Swedish Interests in T2K Poland

[Legbreaker]

As indicated, Poland is a mess. What self respecting nation is going to want anything to do with it in the short term?
Sweden, although largely untouched by the war (if you ignore EMP, Fallout, waves of refugees, shortages of just about EVERYTHING especially the imported products) isn't likely in my opinion to want to risk it's relatively tenuous position as the last bastion of civilisation in Europe, just to try for a little land grabbing. A couple of closer islands might be garrisoned, but that's about it.
That's not to say they won't send the odd recce team to take a look, or some of the more adventurous diplomats might try brokering a cease fire or two (and fail), but anything more than small groups of say a dozen or so just isn't likely.

[HorseSoldier]

I can't see Sweden not getting fragged by the Soviets to neutralize them as a potential threat when the nukes fly. I picture Sweden as intact but rough on the edges and not able to project serious power across the Baltic. I tend to see them more interested in Denmark, Finland, and Norway, but some fighting merchants and limited government ops in Poland and elsewhere could definitely happen.

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

As indicated, Poland is a mess. What self respecting nation is going to want anything to do with it in the short term?

For my part: What self respecting nation is going to want anything to do with it in any kind of term?

Poles are a pain even in peaceful time and I don't mean this as an insult. I say it full of respect as these people survive about anything and never give up.

[Rainbow Six]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

As indicated, Poland is a mess. What self respecting nation is going to want anything to do with it in the short term?
Sweden, although largely untouched by the war (if you ignore EMP, Fallout, waves of refugees, shortages of just about EVERYTHING especially the imported products) isn't likely in my opinion to want to risk it's relatively tenuous position as the last bastion of civilisation in Europe, just to try for a little land grabbing. A couple of closer islands might be garrisoned, but that's about it.
That's not to say they won't send the odd recce team to take a look, or some of the more adventurous diplomats might try brokering a cease fire or two (and fail), but anything more than small groups of say a dozen or so just isn't likely.

I think that's a fairly spot on summary...

[Legbreaker]

It's my belief that Switzerland will also be in serious strife in 2000. They may catch a few nukes "by accident" and being landlocked by waring nations certainly isn't going to help their trade efforts.
In fact I see neutral nations being in almost as bad a shape as some of the waring parties. Neutral nations by their very nature don't tend to develop alliances and so if they get attacked in the chaos of WWIII, who's going to help them out? It's not like they've really got the strength to strike back in any significant way...

[Mohoender]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

It's my belief that Switzerland will also be in serious strife in 2000. They may catch a few nukes "by accident" and being landlocked by waring nations certainly isn't going to help their trade efforts.

Why not for the nukes but still I doubt it. Then, given the geography of Switzerland damaged would be very limited. Being a land locked country could effectively be a problem but that overlooks the fact that Switzerland's neighbor is France. Both countries will certainly be collaborating with their borders being opened.

Of course, you still have the EMP but that shouldn't be a huge problem as well. EMP damages can be repaired and in countries remaining organized they will, at least to some extend. The length of the exchange is not really an issue as well because policies will be implemented in countries such as Switzerland to reduce the impact of these EMPs.

[HorseSoldier]

I'd think Switzerland gets ragged around the edges and very decentralized with electronic communications eliminated or severely degraded and motor transport greatly reduced. Things might get desperate enough that crime internal to the Swiss population would become a significant problem, and there'd be a constant issue of marauders drifting in from neighboring European battlefields. Probably the need for organized military response to marauders will keep the population in Swiss territory bordering the outside very keen on the nation-state and very identified as nationally Swiss (provided the government doesn't much the job up and create resentment instead). People in quiter more internal areas might be less sold on the benefits of central government outweighing the costs circa 2000, but I doubt it rises to the point where anyone thinks organized resistance makes sense.

[Mohoender]

No Switzerland will not suffer that much.

First, 100% of the population has access to shelter. These also include hospitals, command posts and emergency storage (with EMP in mind).

Second, fortification were dismantled in the 1990's but that wouldn't be the case in T2K and these would have been extended instead. These linked to the high mountain of switzerland will make it very hard to enter the country. Not to forget, the Swiss had built huge cavern complex that could hold their air force with every piece of strait road that could be transformed in a runway (as in Sweden by the way).

Third, the fully mobilized Swiss army would be at 625,000 men fully trained with the addition of a 480,000 strong civil defense (300,000 of them fully trained). At last you can add 11 border brigades which will be fully mobilized. Every village as a shooting club and rifle range.

Fourth, knowing the Swiss, you can expect any non-citizen to be pushed out in no time. Marauders?? They'll be like nuts under a hammer and forget about an invasion, there is nothing worth it.

Switzerland was the best prepared country in the world, it can sustain T2K with no problem. Also it can feed its population and again, knowing the Swiss, don't expect much panic. Of course, Switzerland can't sustain a direct attack but there is simply no reason for such an attack.

[Legbreaker]

Switzerland may be able to field that many troops short term, but they can't sustain it for long. To do so would absolutely cripple the countries ability to produce food and goods, and destroy it's economy.

What's to say the defences were retained? What's to say the situation in the early 90's didn't convince them they, and the ongoing maintenance costs could be disposed of?

Obviously roads doubling as airstrips would not be effected, and the shelters, etc remained, however their readiness may have been downgraded if the international, or more accurately regional situation allowed for it.

[dragoon500ly]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

It's my belief that Switzerland will also be in serious strife in 2000. They may catch a few nukes "by accident" and being landlocked by waring nations certainly isn't going to help their trade efforts.
In fact I see neutral nations being in almost as bad a shape as some of the waring parties. Neutral nations by their very nature don't tend to develop alliances and so if they get attacked in the chaos of WWIII, who's going to help them out? It's not like they've really got the strength to strike back in any significant way...

International law allows neutral nations to conduct trade with both sides.
Switzerland, for example, in WWII was allowed to import coal from Nazi Germany and allowed to pay for this material by exporting food, optics and machined goods by the Allies. Indeed, these delivery trains were marked and allowed to proceed through areas where other train traffic was being bombed/strafed. Sweden was allowed to ship ore and other material and there ships were escorted through the various minefields by both sides.

And don't forget that because they are neutral nations, embassies from both sides can be maintained, diplomatic letters exchanged, PoWs to badly wounded to fight on can be exchanged, and the various intelligence agencies have a safe haven to operate from, its also an excellent means of passing propaganda through, trade for specific goods, and so on. Both sides have a lot to gain by respecting the neutrality of a nation. Now, that does mean that accidents will not happen, accidental bombing raids have taken place, but overall, both sides work at protecting and respecting, the neutrality of a nation.