The 8th ID takes a wrong turn at Albuquerque...

[atiff]

Maybe it's all part of the German master plan?

May, 2000.
You know, Gunther, the world is pretty screwed up. How about we stage an "offensive", let all the Yanks go at the front, get themselves smashed up and bloody those Commies a bit for us. Then, we convince them that it's all over here, no more can be done, etc., and we offer them some ships to get back to the US - but we keep all their remaining toys as compensation for our efforts? Think they might go for that?

[Legbreaker]

That could work too... Shame it's only about a quarter of the Americans in Germany involved though.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Estonia has had an industry for processing oil from shale since the early 20th century so in some cases, the infrastructure and personnel may still exist. Or reconnaissance may have confirmed that the infrastructure was in a damaged although repairable state.
Also, the process for recovering oil from shale isn't particularly difficult and the basics of the process having been known in Europe since at least the 1600s. You can find information on it in any good encyclopedia.

The 8th ID heading for the shale deposits in Estonia certainly makes for an interesting speculation because the oils extracted don't necessarily have to be used for fuel.
Lubricants are far more important. Alcohol can be used for fuel but you can't use it to 'lube up' the bearings on an axle.

[Abbott Shaull]

I think if the 5th Mechanized hadn't been slammed between the Polish 1st Tank Army, and the Soviet 4th Guards Tank Army, 22nd Cavalry Army, and elements of the 3rd Shock Army it would met the same fate. The IX Corps was luck that the 2nd Marine Division was able to more or less link back up with them and consolidate.

[atiff]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

That could work too... Shame it's only about a quarter of the Americans in Germany involved though.

Ah, but that's the point.... there are only enough ships for 3/4 of the Americans.... They'd never go for it if they had to pick straws to see who stays....

[Abbott Shaull]

LOL the 2000 Offensive wasn't about showing the flexing of muscle, but to isolate American units so the US would be more incline to leave on German terms. *shakes head*

What a brilliant way to get rid of the excessive command layers that the US traditional brings to the table, while those troops remaining would be more willing to take commands from German Army...lol

[Legbreaker]

Back onto the 8th ID navigational error - it seems that the officer responsible wasn't in a combat unit at the front, but rather a staff officer. In that light a navigational error seems a little more likely - the wrong information was supplied to the units on the ground rather than an individual officer misreading the map or compass.

Still, nobody checked his work?
Possible I suppose since they were in action and short handed....

[Adm.Lee]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

Back onto the 8th ID navigational error - it seems that the officer responsible wasn't in a combat unit at the front, but rather a staff officer. In that light a navigational error seems a little more likely - the wrong information was supplied to the units on the ground rather than an individual officer misreading the map or compass.

Still, nobody checked his work?
Possible I suppose since they were in action and short handed....

I'd be more inclined to believe the staff officer got confused and sent someone up the wrong road, and then the Soviets started attacking from multiple directions. It doesn't even have to be the whole division sent the wrong way, but some vital element, like a notable chunk of the engineers or fuel trucks. Something that the rest of the formation would want to go rescue.

[Legbreaker]

I agree, you've only got to have something important head off in the wrong direction and get stuck for the entire unit to be derailed.
What may have happened is the logisitical tail headed up the wrong road, taking a left when they should have taken a right and in a huge hurry to catch up with the combat elements before a small enemy force caught up with them. Hell they could have been breaking contact with a plattoon or two of cavalry at the time, in a desperate hurry to pack up and get rolling before they were rolled over.

Still, I don't think that would put them more than a few dozen miles out of their way. I'm still thinking it had to be a bigger mistake, something in the Divisional movement orders themselves.

Perhaps the Staff Officer in question was in the Intel section - he advised that taking a particular road would head off an enemy unit they were chasing - "it'd only take them a hundred kilometres and bring them out a few hours in front..."
Instead it was the wrong road he was looking at on the map and it curved around, barely noticed in the poor visibility.