Stuff you have because you've played Twilight:2000

[Cpl. Kalkwarf]

Originally Posted by headquarters

Good .

Thanks.

I would be well pleased with 1 MOA too.

Getting a new .308 / 7,62x51 soonish . Considering a semi auto over a bolt action .

The advantage, should you need it with a semi auto is that you can get a Quicker followup or second shot should you need it. And often in today's modern combat of a DMR it can be a life saver.

I'm kinda partial to the old bolt guns myself, my Remington 700P shoots a constant 1/2 moa with factory match ammo when I do my part. It likes the Remington Premier Match 168gr. Matchking BTHP load. ( I really need to get out and get back in the groove).

What semi auto platform are you thinking? Some of the AR 308s have been getting pretty good results. I have no experience with the FAL or G3. I do have some with the M1a (civ M14). I would love to be able to find/afford the Valmet AK in 308. http://bwfirearms.com/GunPics/valmet78.JPG

[headquarters]

due to regulations we are only allowed to choose from a limited array of semi autos for sport and hunting .

The list has a few interesting ones - the Vepr,the Remington 750,the Browning BAR ( not M1918) ,the Valmet Petra,HK 2000,Sauer 303.A few more too.

I want something stainless/or coated ,synthetic,accurate and with a "silencer/moderator" that I can take into the woods in a torrential rain and just shake the water off and put straight into the safe when I get home .
I want a can on it so that I can hunt and shoot places were I otherwise cant ,and its more comfy.I will accept up to ,but no poorer accuracy than 2 moa . Also it shouldnt look to combat -some of the farmers around here dont think much of guys with combat kit -and I need my contacts intact to get to use their lands.

The Dragunov is super sweet ,but sadly the Izmash model offerd here is available only in the sports category and not the hunting list in our PD bylaws.I cant be bothered to jump through all the hoops required to qualify to get it - I just dont have the time these days.I couldnt even use it for hunting -only sports shooting .The rules are annoying and seem meaningless-but we have to have AND adhere to the gun laws .They should just be different is all.

As for ,ahem,non-sporting or hunting related needs for semiauto longarms I have covered that base with a few well known sporterized articles that are widespread and that trace their origins back to a piece of kit called the M1 Garand as well as my service weapon.One day though...If I get my way.....I will have all I ever wanted in terms of iron....

[weswood]

Originally Posted by Cpl. Kalkwarf

. I do have some with the M1a (civ M14). I would love to be able to find/afford the Valmet AK in 308. http://bwfirearms.com/GunPics/valmet78.JPG

What do you think of the M1A? I've been thinking of getting one for about a year, but the money has been scarce. Then my favorite aunt died last month and left me a little cash (and yes, she was my favorite before she died, as long as I can remember in fact).

On the subject of muzzle loaders, my first real rifle was a CVA .45 Kentucky rifle. My father put it together, turned out beautiful. I think I was 12 at the time. Tall as I was, and I had to brace the barrel to shoot it, couldn't hold it up. We put a set of adjustable sights on it. I hunted with it until I gave up hunting. It still holds #1 position in the gun cabinet, #2 being Pop's shotgun that's been in the family longer than I have.

I can remember the 1st time he took me hunting, I was about 5. He had to tie me to his back like a backpack to climb into the tree stand, then went back down for the shotgun.

[jester]

Originally Posted by weswood

What do you think of the M1A? I've been thinking of getting one for about a year, but the money has been scarce. Then my favorite aunt died last month and left me a little cash (and yes, she was my favorite before she died, as long as I can remember in fact).

On the subject of muzzle loaders, my first real rifle was a CVA .45 Kentucky rifle. My father put it together, turned out beautiful. I think I was 12 at the time. Tall as I was, and I had to brace the barrel to shoot it, couldn't hold it up. We put a set of adjustable sights on it. I hunted with it until I gave up hunting. It still holds #1 position in the gun cabinet, #2 being Pop's shotgun that's been in the family longer than I have.

I can remember the 1st time he took me hunting, I was about 5. He had to tie me to his back like a backpack to climb into the tree stand, then went back down for the shotgun.

You and me both! I just got a years worth of back pay from the V.A. for my disability. An unexpected winfall. And I have been looking at them and pricing them myself.

The local gunstore has a SOCOM II, a bit front heavy, but that will keep recoil and muzzle rise down.

I used to shoot a freinds standard GI model all the time. It fit nicely, felt good and was deadly accurate!

The question is, what variant to get?

Are you looking at:

Standard, Match, National Match, Scout, Socom 16, Socom II?

Then we have the barrel type and furniture to consider. Of course there are also triggers, sights and flashsuppresors and compensators.

For me, I am debating between the Socom 16 and the Match Variant with black synthetic furniture and a chrome barrel, with a national match sight and California Legal Compensator.

They are very cool with lots of accessories availavble! And you can use them for pliinking <if you can afford the ammo> as well as competion and just general shooting! A true piece of working art!

[weswood]

Originally Posted by jester

You and me both! I just got a years worth of back pay from the V.A. for my disability. An unexpected winfall. And I have been looking at them and pricing them myself.

The local gunstore has a SOCOM II, a bit front heavy, but that will keep recoil and muzzle rise down.

I used to shoot a freinds standard GI model all the time. It fit nicely, felt good and was deadly accurate!

The question is, what variant to get?

Are you looking at:

Standard, Match, National Match, Scout, Socom 16, Socom II?

Then we have the barrel type and furniture to consider. Of course there are also triggers, sights and flashsuppresors and compensators.

For me, I am debating between the Socom 16 and the Match Variant with black synthetic furniture and a chrome barrel, with a national match sight and California Legal Compensator.

They are very cool with lots of accessories availavble! And you can use them for pliinking <if you can afford the ammo> as well as competion and just general shooting! A true piece of working art!

I like the Standard version. I'm a simple kind of guy. I'm considering that or an AR15, the M4 version with the colapsable buttstock. I've never fired the M4, and have never been real fond of the M16 series, but I like that collapsable stock so I can teach my daughter to shoot. That and there's several boxes of .223 at my aunt's house I may be able to con my cousin out of. She gave me 4 boxes of .380 last year when i griped I couldn't find any in the stores.

[jester]

Originally Posted by weswood

I like the Standard version. I'm a simple kind of guy. I'm considering that or an AR15, the M4 version with the colapsable buttstock. I've never fired the M4, and have never been real fond of the M16 series, but I like that collapsable stock so I can teach my daughter to shoot. That and there's several boxes of .223 at my aunt's house I may be able to con my cousin out of. She gave me 4 boxes of .380 last year when i griped I couldn't find any in the stores.

Nice! I have been looking at some of the new shorty uppers to go with a lower I bought a couple years ago. One has a barrel that look like a SAW with the new rail system. It look total bad @$$.

The down side, being this is The Peoples Democratic Repulik of Kalifornia, no adjustable stocks, no flash suppressors, threated barrels to accep a suppressor, only pinned compensators

So, my intention of the lower will be a compesition stock with intergral cheek rest, with the adjustment for length and height. Match trigger assembly, 24 inch fluted stainless barrel, Hogue free floating tube foregrip, flattop upper, I am thinking low ride fixed sights extra thing front blade, and rear super match sights.

Anyhow, that is my project rifle.

Still need to figure if I want to drop the 1500 to 2000 for the Springfield, downside, at the gunshop they are WAAAY overpriced, and they have no idea when they will be able to order from Springfield, they just aren't taking orders ;(

I am also toying with the idea of a good bolt gun, I'd love a Styer SSG 69 but they don't come in Left Hand.

Maybe a tricked out Remiington 700, or maybe something by Robar in .308......OH WAIT!!!! The AR's in .308 are available now too! And alot are going for slightly more than a traditional brand name AR!

HQ, you've got a couple of us going now. See what you've started!

[headquarters]

Originally Posted by jester

Nice! I have been looking at some of the new shorty uppers to go with a lower I bought a couple years ago. One has a barrel that look like a SAW with the new rail system. It look total bad @$$.

The down side, being this is The Peoples Democratic Repulik of Kalifornia, no adjustable stocks, no flash suppressors, threated barrels to accep a suppressor, only pinned compensators

So, my intention of the lower will be a compesition stock with intergral cheek rest, with the adjustment for length and height. Match trigger assembly, 24 inch fluted stainless barrel, Hogue free floating tube foregrip, flattop upper, I am thinking low ride fixed sights extra thing front blade, and rear super match sights.

Anyhow, that is my project rifle.

Still need to figure if I want to drop the 1500 to 2000 for the Springfield, downside, at the gunshop they are WAAAY overpriced, and they have no idea when they will be able to order from Springfield, they just aren't taking orders ;(

I am also toying with the idea of a good bolt gun, I'd love a Styer SSG 69 but they don't come in Left Hand.

Maybe a tricked out Remiington 700, or maybe something by Robar in .308......OH WAIT!!!! The AR's in .308 are available now too! And alot are going for slightly more than a traditional brand name AR!

HQ, you've got a couple of us going now. See what you've started!

I read your deliberations about what gun to get with interest as it is a question I have wrestled with many times myself.Your intended use of the gun being the primary issue.
Is it hunting,plinking,serious target practice,for use as a potential combat gun or indeed several or all of the above ?Some guns are just cool as sh** and you need one just to have it -another factor to be considered.

Next consider your caliber preferances.Both ballistics,percieved recoil and ammo price and availability should be considered.The rifles you mention are admirable weapons indeed.


I have a few suggestions of my own -if I may.

What do you guys recon about the AR-10 rifles in .308 ?Or .243?
I say they are looking pretty good and probably shot better than most of us straight out of the box..1-2 MOA with decent ammo..

http://www.armalite.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=10A4F-2

Also the FNAR looks pretty awesome and even more accurate than the AR:

http://www.fnhusa.com/le/products/fi...049&gid=FNG022


Last but not least -the good ole Browning BAR ( not the squad weapon ).
Its reliable,it is proven,it has decent accuracy ,it works as a hunting rifle still you can get 4,6,10 and even 20 round mags for it and use it in anger.(Hypotethically!!! ) EDIT : Max mag capacity is between 2 and 6 rounds depending on capacity .FNAR is the same action more or less but with possible hi-cap.Sorry about the technical mistake.Thanks for letting it slide Paul
It comes in various calibers too.

http://www.browning.com/products/cat...?webflag_=002B

I just gotta say -the whole CALI "no pistol grip" kinda ruins most if not all "military type" rifles for me.The legal configuration is ugly imho.Better to get something designed for a thumbholestock or the older integrated pistolgrip stock like the M1A and similar .THere is the bullet button loop hole though ,it sounds a bit of a pain but at least you get a classic look to your rifle -like these

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct780.aspx

These are just the .308s I am thinking of.If you want to talk .223 or Rem 6,8SPC or even the venerable 7,62x39 there are loads more to consider.

Not to mention if you want to discuss bolt action rifles...
Maybe a gun thread should be started ..

[weswood]

HQ, my intended purpose is mostly plinking.

I'm leaning towards the AR15 for that reason. Cheaper ammo, parts availability, surplus parts & ammo. Plus I want to teach my daughter rifle shooting, she's 9 years old and petite for her age, so a collapsible stock is a must.

But on the other hand, I got rid of my deer rifles. After my father died, I pretty much lost interest in hunting. I don't know if it's stress or upbringing, but I'm getting the urge to go hunting. I'm not fond of the idea of hunting deer with a .223. I know if it will kill a man, it will kill a deer, but I've read cases of the bullet going through people and not even slowing down, the target stood there and kept shooting back. I'm a firm believer in one shot, one kill. Specially with animals. As I said above, my 1st hunting rifle was a muzzle loader, and my 1st shotgun was a break action single 20. No quick follow up shots with either.

So I'm also leaning towards the M1 .308.

Plus there's the wife factor. "You spent HOW much on that!" Even though weapons are a little cheaper here in Texas than in Cali. (Jester, for some reason I thought you lived near Houston.) I haven't priced any since last year, but I think I remember the Springfield going for around $1300, and I can get an AR15 for $1000. Maybe less if I can find a used one.