Industrial Bomb Shelters in T2k

[Raellus]

I was quite surprised by the sheer scale of the Azovstal steel plant in Ukraine and, even more so, by its extensive (and deep) underground bunker system.

According to a diagram included in the article linked below, said bunker system was built to shelter the plant's 40,000 workers in the event of a nuclear attack.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...al-steel-plant

Is this typical of large industrial complexes in the former Soviet republics, and/or in East Bloc countries (especially Poland)? If not, what made Azovstal a special case? If such underground complexes are fairly common, it opens up a realm of possibilities for T2k scenarios.

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I remember taking a tour of an Armenian carpet factory in 2003, ostensibly to buy some rugs. What I got, besides two carpets, was a history lesson on the Cold War and a tour of their fallout shelter. I was told (and have no reason to doubt my host's veracity) that most major USSR era production facilities have fallout shelters and were somewhat prepared for a nuclear attack. I remember leaving the factory thinking, 'Fuck, I'm glad we never had a nuclear war with the USSR. They were a lot more prepared than your average factory textile mill in North Carolina'

[Trooper]

In USSR there was huge differences where and how people should find shelter during war time. Facilities that were deemed important to war effort had usually great shelters that provided not just fall out protection, but good protection against over pressure and conventional attacks.

In practice you should find good shelters in Communist party buildings, police stations and all industrial facilities that provided any kind of services to armed forces during peace or war time.

Areas where party members or spetsi (specialist) lived you could find good shelters. It was less likely to find good shelters in working class areas, unless there was metro station.

People who lived outside urban areas had to use basements or other places that provided some kind protection against nuclear or conventional attacks. Even in collective farms there was people who had civil defense training and who had some skill to build dugout shelters.

There was mandatory civil defense training in soviet schools and workplaces. Usually, most people just trained how to get in the shelter. If there wasn’t shelter in the facility, you should wear gas mask and go to basement or ground floor room without windows. Some older men were trained to NBC-recon, firefighting or decontamination duties.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkFS...-broNVYTs2zAw0

[chico20854]

For an exhaustive background, here are two declassified CIA reports on Soviet Civil Deefense. Here and Here.

For important industries, the key elements were supposed to be:

1) underground blast shelters for workers on site during their shift, and in some cases underground, blast-protected production facilties on site.
2) evacuation of off duty workers and their families to sites within a two-hour or so commute of the plant. (Many large employers maintained "workers holiday camps" and resorts nearby... when the USSR fell these sites were some of the burdens that made Russian industry so uncompetitive and they were mostly sold off). Those facilities provided fallout protection and basic shelter.
3) dispersal of sites around the USSR and even within a single site.
4) stockpiling of food and raw materials to allow continued production after a strike; and
5) civil defense training for workers - decontamination, first aid, clearing rubble and NBC recon, to allow those on site to quickly recover after a strike.

Of course this was the ideal. While fully implementing dispersal of sites made it more difficult for the US to wipe them out in wartime, it also increased demand for transportation from day one, and multiple sites (especially green-field ones developed in pristine areas) required additional resources to construct. Local officials made trade-offs, and the extra building materials for robust underground shelters were juicy targets for corrupt officials to skim off for private gain. The reports concluded that overall the Soviet civil defense system would protect a significant portion of the population from the immediate effects of an attack, but that the transportation and communications systems of the USSR, which barely functioned effectively in peacetime, would break down in the aftermath of a nuclear attack.

The CIA survey of 150-some sites found that they were pretty common, although not universal. Their consensus was that the non-Soviet Pact nations operated on a similar level.

[Raellus]

Thanks for the info, guys.

Were these sorts of preparations standard across the Warsaw Pact, or were they essentially "optional" (i.e. constructed at the discretion of individual member nations)? Since many T2k campaigns kick off in Poland, I'm wondering if Polish industrial sites had similar facilities.

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I can't comment on most Polish industry, but for the Place of Culture and Science (Pałac Kultury i Nauki; abbreviated PKiN), I have a few interesting pictures from the basement, which isn't normally open due to the presence of:

http://harbinger.twilightwar.net/asbestos.JPG

<cough, cough>

Anyway, the 1959 era 'Place Guards' had been equipped with a nice cap, jacket, first aid kit, a stretcher, and gas mask.

http://harbinger.twilightwar.net/cap.JPG
http://harbinger.twilightwar.net/mask.JPG

So I took that to mean they were prepared for NBC operations to some extent.

Or maybe the gas mask was for the asbestos.... <shrug>

[swaghauler]

Pittsburgh has a lot of old bomb shelters in various structures such as public libraries, various hospitals, and a number of older public venues (the Heinz Theater for example). IDK how well maintained they might be though.

Originally Posted by swaghauler

Pittsburgh has a lot of old bomb shelters in various structures such as public libraries, various hospitals, and a number of older public venues (the Heinz Theater for example). IDK how well maintained they might be though.

Another plus for dinning at Gaucho Parrilla Argentina then - it's within easy sprinting distance of the Heinz and the food and beverage are excellent!

[swaghauler]

Originally Posted by Spartan-117

Another plus for dinning at Gaucho Parrilla Argentina then - it's within easy sprinting distance of the Heinz and the food and beverage are excellent!

We need a "LIKE" button!

[Vespers War]

There are a couple fallout shelters inside Fort Monroe (which is only a surprise because it was a very old fort). It was the first place I saw fallout shelter signs in the wild.

When I worked at the former Pershing factory in Orlando, scuttlebutt was that the building was designed to take a near-miss from a nuclear warhead with minimal damage. I don't know how true that was, but the older folks that worked there either believed it or were really good amateur actors. I do know there was asbestos in the building and probably always will be, since Management removed what could be removed cheaply, but there's some deep in its bones.

[Homer]

Originally Posted by Spartan-117

Another plus for dinning at Gaucho Parrilla Argentina then - it's within easy sprinting distance of the Heinz and the food and beverage are excellent!

Gaucho Parrilla is great! I’ve seen a line out the door on a -8F night. That about says it all.

[chico20854]

Originally Posted by Homer

I’ve seen a line out the door on a -8F night. That about says it all.

Oh, how I miss that Pittsburgh April weather!!!!