Stupid GI Tricks

[dragoon500ly]

Originally Posted by James Langham

Market-Garden NEARLY worked, it would have only taken one perhaps two of the bits of bad luck for the operation to work.

For reference I would class both Montgomery and Patton above Rommel as commanders as they both were masters of logistics, something which Rommel ignored to great cost. "Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics."

Like the saying goes "Close only counts in horseshoes and with hand grenades."

It is to the everlasting credit of the 1st Allied Airborne Army and XXX Corps that Market-Garden achieved as much as it did. In spite of the bad luck, poor intelligence and piss-poor planning, it came so close to success by the sheer drive and courage of the men who fought and died for that damned highway.

No doubt that both Montgomery and Patton rated better than Rommel as battlefield commanders...on the other hand, how's this for a dream team...

Patton as army commander, Montgomery as his chief of staff and Rommel commanding the 2nd Armored Division!

[Sanjuro]

Without wanting to build up Montgomery's reputation (and acknowledging his appalling lack of diplomacy when dealing with the US) the thing I find easiest to understand is his caution. In common with most British Generals of WW2, he had fought in WW1 as a junior officer, and had seen how easily an entire army could be destroyed by poor command decisions. Indeed, he often showed a level of regard for the soldiers under his command which even modern generals could learn from.

[Raellus]

Originally Posted by Sanjuro

Without wanting to build up Montgomery's reputation (and acknowledging his appalling lack of diplomacy when dealing with the US) the thing I find easiest to understand is his caution. In common with most British Generals of WW2, he had fought in WW1 as a junior officer, and had seen how easily an entire army could be destroyed by poor command decisions. Indeed, he often showed a level of regard for the soldiers under his command which even modern generals could learn from.

Monty was a cautious and capable commander. His one foray into daring resulted in the "bridge too far" debacle. His reputation suffered because he often promised much more than he could deliver (D-Day/Normandy) and he was not shy about taking more than his fair share of credit for victories in which he played a supporting role (the relief/counterattack phases of the Battle of the Bulge). He also constantly demanded more from Ike- more authority, more divisions, more fuel, more operational freedom, etc.- despite his overall lack of success in Europe.

I believe that he did genuinely care about his men but he also cared far too deeply for his own reputation and legacy and, somewhat ironically, this is what has damaged it.

At the risk of getting flamed here, I think Monty is somewhat overrated. But then again, I think Patton and Rommel are a bit overrated as well.

[raketenjagdpanzer]

My dad was stationed in Spain at Torejon(sp) AFB in the early 60s and he told me a hell of a funny story...

The USAF base was situated inside a larger Spanish military base, so there were essentially two perimeters: the inner one guarded by the US and the outer one, guarded by the Spaniards.

There had been some concern that the buffer between the outer and inner perimeter wasn't as well guarded as it might be, and that the Spanish had a lackadaisical approach to base security there, so one bright young lieutenant one night had the idea of investigating this and catching the Spanish perimeter guards slacking off so he could file a formal report. He took a hapless corporal with him in a flight-line pickup truck...

Now as an interlude, (and pop personally witnessed this) when you drew weapons for guard duty in the USAF, you were issued an M1 Carbine and a sidearm, you signed for them, for the ammo, and you returned them afterward. The Spanish base security guys...not so much. You walked up, asked for a weapon, took what you got handed. You might get a grease gun, an STG-44, a bolt-action rifle, or, in some cases, a BAR.

So back to our lieutenant...out into the perimeter they went.

At a guardpost, some of the Spanish guards were doing their thing (which usually involved cooking and girlfriends), and our Lieutenant ordered his driver to, as they went into a gully, kill the headlights and then as they got to the top of the rise, kill the engine and coast up to the guard point, and they'd just see about all of this nonsense...

As soon as they topped the rise, everyone on that side of the base heard a fusillade of shots that seemed to go on for a minute or two (so dad says). He was close enough that he'd actually heard it - and before the sirens started, right after the shooting, they hear this voice shout: "ALTO."

Amazingly, the Lt. and his driver were unhurt (as soon as the fire zeroed on them they got small behind the engine block of the flight line truck they were in), but the front end of the truck was utterly destroyed by BAR fire.

Needless to say, no more questions were raised about the efficacy of the Spanish Nationals and their perimeter guarding capabilities...