v4 Rules & Mechanics Discussion

[Raellus]

I'm interested in what y'all think about v4's rules and game mechanics. Please keep discussion of the v4 game world over in:

https://forum.juhlin.com/showthread....5705#post85705

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[Olefin]

Good idea to move the mechanics here. I would also like to be able to discuss the artwork here as well which is one thing that V4 is definitely excelling it. I think that it’s very good and definitely one feature they got right

[Raellus]

Originally Posted by Olefin

I would also like to be able to discuss the artwork here as well which is one thing that V4 is definitely excelling it.

Hey, something we agree 100% about! The artwork is indeed amazing.

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[mpipes]

Yay....about those mechanics....where do I start.

I am not a fan so far. Yes, I have bitched over the years about the attribute and skill ratings and rules in V 1, 2, 2.1, and 2.2, but they are absolutely first rate compared to these!! I was hoping for something at least a bit more D&Dish that was a bit more intuitive, but alas that hope has been dashed.

The A, B, C, and D drivel is just that.....not at all intuitive. I was wanting to see a more straightforward set of attributes built around Strength, Constitution, Agility, Dexterity, Charisma, and Intelligence with Education being more akin to a learned skill and tied to Intelligence. Still not sure how to roll for anything. Skill bonuses seem to make sense, but not sure they allow for truly exceptional (like my current PC Sniper "Morg" Cole - 56 kills in the Campaign - 17 skill overall in Rifle).

Weapon rating system. Clunky and non-intuitive. GDW much easier to understand. Meters and kilos. And the ratings are far from intuitive (a .50 BMG M82 is Damage 4 while a 7.62 M21 is Damage 3 and a 14.6mm KPV is a Damage 4 - I just don't buy that) I just don't like the combat damage system as presented. The Critical rules look very promising. Vehicle combat looks a mess, but I am just tired at this point.

I could go on, but I think I will leave it to others to flesh it all out. I just don't find it intuitive. You'll have players going back and forth constantly to the rules and forever bickering about that "not sounding right." And alas, the KPV 14.5mm IS MUCH MORE POWERFUL (about twice more) than a .50 - that's just physics. Not sure what these guys are using, but their conversion formula is either far too coarse or just plain wrong.

[mpipes]

One last thought tonight....

These mechanics seem wildly messy to me and not intuitive at all, but I grew up in the old style D&D and SPI era, so maybe I am just damaged goods in a sense.

Does anybody think they are good? Or an improvement over V 1 or 2.2?

Please, someone that truly likes them chime in and say SOMETHING!!

[Rainbow Six]

Originally Posted by mpipes

Does anybody think they are good? Or an improvement over V 1 or 2.2?

Please, someone that truly likes them chime in and say SOMETHING!!

It will probably take me weeks to try and get my head round the mechanics. I may even wait until I get the hardcopy.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Originally Posted by mpipes

One last thought tonight....

These mechanics seem wildly messy to me and not intuitive at all, but I grew up in the old style D&D and SPI era, so maybe I am just damaged goods in a sense.

Does anybody think they are good? Or an improvement over V 1 or 2.2?

Please, someone that truly likes them chime in and say SOMETHING!!

I don't like these mechanics. They're derived from the Year Zero rules that Free League uses as the base for all their games (as far as I am aware). They suit episodic, non-campaign style games and I've seen a particular trend among fans of the Year Zero rules that seems to bear this out.
They will play one Year Zero game until they get bored with it and then they'll start up a new game with a different Year Zero game. When they get bored with that one, they ship over to the next Year Zero game until they complete the circle and come back to the first game.

I don't see any longevity in that approach, it seems to me that they are simply playing the game to kill time rather than to follow the journey of their character.
I'd rather play RIFTS with all the problems of its hashed together AD&D mechanics because at least I can expect the game to last more than a few adventures.