SeaBee and other Engineers

[kalos72]

So how do these units operate? How are they broken down? What equipment do they use and how are they assigned to a unit?

Trying to figure out what type of military unit would be used for certain tasks...

[Adm.Lee]

IIRC, they are construction-only engineers, meaning they build things like airfields (their original purpose), but do not assault fortifications or the like.

In WW2, there was usually at least one CB assigned to each Marine Division or Corps.

Other engineers-- that's going to vary by army, but the usual is a battalion of combat engineers to a division. These guys can do some road clearing & repairs, build or repair bridges, and build or attack fortifications and minefields. There should be a company each for mines, bridges (may include assault boats), fortifications and roads, with the specialized equipment for each. Some brigades/regiments would have their own separate company, too, with specialized platoons for the above roles.

In some armies (German, French and Italian come to mind) there are pure combat engineer (a.k.a. sappers or pioneers) units.

Above that, there are regiments or brigades of engineers at the corps and higher levels. These are the ones for building/operating things like dams or waterways, power plants, sawmills, roads, and everything else. Airfields are often built/repaired by specialist units, which usually belong to their nation's air force. Railroad repair or operating units may be independent, or belong to the engineer branch, too.

Is that broad enough?

[Matt W]

The smallest SeaBee unit I know of is the SERT

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seabee_...naissance_Team

Incidentally, the SERT could make a good PC unit

[Eddie]

Just keep in mind that this is a bit of a misleading name in most non-military circles. Reconnaissance in this context doesn't mean going out looking for the bad guys and reporting their location, it means making engineering and reconstruction reconnaissance efforts in the COIN phase and later phases of conventional fights. What would be worthwhile for us to fix to reestablish X service for the locals, etc.

[kalos72]

Found this link to help...

https://www.seabee.navy.mil/index.cfm

So CB's are the same as normal combat engineers for say the Army? Or are the other branches less specifically focused?

What about those new reconstruction units in Afghanistan to help rebuild the utilities and everything?

[Eddie]

Originally Posted by kalos72

Found this link to help...

https://www.seabee.navy.mil/index.cfm

So CB's are the same as normal combat engineers for say the Army? Or are the other branches less specifically focused?

For the most part yes. These guys get a high profile in the Navy because of the fact that they're actually on the ground, in the fight building stuff. Not clearing obstacles and digging survivability positions unless there truly are no other options in the area. Like someone said, they're usually used for high-value construction projects because their officers are also bona fide engineers.

What about those new reconstruction units in Afghanistan to help rebuild the utilities and everything?

ePRTs. Embedded Provincial Reconstruction Teams. These are primarily bona fide, civilian engineers with military Logistics Liaison officers and Field Artillery guys.

[kalos72]

Anyone have any details on how say Army Engineer ORBATS or what not? How about those reconstruction units?

[Eddie]

The ePRTs? There didn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to how they were organized other than containing civilians when I was in Iraq. Some had Civil Affairs guys assigned to them, Infantry Officers, civilians, the whole gamut. Others had said FA guys, civilians, and whatever security element the land-owning unit could provide them.

As for Task Orgs of Army Engineer units, I have them at home. I'm currently in Savannah in the hotel though, so you'll have to wait until after tomorrow for them from me.

[pmulcahy11b]

SeaBees are more like the Civil Engineer careers in the V1 rules. IIRC, the RDF Sourcebook has a SeaBee career -- sort of a Civil Engineer on steroids.

[kalos72]

I dont know if the organization changed much with the new BCT's but previously these things were retarded! :P

You have like 8+ types of Engineer Companies, all with different purposes and organization based on where the unit is attached it seems.

I guess I will go with "combat" meaning mines/obstacles/mobility/assault focus for each unit. And "construction" for vertical and horizontal and overall rebuilding.

Seebee's to focus on ports / airfields I guess....

[Abbott Shaull]

Yeah overly simplified...

[Adm.Lee]

Originally Posted by kalos72

I dont know if the organization changed much with the new BCT's but previously these things were retarded! :P

You have like 8+ types of Engineer Companies, all with different purposes and organization based on where the unit is attached it seems.

I fail to see why this is "retarded"--that is, a problem. Wouldn't a higher commander want to have lots of different tools in the toolbox?

[kalos72]

When 6 of them are designed around combat engineer squads but all have different names its kinda strange.

Flexibility is great, common sense might work too.

[Abbott Shaull]

There is no room for common sense in the military....

[Rainbow Six]

Originally Posted by Abbott Shaull

There is no room for common sense in the military....

Sadly that's not a failing that is unique to the military...

[Webstral]

But the military does lead the way. Admittedly, though, any government bureaucracy has common sense in inverse proportion to the number of people in the organization.

Webstral

[rcaf_777]

having just complete a tour with the engineers, I manage to find out a few stuff here how the canadian model is

3 x Sqn with 2 X Tp, one being mech and other being light (thrid tp auth for war)

these sqn are combat engineers wihich handle bridging, water supply, demo, mine laying

there is a support sqn with a 1 x heavy equipment tp (dump trucks, cranes ect) 1 x construction tp (Builders) and a EOD Tp

each unit also has a combat diver team of about 20-30 pers - never fully manned

there is also a combat support company with mechainics, cook, clerks, medics ect.

all in all about 750 war time strenght

[Blakrider]

here are a couple of things h have found and organised for previous games.

hope this helps

[Blakrider]

this one is from WW2 but more detailed in the support units

[Abbott Shaull]

Originally Posted by Webstral

But the military does lead the way. Admittedly, though, any government bureaucracy has common sense in inverse proportion to the number of people in the organization.

Webstral

Yes but too bad the ones who choose to use common sense don't make the policies...