Sweden in T2K

[Raellus]

I thought we had a thread discussing Sweden in the Twilight War but I can't find it.

I really like the idea of Sweden insinuating itself into early 2001 Poland. Most of the Americans in Poland are gone (OMEGA). German forces are pulling back to their home territory. Many major Soviet formations are on their way home. Big chunks of Poland are soon to be there for the taking.

Poland's a mess, but maybe Sweden's got its eye on the long-game. There's historical precedent (albeit, way back during the 30 Years' War). At the very least, I can see Sweden sending teams to gather intel. Further, I can see them sending troops, ostensibly acting as independent mercenaries, to assist whatever faction the Swedish government sees benefiting them in the long run- perhaps the PFC (although Sweden might not want a strong faction taking power) , or maybe a free city on the coast (Gdynia, or whatever's left of Gdansk). The idea is that Sweden intends to be the major power of the Baltic Rim- slowly, quietly, but definitively.

This all assumes that Sweden suffers less from the effects of WWIII than its neighbors. Canon mentions heavy fighting in Norway and Finland, but, AFAIK, it doesn't have much to say about Sweden. Or does it?

[ArmySGT.]

Originally Posted by Raellus

This all assumes that Sweden suffers less from the effects of WWIII than its neighbors. Canon mentions heavy fighting in Norway and Finland, but, AFAIK, it doesn't have much to say about Sweden. Or does it?

Would Sweden void their neutrality for territory?

[Raellus]

Originally Posted by ArmySGT.

Would Sweden void their neutrality for territory?

Not likely. But they're not after territory, per se. They're after influence. The agents are incognito, the mercs are deniable. I imagine that their gear is scrubbed to hide any connection to Sweden. They're all volunteers. They know nothing about Sweden's strategic aims. They've been instructed not to be taken alive. Even if a few were captured, the Swedish government could deny any connection, explaining that they're simply thrill-seekers operating independently. I'm imagining small groups- no more than 100 mercs in any given area- operating in select, low-risk locations, where their presence has maximum leverage with minimal risk. Besides, by the winter of 2000-2001, the Soviets, Americans, and Germans have problems much closer to home to attend to. I'm not sure a couple hundred Swedish mercs in Poland is worth expanding the war again.

[The Dark]

Originally Posted by ArmySGT.

Would Sweden void their neutrality for territory?

Sweden dropped its official neutrality policy after the end of the Cold War. Unofficially, it was dropped in the 1960s, when US submarines with Polaris missiles were stationed in Swedish territorial waters, the US provided aid on the Viggen, and the Swedish Royal Institute of Technology helped improve the CEP of the Polaris missile.


What would be standard equipment for Swedish forces at the time? I'm going through listings of when equipment entered and exited service, and my best guess is:
Pistol: Pistol 88/88B (Glock 17/19)
SMG: Kpist m/45 (Carl Gustav m/45, uncommon due to replacement by ARs)
Assault Rifle: Ak 4 (H&K G3) / Ak 5 (FN FNC)
General Purpose Machine Gun: Ksp 58 (FN MAG in 7.62x51mm)
Light Machine Gun: Ksp 90 (FN Minimi)

Vehicles:
Infantry support: Ikv 91 (amphibious light tank with 90mm L/54 gun and 2 7.62mm MGs, 12 per infantry brigade)
Tank: Centurion Mk.III and Mk.V (updated with 105mm gun, night vision, and reactive armor)
Tank Destroyer: Strv 103 (officially an MBT)
APCs: Pbv 302 (tracked, 3+8 personnel, 20mm cannon), Tgbil m/42 (wheeled, 3+7 personnel, 2x7.62mm M1917 Browning), maybe Patria Pasi (wheeled, 2+16 personnel, 12.7x99mm MG, 70+ sold by Finland to Sweden in the late 80s), Tgb 11/13/21/22 (Volvo C303 truck; 1+19 as APC, 1+11 as MANPADS carrier with RBS 70 systems, can also carry a 90mm recoilless rifle)
All-Terrain Carrier: Bv 202 (2+10 personnel), Bv 206 (1+12 personnel)

[The Dark]

My previous post notwithstanding, I am in agreement with Raellus that Sweden would be looking more for influence than territory. They wouldn't try to take over Warsaw (using that as an example only), but they might "encourage some mercenaries" to support their preferred faction in the city (i.e. send deniable assets to assist). The most likely personnel to be used would probably be Fallskärmsjägarna or Kustjägarna, since they were trained in recon and sabotage work.

[Raellus]

I've thought about how the mercs would be equipped. For a company of about 100 men, I'm imagining that most would be armed with AK4's scrubbed of all maker's marks. By 2000-2001, there are plenty of German G3s still floating around central Europe, so a sanitized AK4 wouldn't arouse much suspicion. I also figure that the Swedes would have managed to get their hands on quite a few Kalashnikovs, from Soviet troops interned after having wandered across Sweden's borders (there were plenty of Red Army troops in Norway and Finland), or defected, during the war. I like the AK5, but it's too distinctive and ammo it resupply would be difficult once the Swedish troops were in Poland.

For uniforms, sanitized surplus OD battle dress and LBE. I don't imagine them bringing anything heavier than some Carl Gustav RRs and mortars.

I imagine that the professional core of the merc companies would be personnel from the elite units you mentioned, Dark; the rest would be volunteers from the regular army.

I plan to write up a "typical" Swedish merc unit and post it here for anyone interested in using it.

[The Dark]

Originally Posted by Raellus

I've thought about how the mercs would be equipped. For a company of about 100 men, I'm imagining that most would be armed with AK4's scrubbed of all maker's marks. By 2000-2001, there are plenty of German G3s still floating around central Europe, so a sanitized AK4 wouldn't arouse much suspicion. I also figure that the Swedes would have managed to get their hands on quite a few Kalashnikovs, from Soviet troops interned after having wandered across Sweden's borders (there were plenty of Red Army troops in Norway and Finland), or defected, during the war. I like the AK5, but it's too distinctive and ammo it resupply would be difficult once the Swedish troops were in Poland.

That sounds reasonable. The m/45 SMG might see some use as well, since Latvia and Estonia both used it. Another possibility would be the Kpist m/37-39 (a license-built Suomi KP/-31 after modification to 9mm Para), since it looks passably like a PPSh-41 from a distance. They were still in service in the 1980s, so they may not have been scrapped by the time of the Twilight War. Naturally, captured weapons would be used as much as possible, but they'd need something to start with.

I imagine that the professional core of the merc companies would be personnel from the elite units you mentioned, Dark; the rest would be volunteers from the regular army.

I plan to write up a "typical" Swedish merc unit and post it here for anyone interested in using it.

I'd envision them drawing the CO (and possibly XO) from the elite units, along with sniper/spotter team(s). Medics and comms specialists could likely come from either the elite units or the regular military (depending on qualifications), while "standard" riflemen would likely be volunteers from regular units or retired veterans. They'd likely also look for language specialists, since while German's fairly common as a taught language (until 1952, it was compulsory for all students), Russian and Polish are not.

[unkated]

Try searching.

"Scandinavia" turns up more than a dozen threads, including this one:

http://forum.juhlin.com/showthread.p...ht=scandinavia

"Sweden" shows the same one.

Uncle Ted

[Adm.Lee]

Originally Posted by Raellus

There's historical precedent (albeit, way back during the 30 Years' War).

Even earlier, as the Swedish king was elected to rule Poland in the 1590's, which led to a war with Sweden. I don't think they should try to conquer it this time around.

I do agree, though, that it would be good politics for the Swedes to at least try to win influence with whatever communities emerge around the Baltic coast-- Poland is just one of them. Helping anyone to rebuild should make for better neighbors.

Potentially, Sweden could emerge as leader of all of its neighbors, rivalling France. Does anyone have a reference to what Sweden does in the GDW "Great Game"?

[Raellus]

I'm sure that we had a thread devoted to this topic but searches of the forum and forum map haven't turned it up.

I can see Sweden becoming a Baltic regional power in the wake of OMEGA and the departure of most [loyal] Soviet forces from Poland. I created a unit of Swedish-sponsored mercenaries that could make an appearance in Northern Poland in early 2001 or so. Here is it, for your perusal. Constructive feedback is welcome.

[RN7]

Originally Posted by Raellus

I'm sure that we had a thread devoted to this topic but searches of the forum and forum map haven't turned it up.

I can see Sweden becoming a Baltic regional power in the wake of OMEGA and the departure of most [loyal] Soviet forces from Poland. I created a unit of Swedish-sponsored mercenaries that could make an appearance in Northern Poland in early 2001 or so. Here is it, for your perusal. Constructive feedback is welcome.

I can't open that document Raellus

[Raellus]

I'm sorry, RN7. I'm not sure what the problem is. I am able to open from the link. Do you have a fairly up-to-date copy of Word? I'll convert it to a PDF and attach that. Hopefully, that'll work for you. Please let me know if it doesn't. I may have to contact Kato to ask for a fix. Thanks for letting me know.

[Raellus]

If the Word doc doesn't open for you, hopefully, this PDF will.

[Olefin]

Both worked for me - assume the whole idea for the Swedes is "plausible deniability" with the weapons choice you gave them - i.e. we arent going to see any Swedish armored vehicles show up with them. How about the Bv206 - it was in use with multiple countries and could be something that doesnt scream "The Swedes are here!"

[RN7]

Originally Posted by Raellus

If the Word doc doesn't open for you, hopefully, this PDF will.

That worked fine thanks

[RN7]

Originally Posted by Raellus

I'm sure that we had a thread devoted to this topic but searches of the forum and forum map haven't turned it up.

I can see Sweden becoming a Baltic regional power in the wake of OMEGA and the departure of most [loyal] Soviet forces from Poland. I created a unit of Swedish-sponsored mercenaries that could make an appearance in Northern Poland in early 2001 or so. Here is it, for your perusal. Constructive feedback is welcome.

You in fact started that this thread

http://forum.juhlin.com/showthread.php?t=5513

[Raellus]

I thought I did but I couldn't find it. Thanks. I will merge these two threads presently.

[Raellus]

I figured this would be a more on-topic place to continue the discussion of Sweden in v4.

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[pansarskott]

For those not familiar with the area. Distance Stockholm - Arlanda by car is 40 km.

Naval and airborne landings: