The location of the Pope during the Twilight War

[natehale1971]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

I rather doubt anything above ground could be trusted to ensure the Pope's survival. EMP is a bitch especially when applied to complex machinery such as aircraft.

While the shelter and underground rail options are plausible, in my opinion the best, safest option is simply not to be there in the first place. Perhaps a double was used in the last few weeks/months and the Pope "telecommuted" from a much safer location elsewhere on the globe?

The Pope, and the church in general are certainly not nuclear targets in and of themselves, but the Vatican is in a rather vulnerable position being located in the capital of one of the major belligerents. While not exactly a huge issue in WWII, the exponential increase in destructive potential of weapons 50 years later is something else entirely.

It makes me wonder that if the Pope had been in Rome when the nukes started to fly that they would have just moved the Pope to the bomb shelter and sealed it up. Waited until after the rads died down enough (and checked to make sure the subterranean rail was still functioning) and get him out then.

[Snake Eyes]

I originally went with Switzerland but I really think at the first sign of nukes, the pontiff would be moved by submarine to his secret hollowed-out volcano lair.

At least that's how I'd play it.

[helbent4]

Originally Posted by Snake Eyes

I originally went with Switzerland but I really think at the first sign of nukes, the pontiff would be moved by submarine to his secret hollowed-out volcano lair.

At least that's how I'd play it.

That gets my vote for sure!

While not changing my vote from Switzerland to relocating within Italy, there's nothing to say the Papacy could not move around.

The Pope could be evacuated by helicopter, because even civilians ones can be hardened for EMP or simply use a very old model. Possibly to Switzerland for a short period. Fallout is something that could be dealt with in that time (it's very short-lived), and the Swiss are quire knowledgeable about the hazards. Worldwide communications would be possible using radio; although EMP is a considerable hazard it's not insurmountable and some kind of papal bunker would at least have spare radio sets and comms equipment. It's not like there wasn't enough warning!

Afterwards, he could relocate to Perugia once the Vatican is re-established there. If Venice is the only non-nuked city, it's hard to see why the Vatican wouldn't relocate there. As for the man, if he dies with Rome, another pope would be chosen.

I do like the possibilities in having the Pope's body tour Poland. I could also see the French providing logistical support or transportation to gain favour with the world-wide church. As well, a relocation to the USA for some reason is interesting but not likely-seeming.

Tony

[firewalker]

dang ya know I’ve been kind of poking away at this for years know (show's me about keeping up with the boards) if i can find the time from work I’ll see if i can through something more thought out up here.

Till thin i got a couple of quick questions. We have some canon on Italy not real detailed about what’s happening during the war true but what's happening in Switzerland?

Also i wonder if we could do with a little more of a time line in regards to this poll.

1.the start of the war and it's build up to true twilight war (nuk escalation primarily). At first not that deferent than standard business with an increasing amount of politics of the "encouraging peace" type.

2.the lat stage grind. primarily the bit just before and right round the last grate push before the final calapas of the ability to support modern cvilation. Same as every body else stay alive and maintain as much functionality as possible.

3.aftermath (standard game setting). assessment and rebuilding especially of the churches communications ability’s. one thing this could defiantly included if the holy father has passed is an attempt to gather enough cardinals to hold a conclave.

[natehale1971]

There was a movie on Scy-fy (why the hell did they change it from Sci-Fi, i don't know) that had James Brolin in it as a father of two sons who were salvaging cities that were now under water due to the rising water levels that was putting most of the world under the sea.

The reason i bring this up, was the fact the Vatican was located at 'New Rome' (up on the higher ground near the original Rome) with the new Vatican compound able to look down on the Bay of Rome where the old Vatican was still under water...

The new Vatican had as much of the old Vatican feel that they could get. Not just the Swiss Guard in their distinctive uniforms, and architecture that looks so much like the original. I don't know where the monestaries or historically significant locations in the Roman Catholic church. But places like this, would definitely be possible evacuation locations of not only the Pope... but other members of the church leadership.

And we have to look at the kinds of things the church would be doing to help survivors get back up on their feet. The Church would be a good thing for communities to rally around, and it would be one of the things the Church leadership would know and try to use.

The church would more than likely be the FIRST to get a stable communications network set up... namely because the church has proven itself excellent at setting these up.

[Fusilier]

Originally Posted by natehale1971

And we have to look at the kinds of things the church would be doing to help survivors get back up on their feet.

Up on their feet, implying of course that is where they want them to be.

[natehale1971]

Originally Posted by Fusilier

Up on their feet, implying of course that is where they want them to be.

I think they would... having people who are able to feed themselves, means that they will be able to give extra to the church to feed the church leaders or even send it to other communities to help them get back on their feet.

[firewalker]

Originally Posted by Fusilier

Up on their feet, implying of course that is where they want them to be.

Why not even with a full dose of cynicism the deference between well feed organized powerful followers and a rabble of starving defenseless sad sacs is pretty easy? Even if were talking about the dud that look's around at his 100 loyal shooters and decides he wants’ to be pope (as well as secretary general of the UN and prince of the moon while he’s at it) is probley going to won’t to build up his "resources".

Any way there's a couple of things to keep in mind about the organization of the Catholic Church (some of this would also probley apply to other NGO typ's) first of its actually fairly decentrized at lest in a lot of the nut's and bolt’s type of things that would be mostly of interest to PC. Bishops and cardinals are generally in charge of there own arrears with the hiarcy providing an avenue for resource sharing and off course doctrinarian over site and frankly the last isn't going to be having much effect on the PC (even if your running a catholic PC group). Think of the pope more as a source of basic policy direction and final arbitrator.

That being said there is a level above which ONLY the pope can do things. For example no pope no new bishops/cardinals even the ability of bishops to ordain regular priests is in fact done in the name of the pope.

So a church with a sitting pope, John Paul or who ever would be (depending on the point in the timeline)

1.reastabling communication among dioceses and parshirs. This would also included providing pastoral care (priests and deacons) to places with out.

2.using the rebuilt network to agine shear recourses across dioceses in aid of the church aim's


Were as a church with out a sitting pope (almost surely do to John Paul's death) would be.

1.atimpting to gather enough cardinals (there is a specific quorum requirement) for a conclave. Also indecently thay are going to want the prelates of the non-roman right's there if possible as well.

2. sucuring and escorting the new pope (assuming he an't there) to were ever he wants to be. as an aside there's nothing that say's somebody has to be in attendance at the conclave to be raised to the papacy....in fact the only actual requirement is that he be a confermind adult catholic (of any rite).


On a slightly related note what about the Dalie lama (sp?) ? On one hand Tibet is by default free (China not really existing as such anymore) however “free” probley dose mean more likely in anarchy.

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by natehale1971

The church would more than likely be the FIRST to get a stable communications network set up... namely because the church has proven itself excellent at setting these up.

And (hopefully) nobody is shooting at them all the time...