The best I can come up with using Google Translate is: -

"TK-cost imposed a fine name FGH (Finnish Game House). It was the first game by turning the GDW's game Twilight 2000, which deals with the post-nuclear war. It also released two additional part of the Finns do. Twilight apparently rokotti resources so much that the adventurer appeared in only one number (7)."

While that makes some sense, it isn't clear enough to really understand
I got the paragraph from here http://web.archive.org/web/200710130...&theme=Printer

The reason I ask is because I am trying to find if Finnish Game House still exists, (they published the Finnish Twilight: 2000 books) because it may be possible to get their permission to translate the important parts of the book. The best information about them I have been able to find is "A small Finnish publisher from 1990's. Has published mostly RPG's, such as Finnish versions of Cyberpunk, Paranoia and Stormbringer, but also some boardgames, like Illuminati." from http://72.233.16.130/boardgamepublis...ish-game-house


Even if they don't exist anymore, I think under fair use you could translate a certain percentage (I think it's approximately 30-40%) without worry as long as the appropriate credit is given and you aren't trying to make money from it.

In English it's: "TK-Kustannus renamed itself into the fancier FGH (Finnish Game House). It published its first game by translating GDW's post-nuclear war RPG Twilight 2000. Two Finnish-made additions were also published for it. Apparently, Twilight taxed resources so much that only one issue of Seikkailija (a magazine?) appeared (7)."

[John Farson]

Originally Posted by Rainbow Six

I can't recall the exact quote, but canon makes it clear that several neutral nations are targeted by one side or the other during 1997, so neutraility in itself isn't going to protect any nation from nuclear attack. If a country has something worth nuking there is a high likliehood that it will be nuked...

Also, wouldn't the presence of US bases on Japanese soil seriously undermine any claim by the Japanese to be neutral? They are hosting beligerent forces, so I would have thought that makes them fair game for Soviet attack, be that nuclear or conventional.

Correct. Japan can protest its neutrality all it likes, the Soviets (or Russians) will just take one look at all those juicy US bases in Japan and do unto Japan what they do unto Canada (and other non-nuclear US allied countries). Like others more knowledgeable than me have said, Japan will be nuked, and nuked badly. Like headquarters said, the Russians wouldn't even need to use that many nukes to wreck Japan for decades...

[Webstral]

Let's not forget that Japan is largely devoid of industrial resources. A little EMP to put out the nuke plants, and Japan's power grid will be a thing of the past. Tokyo will have to get it for the same reason that DC, London, Ottawa, Paris, Bonn, and Amsterdam got theirs.

Webstral

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by Webstral

Let's not forget that Japan is largely devoid of industrial resources. A little EMP to put out the nuke plants, and Japan's power grid will be a thing of the past. Tokyo will have to get it for the same reason that DC, London, Ottawa, Paris, Bonn, and Amsterdam got theirs.

Webstral

Paris wasn't nuked but that's only a matter of personnal chauvinism.

[Webstral]

The Soviets meant to nuke Paris, but all the fluffy bunnies playing on top of the missile ruined the launch, thereby cauising the warhead to detonate over Canada. When the Soviets tried again with an SLBM, frolicking dolphins valiently battered the missile with their noses, causing it to fly to the wrong target--which happened to be in England. The third attempt came from one of the few remaining nuclear-capable bombers in the Soviet arsenal. Sadly for the Soviets, the Tooth Fairy had a lot of business in Paris that night and caused the bomber to crash (and the weapon to detonate) in Germany. The Soviets made one more attempt with an IRBM. This time, the Irish, who have long harbored sentiments of fraternity and brotherhood with the French because they both dislike the Brits, sent their elite Leprechaun Strike Team to redirect the nuke. The little blighters meant the target to be in southern England. Faerie magic being somewhat unreliable, the best they could do was to destroy Brussels. You could blame the Irish for the destruction of Brussels, but we must remember that the Irish only helped the French because they both dislike the Brits. So really, you need to blame the British--which is what we of Irish blood always do anyway.

Having failed so many times to deal with France, the Soviets gave it all up as a bad job and consigned themselves to living under the rule of the next Napoleon, who was certain to emerge in a France that held a (preventably)commanding lead over her neioghbors in post-war Europe.

Webstral

[Targan]

Originally Posted by Webstral

The Soviets meant to nuke Paris, but all the fluffy bunnies playing on top of the missile ruined the launch, thereby cauising the warhead to detonate over Canada. When the Soviets tried again with an SLBM, frolicking dolphins valiently battered the missile with their noses, causing it to fly to the wrong target--which happened to be in England. The third attempt came from one of the few remaining nuclear-capable bombers in the Soviet arsenal. Sadly for the Soviets, the Tooth Fairy had a lot of business in Paris that night and caused the bomber to crash (and the weapon to detonate) in Germany. The Soviets made one more attempt with an IRBM. This time, the Irish, who have long harbored sentiments of fraternity and brotherhood with the French because they both dislike the Brits, sent their elite Leprechaun Strike Team to redirect the nuke. The little blighters meant the target to be in southern England. Faerie magic being somewhat unreliable, the best they could do was to destroy Brussels. You could blame the Irish for the destruction of Brussels, but we must remember that the Irish only helped the French because they both dislike the Brits. So really, you need to blame the British--which is what we of Irish blood always do anyway.

Having failed so many times to deal with France, the Soviets gave it all up as a bad job and consigned themselves to living under the rule of the next Napoleon, who was certain to emerge in a France that held a (preventably)commanding lead over her neioghbors in post-war Europe.

Glad to see it isn't just my campaign that contains supernatural elements

[Ironside]

Originally Posted by Webstral

So really, you need to blame the British--which is what we of Irish blood always do anyway.

Thanks - we love you too

[Webstral]

Sorry, Mo. Re-reading my post, I think I've crossed the line from ironic to rude. I should have simply stated that I believe the Soviets would have had better reasons to nuke Paris than not. Sorry, dude.

Webstral

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by Webstral

Sorry, Mo. Re-reading my post, I think I've crossed the line from ironic to rude. I should have simply stated that I believe the Soviets would have had better reasons to nuke Paris than not. Sorry, dude.

Webstral

Didn't take it as rude. I liked it. LOL

[Raellus]

A little spoiler from my Korea Sourcebook:

"In a poorly calculated bid to impede the flow of Allied reinforcements arriving by way of Japanese ports and airfields, North Korea began bombarding Japan with crude long-range ballistic missiles (armed with conventional warheads). Not only were the missiles inaccurate, failing to significantly impede Allied logistical operations, the barrage produced hundreds of civilian casualties, provoking the Japanese parliament to hastily amend Article 9 of its constitution in order to allow the combat deployment of JDF units overseas. For the first time since 1945, Japanese military forces would fight on foreign soil. Soon thereafter, the Japanese 1st Airborne Brigade was airlifted to South Korea, preceded by JAF air strikes on North Korean missile launch sites in and around Wonsan."

I also think the Soviets might still have their hearts set on regaining the Kuriles. So, yeah, between U.S. military bases in Japan, the historical beef regarding the Kuriles, the scenario posited above, and the Soviet's T2K resource denial policy vis-à-vis "neutral" nations, I can't see why the USSR wouldn't hit Japan pretty hard.

[Ewan]

Originally Posted by Raellus

A little spoiler from my Korea Sourcebook:

When do you think it will be released?

[Raellus]

Originally Posted by Ewan

When do you think it will be released?

It's hard to say but I reckon that it's at least 75% done, ATM. A lot of when it will be released is up to Marc Miller. He's approved the first draft but there can still be quite a lag between completion and release.

[.45cultist]

Originally Posted by Webstral

Welcome aboard, John.

Japan is a base for US and possibly Allied operations in the ROK, as has been pointed out. This is a perfectly adequate explanation for nuclear action against Japan. The Japanese Navy (Maritime Self Defense Force?) is supposed to work hand-in-hand with the USN against Soviet naval forces. Wherever the constitutional line is drawn, the Allies will push against it. The Soviets will notice.

At the risk of beating a dead horse, I will point to the nuclear treatment of Canada as a yardstick for how the Soviets will restrain themselves when it comes to the use of nuclear fires against non-nuclear Allies. The Soviets absolutely pasted Canada, which had no organic nuclear arsenal. Whether the US retaliated against the USSR or retaliated against a Warsaw Pact ally or other Soviet client is an open question. Nevertheless, the Soviets did far worse to Canada in terms of national damage than they did to the US. Japan, not having any of her own nukes and almost certainly having participated at some level in the fighting in the Far East, should expect the same leniency the Soviets showed non-nuclear, US-allied Canada.

I agree with you, John, that the 2300 AD line of a nearly intact Japan reflects little careful thought. I'm inclined to agree that Threads is a more accurate summary of the situation in Japan of 2000. On the plus side, imagine what a rich gaming environment Japan in 2000 would be!

Webstral

As of 1995 Japan is a nuclear ally with the components to build 60 or so buses IRL. In game terms this means a pre-emptive strike to prevent the assembly of the components is plausible. Also deploying Japanese military units would cause problems among the S0outh Koreans, the riots would certainly be hard on the infrastructure and public opinion, backlash would interfere in the war effort.

[mpipes]

I disagree with most of the above.

Japan would have been all in the Twilight War. Most likely, the Navy would have been actively been involved in convoy escort throughout 1995 and 1996. No matter how bad anti-Japan sentiment was in the run-up to WWIII, both the Chinese and the south Korean would have been APESHIT over the Russians invasion. Even Taiwan, in my view, would have been overwhelming pro-China in 1995.

With the outbreak of WWIII, whatever desire there was to remain neutral, everyone was going to make a choice. As I see things -
Philippines - China-US with the US back in the country using Subic and Marine units in China and Japan.
Vietnam - USSR but essentially out of the war by 1997
Australia/New Zealand - US-China-NATO with combat units in China and the Persian Gulf as well as a division in Europe
Japan - US-China-NATO with combat units and air units in both China and South Korea and some Spec Ops in Europe
South Korea - China - US
Taiwan - China - US
North Korea - USSR (seeing the USSR as the victor in 1996, they allow Russia to outflank Chinese defenses and attack from the China-Korean border, throwing in with the Russians and attacking into South Korea while the US was pre-occupied in Europe)
Thailand - pro-US-China neutral
Singapore - pro-US-China neutral
India - pro-USSR neutral
Cambodia - pro-China neutral
Pakistan - pro-US-China neutral
Malaysia - neutral
Indonesia - pro-USSR neutral, but at war with Australia

[mpipes]

Some items from my modified Timeline-----

1st major Japanese involvement....
On January 8th, NATO naval units initiate Operation Steel Bandit aimed at knocking out Vietnam’s Cam Rahm Bay, which is being used by Soviet naval and air units and sheltering belligerent shipping from NATO attack. The attacks smash port facilities and sink numerous ships. NATO loses are relatively light except for naval fighter units off participating U.S. carriers (USS Ranger, USS America, and USS Lincoln battle groups), which suffer heavy losses (45%) to swarms of defending SAMs and fighters, including very advanced Soviet MiG29S2 and Su35 fighters as well as obsolescent MiG21s, and a lot of AAA. The NATO force lands American, Japanese, Filipino, and Chinese Naval Infantry troops, who thoroughly wreck port facilities. A battalion of the 11th Airborne and a battalion of Japanese paratroopers make a joint combat drop supporting the raid as well; the first of many joint American-Japanese airborne operations in the war. Chinese forces also invade in the north, but this is only a limited incursion designed to eliminate any chance of a surprise Vietnam invasion of China. Numerous Tomahawk cruise missiles take out critical parts of the electric grid. Vietnam is left badly bloodied with all its major ports mined and most of its electrical grid destroyed, and its leaders wisely decide to reign in the Soviet survivors and passively sit out the remainder of the war.

Filipino, Taiwanese, and Japanese forces enter combat; North Korea bites too....
In late-January, the new American President Tanner makes several futile attempts to arrange for a cease-fire. President Tanner soon discovers the Soviets have no interest in halting the war, as the Soviets rebuff his attempts with a blunt vulgarity. About a week later, Soviet naval forces launch an amphibious and airborne assault against northern Japanese islands, seizing Sapporo and several smaller cities. Japanese forces are sorely pressed, and American and Filipino marine and army units arrive to reinforce the defenses. Bitter fighting ensues as the dug in Soviets refuse to yield.
On 27 January 1997, North Korea, under pressure from the Soviets, sends military units across the Chinese border to join the fight on the side of the Pact. The morning starts with three Soviet armored corps and two North Korean Corps (one mechanized and one infantry) crossing the northern border into China. A massive artillery bombardment of Seoul that evening precedes an invasion of South Korea with three armored, five mechanized, and sixteen infantry divisions of North Korea as well as recently upgraded Soviet Category A tank and motor rifle units (a bit more than a corps worth of units). China is shocked at this long time ally’s betrayal, as the large multi-corps Korean-Soviet force slices into the exposed southern flank of its forces, but Taiwan and Japan finally enter ground combat alongside China’s forces, with Japanese and Taiwanese mechanized units arriving in China before the end of the month.
After a chemical No Dong missile hits a U.S. base in Japan causing large numbers of U.S. dependent family casualties, there is a marked reluctance to take prisoners on the allied side including Americans. The origination base of the missile was obliterated by a massed B52 attack that night using 2000-lb bombs and 750-lb cluster bombs as well as the chemical weapons depot that was hit by B2As using laser-guided “smart” 2000-lb bombs. The ROK army, and Chinese for that matter, had not been taking prisoners for days by this time. In fact, only Japanese and British troops were much inclined to take North Korean troops prisoners after February, and that tendency grew rarer as the fighting grew ever more bitter. For the next month, the North Koreans make steady, but slow progress, even as more Soviet formations join the fighting on the Korean peninsula against the allied forces. The North Korean and Soviet army penetrates as far as 155 miles south of the DMZ, but the U.S. led alliance halts and begins forcing the North Koreans and Soviets back by April 1st. At the same time, the Soviet-Korean effort in China was floundering, as Chinese and allied units began pushing back against the invaders.

And the endgame begins for the Soviets in Korea and the Far East----
On July 5th, with advance elements of the German First Army on Soviet soil, the Soviets begin using tactical nuclear weapons. In the West, they are used sparingly at first, and for the first week are used only against troop concentrations no further than 50 kilometers from the Soviet border on former Belarus’ soil. In the Far East, the Chinese had launched a second major offensive for the summer, with Pact forces beginning major withdrawals all along the front as the offensive advances. The mobile elements of the Chinese Army begin a victorious pursuit, but the Soviets have decided to resort to nuclear weapons on a massive scale in China. Chinese mechanized columns are vaporized, caught in the open on the roads in imagined pursuit. Strike aircraft deliver warheads on the northern Chinese population and industrial centers still in Chinese hands. The Chinese response is immediate, but Soviet forward troop units are dispersed and well prepared. Ballistic missile attacks on Soviet population centers are frustrated by a small but active and, somewhat effective, ABM system, and the Soviet Air Defense Command (mostly) massacres the handful of Chinese bombers that attempt low-level penetration raids. Despite the losses, numbers of bombers make it through to bomb their targets. Chinese SLBMs, on the other hand, prove successful but limited in numbers, with the naval bases at Vladivostok, Mys Shmidta, and Fokino very heavily damaged. Other bases and logistic hubs in Siberia and the Arctic are hit by Chinese weapons as well. However, within a week, the Chinese riposte is spent, while Soviet attacks continue. The Chinese communication and transportation system, already stretched to the breaking point, disintegrates. The roads are choked with refugees fleeing from the remaining cities, all of them potential targets. Finally, China begins the rapid slide into anarchy and civil disorder.
Also on July 5th, with the Soviet’s just starting the use of nuclear weapons on Chinese units, China, desperate for the U.S. to establish contact with Chinese forces advancing toward the Korean border and Manchuria, and still furious with its former ally’s betrayal, expends 15 nuclear warheads on North Korean targets, destroying Pyongyang and Wonsan with 3.25 Mt bombs, as well as North Korea’s main government and military command bunkers, wiping out both the civilian government and military high command. The U.S. adds to the carnage with attacks by two Trident I SLBMs from a patrolling Franklin class SLBM in the Central Pacific on 28 priority Soviet and North Korean targets in and around the Korean and Chinese front as well as several strikes by F16C and F111E aircraft on other targets with B61 or B43 nuclear bombs. U.S. F19 strikes with SRAM IIs are also launched. Within 24 hours, the North Korean front collapses with the accompanying loss of its military high command and important remaining logistics stockpiles and supplies. Within four days, a combined American and South Korean force link up with surviving Chinese forces defending near the Korean border. Soviet combat forces and surviving North Korean units proximate to the Chinese border have taken a heavy beating and retreat into Soviet territory. The combined Allied force advances to pursue heading toward the remains of Vladivostok. Surprisingly, this U.S., Korean, and Chinese force advancing toward Vladivostok remains unmolested by nuclear weapons. A planned U.S. and Japanese amphibious landing on the Kurile Islands proceeds as planned on the early morning of July 12th, also without the use of nuclear weapons by either side.
The UK 8th Infantry Division and 181st Combat Brigade Team were attached to Chinese forces driving towards north-east China. In mid-July, both units were transferred to the 31st Army and finally linked up with the Americans on the Yalu River soon after. At this time, the Sino-Soviet nuclear exchange began, and the division and brigade both took losses from tactical nuclear strikes. The survivors were withdrawn, in surprisingly good order, into North Korea. The massive Soviet superiority in nuclear weapons shows and in addition to hitting military targets industrial and population centers are hit heavily in an attempt to knock China out of the war or at least get a breathing space to deal with NATO. Harbin and Biaystok are destroyed in nuclear strikes, but so are Soviet Omsk, Chita, and Chelyabinsk.
The Hong Kong Government orders the forming of the 3rd Royal Hong Kong Regiment (The Volunteers) for internal security (planning further units) and orders the 2nd to come under British command as part of 8th Infantry Division. As law and order break down in China, many troops in North Korea turn into marauders. With the countryside in such poor shape after the famines and nuclear exchanges, the North descends quickly into anarchy. Refugees try to flee south, but ROK troops in particular are harsh in stopping them. Other U.S. units operating further north alongside Chinese units run into trouble as Chinese lines collapse. The U.S. 7th Infantry Division (Light) is cut off by the collapse of the Chinese lines and only a few scattered remnants make it back to U.S. lines. The U.S. 45th Infantry Division is also cut off. Here the unit abandons much of its heavy equipment, siphoning fuel from many vehicles to get others enough to maneuver, and breaks out to rejoin II U.S. Corps. The U.S. 29th Infantry Division (Light) is less fortunate, as their breakout fails and the survivors are herded north into Soviet captivity.
On 12th July, Japan and the U.S. surprise the world by landing troops on the Kurile Islands. By the 15th, the Soviet garrison have engaged units of the Japanese Self Defense Force and U.S. troops from Okinawa move to support the Japanese. U.S. and Japanese aircraft hammer the SAM umbrella before B52s of the 60th and 441st Bomb Squadrons badly maul the 101st Guards Motor Rifle Division which withdraws to Sakhalin Island (which like the Kurile Islands was part of Japan occupied by the Soviets at the end of World War II and since disputed). As Japanese troops prepare to move on to Sakhalin in November, Soviet nuclear weapons hammer the Japanese mainland (taking care to avoid hitting the areas containing U.S. bases). Most Japanese troops are withdrawn to act as emergency relief, leaving only a small garrison, but one division remains to invade Sakhalin, bolstered by an ANZA brigade and a regiment of U.S. Marines. The evacuated Japanese troops are heavily involved in attempts to keep order as the country teeters on civil collapse.

[shrike6]

I had a hard time believing that Japan would sit out this one. In my little T2K world the US would have used the 196th Infantry Brigade (AA) plus a few other units in the Japanese Kurile and Sakhalin Campaign.

[.45cultist]

Originally Posted by StainlessSteelCynic

I think one should not under-estimate the bad feeling that the Russian have towards the Japanese due to a string of Russian defeats during the Russo-Japanese war along with the disputes over several islands. Nor the Japanese feelings towards the Russian for the capture of those islands, the dispute still causes tension 60 years after the Russians seized them.

I'm not saying that alone would cause the Soviet Union to use nuclear weapons against Japan but it would probably make any decision to attack Japan a little easier.

Korea was a Russian client state until the 1905 war with Japan. loss of more than islands occurred, power and prestige was captured/lost as well. Regional power could cause the hard liners to strike Japan, and the JMSDF would need to be weakened as well.

[RN7]

IMHO Japan was definitely attacked by the Soviet Union in T2K. It is just too important a country to avoid it for a whole number of reasons. ie US military bases, industrial and logistical infrastructure, oil refineries, the national technological base and the size of the Japanese armed forces.