Insight on 2013 timeline? Smokewolf?

[Mohoender]

Of course, that is if you don't mind Kato as this is still a twilight 2000 forum. However, I have some questions for smokewolf and he seems ready to answer.

Then, I start with 2008 where I see one thing which isn't clear:

Ban is made on Chinese products but how come is it possible that it touches all of them? Ok, it killed a senator grand son, but I would care about a senator's grand son only as long as it doesn't have too much consequences on my own kids (sorry about him).

What about India, wouldn't they try to take part of it over? I realize that US citizens are often forgetting about India but that country is currently in the process of taking China's place in many area. All of my US friends involved in business are currently opening branches in India.

China gets skyrocketing unemployment and we get a terrible economical and supply crisis. Fine. What about the people in western countries? I doubt the fact that they stay idle. What about the Chinese government? How is it possible that the Chinese kindly organized the Olympics? Don't they intend anything about US and Europe? Wouldn't it be possible for them to ask for the US debt to be payed off? Can you give more elements about the electronic? What about South Korea on that matter? What about Russia?

So you understood that the consequences from the chinese product ban is the weak point I see from that year. I'll be more than happy to see something. One last thing, what about the financial crisis and the effect on public economies worldwide?

For everything else on that year I find everything more than possible. Actually, at some point I feared a near famine in western countries in real life.

[smokewolf]

Originally Posted by Mohoender

Ban is made on Chinese products but how come is it possible that it touches all of them? Ok, it killed a senator grand son, but I would care about a senator's grand son only as long as it doesn't have too much consequences on my own kids (sorry about him).

Why did lipstick on a pig have a big splash in the presidential election?

Normal citizens rarely do knee jerk reactions. What has happened often in our recent past is that small things, things of little consequence to most Americans are twisted and perverted to something that is a much more important than it actually is.

The converse of this is also true. There are many things we as citizens should be mindful of but give little thought of.

Originally Posted by Mohoender

What about India, wouldn't they try to take part of it over? I realize that US citizens are often forgetting about India but that country is currently in the process of taking China's place in many area. All of my US friends involved in business are currently opening branches in India.

To be honest here, I wanted options for US manufacturing after the EMPs hit. Best option for that was to use Mexico after the nukes. But Mexico does not have the infrastructure right now to provide for a wartime US needs. I figured that moving things there earlier would allow for the buildup to be reasonable by the time the EMP hits.

As for other areas, I see no problem with them benefiting with the Chinese collapse. Nothing written rules them out. My points were only that Mexico becomes a big winner in all of this.

Originally Posted by Mohoender

China gets skyrocketing unemployment and we get a terrible economical and supply crisis. Fine. What about the people in western countries? I doubt the fact that they stay idle. What about the Chinese government? How is it possible that the Chinese kindly organized the Olympics? Don't they intend anything about US and Europe? Wouldn't it be possible for them to ask for the US debt to be payed off? Can you give more elements about the electronic? What about South Korea on that matter? What about Russia?

There is nothing saying that other countries didn't come in to try to fill the void, but let's face it, no 1 country to equal the demand of Americans. Any quantity picked up by Russia or some other country would surely pale compared to America.

Besides, maybe they do make other arrangements. Maybe they make deals with people the US or European countries wouldn't be very happy with. Would it be so far out of the ball park for China to make a public face that hurts their citizens so they can do other things behind everyone's back?

Right now, China has seen labor costs rising over the last few years. Heck in the US alone, there is a prevalent thought amongst the business world that if the big 3 automakers declare bankruptcy they will be able to invalidate the Union contracts, fire everyone and rehire them at significantly lower wages. Has our own government stepped in to stop this from happening? In a less than above board government such as China wouldn't this be an appealing prospect?

Also, from a historical point of view, one of the best motivators a people can have for the use of war against another country has been the economy. Hitler took full advantage of this during the lead up to WWII. Using the state of Germany's economy he was able to generate a momentum with the people for war.

One of my Goals was for China to attack the US. In my thinking this was one hell of way to generate an undercurrent of US resentment.

Less conspiratorially though, the immediate loss of the Western business will have some odd effects on the Chinese economy that many people will probably not think about. Those effects themselves are more likely to cause enough ripples, maybe even more so than the loss of market segments.

Take Chinese corruption for instance. Corrupt officials losing their bribes, contacts, etc WILL have an impact. Part of the Chinese economy revolves around corruption. The major hit on corrupt officials due to the loss of foreign markets will be reflected in the Chinese economy.

How do they stay corrupt and not in jail? By bribing other officials. If they were to lose their blood money how are they going to continue to keep themselves out of jail? Remember that Food official who was executed after being found guilty of corruption?

Originally Posted by Mohoender

So you understood that the consequences from the chinese product ban is the weak point I see from that year. I'll be more than happy to see something.

The timeline and backstory should be read as a Cliff Note's Guide to the Twilight War. Almost none of the events are fleshed out in full, none should be considered as finite. Most will be developed further as more supplements come out.

But beware, as a country sourcebook comes out...the timeline is going to be fleshed out from their perspective. I do this for two reasons:

1) So when you play someone from X country you'll have a deeper understanding of that person's perspectives of the War. Rather than playing a Chinese soldier and having all the books say your nothing but evil.

2) I don't think there is ever a universal truth behind any war. Vietnam and the Gulf of Tonkin, Iraq and WMD, Afghanistan (during the Soviet invasion) and the Taliban/Bin Laden, etc. This might be a pessimistic viewpoint, but I'll accept that conclusion.

Originally Posted by Mohoender

One last thing, what about the financial crisis and the effect on public economies worldwide?

Unfortunately, the meltdown really became a big deal after the timeline was set. With a delay in release already upon me, I decided to not add this real world event. However, there is no reason this can be used to help justify things. In fact, it may make an appearance in future supplements.


Hope this helps.

[Mohoender]

Hello smokewolf

Thanks for the answers but you focus on the idea and the process behind the scene. That's fine but as I said I think I already understood it and your point has been very well defended.

I was looking for some more story to rely on and to fill in what I consider to be gaps. There are some about which I have trouble to come around.

As an exemple I came up with that one "China could have decide to maintain the Olympics in order to keep up or bring up back her image"

However, from what I read from you I'm thinking that you may want to keep that to fuel future publications and add-ons. Is that the case? Fine again, just do it (customer begging ).

By the way, I have to add that our exchange allow me to correct my own timeline as I have been working on a similar timeline for three-four years now (even before I heard from your project). As a result, you can understand that I'm being curious and that my expectations were high.

Nevertheless, with your timeline but even more with our little exchange, I could see the gaps in it. Thanks for that. Buying you game has been worth it as a result.

Just another question on your timeline (2009), at last. How did you ever come up with a French conservative politician being elected as president of Europe (quastion from a Frenchman)? We only have one and he has been ruled out since 2002. Beside, I'm not sure we have another one (not in the sense you might give to this word). Admitting that could be the case, the guy is strongly anti-european and, even, in the worse situation he wouldn't be call to a public office by any other French political party.