The value of Precious Stones

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by Grimace

I think some of you guys are forgetting how long gold, silver and gemstones have had value. Long before there were computers or established, stable currency there were gold, silver and gemstones. They have intrinsic value because people like shiny metals and pretty rocks.

You are right about that but this doesn't mean that it had any real value as an exchange product. What you describe is mainly true for small elites.

Gold and precious stones were displayed by rulers but in daily life it was very seldom used (Japan is about the few exceptions). It wasn't used in Europe for regular currencies, it wasn't used in China, it wasn't used in Africa...

The reason for that is not a problem of value but of it not being available in quantity. That would be the case again with T2K. The Markgraf of Silesia might value gold but the regular trader might not have any use for it. In addition, if a group controls a fair quantity of Gold, it might not be able to trade it but it will surely be targetted by everyone else.

Everyone has the image of Spanish ships coming back from South America full of Gold. However, this never occured for real and Gold was only marginal. The Galleons were coming back full of other more valuable goods: Silver, Chocolate...

Later the most valuable good was Rubber grown in the Manaus area. Steeling and exporting Rubber plant was punished by death penalty but despite that, a British finally stole several plants and brought them back to England and, then, India.

Gold gained a real trade value only in the late 19th century when governments became capable of assembling substantial reserve to back their paper currencies (that ended in 1950).

In T2K, a bag of potatoes or a box full of bullets might be much more valuable.

[copeab]

Originally Posted by Mohoender

You are right about that but this doesn't mean that it had any real value as an exchange product. What you describe is mainly true for small elites.

One of the rules of economics is that a item used as currency ideally shouldn't be useful other than as currency (or decoration).

[headquarters]

I guess we soon need a subforum that details all the supply issues ?

gold,coffee,reloading,fuel,farming...

Its just great to read all the different -and well founded -opinions here guys .
If I didnt know how to run this in my campaign -I would after reading these posts.

( I did know incidentally )

My two cents ( well,my other two ) :

Yes it will have value .In T2K almost everything will have value -even dirt thats been radiated . ( "We want ze poisoned dirt to zpread on ze enemy fields-how much iz it?")

farfetched -yes.

So gold and silver -both useful and pretty metals in their way will have a value.

They can be made into a currency -as stated- in say a cantonment ,
they can be bartered for goods in a one on one meeting far from all cantonment

as long as the one party creates a demand for it -say he likes the way it glimmers in the pale ,post nuclear holocaust sun and or that his now dead wife used to have one just like it .

An irrational want for the item as opposed to a calculated motive based on a rational play for higher gain .

These are the theories of the rational /irrational operator in the economic system ( Weber I believe/Vienna school of sosiology - iirc ).

So both the agreed upon value in a community and the spur of the moment barter in the wasteland has merit .It can have a symbolic value as a "coin" -much like or currency bills in RL that have little real application once the agreed upon psychosis that they are "all that matters " lifts

( that would be after T2K like events )

Or gold rings can be worth their weight as fish hook sinks - easy to fix to the line , good density -and looks nice on your rig too.

A practical and a symbolic value .

Everyone will have to decide on the value depending on location and circumstance.

In our campaign gold has had various values .Gen PAin used to hoard huge amounts in teh now smouldering and radioactive crater that was his beloved Library Tower .He believed it would be worth alot--soon .But in that circumstance ,everybody were desperate ,half naked ,cannibalistic savages running around with melee weapons looking to eat thy neighbour. So gold was less valuable than fresh rat meat -or even spoiled rat meat .Later when his hoarding became known ,and the bounty he placed on gold was spread , gold got value and was sold to him for rations.

In the short lived PacGov republic ( corrupt,warmongering dictatorship that it was ) the players made currency in the form of plastic chits /coins after they had reached a certain level of organization.

But they also made gold coins when they started out since these were easier to make with their primitive technology at the time .It is mallable ,and recognized through habit by us as valuable .An agreed upon value ,but also a practical one as the need for a currency arose ,the medium to make one got intrinsic value etc etc .

I do believe in universal value - it will just vary from next to nothing to tremendous.

Sorry if I bored the c**p out of anybody with this .

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by headquarters

Sorry if I bored the c**p out of anybody with this .

Not at all, very interesting in fact. I might be wrong but the result of all this is that barter is going to be the general rule.

As a result, values for everything will vary greatly as you said. Basic of economics.

It's even a reality today. A year ago I fixed my neighbour's computer (48 hours works as he had the most virus I ever saw in a single computer) and in return he fixed my concrete floor (2 hours work for him). The deal was fair:
- He would have had to buy a new computer and I would have spent 48 hours anyway helping him with it.
- I would have spent more than 48 hours to realise the worse concrete floor you can imagine.
In the outcome, he has a working computer and I could open my office in a week, starting to make money.

[weswood]

I think the direction of the campaign in question would also have a lot to do with it. If the situation of the world is going back towards a regular governments etc, gold and gems would be more valuable than if civilization was spiraling downward.

I personally feel civilization would continue to decline. If 75% of the worlds population was killed, most of the people with the technical skills needed to recreate civilization would probably be dead.

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by copeab

One of the rules of economics is that a item used as currency ideally shouldn't be useful other than as currency (or decoration).

No doubt, no doubt... But after a subsequent use of these pretty and kind nuclear devices, economy is gone and so are its rules.