Leftover nukes and other WMDs?

[Silent Hunter UK]

Originally Posted by Ancestor

I always wondered what happened to all of the ICBM's and air delivered nukes (either gravity or via cruise missiles) in the original timeline.

Those not fired would probably be buried in their silos or have crashed with their shot-down aircraft.

[kato13]

Like so many things I forgot I had this

This is what my reasearch told me were active Nuclear and Chemical weapon storage and testing facilities in the US during the end of the cold war.

Anniston Army Depot (Chemical), Anniston Army Depot (Chemical), AL, VX,Sarin,Mustard,Blister, -85.92750549, 33.63704681
Pine Bluff Aresenal (Chemical), Pine Bluff Aresenal (Chemical), AR, VX,Sarin, -92.10302734, 34.33319092
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, North Island NAS, CA, NULL, -117.22194672, 32.68861008
Pueblo Chemical Depot, Pueblo Chemical Depot, CO, Mustard,Blister, -104.34142303, 38.27920151
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Kings Bay, GA, NULL, -81.53500366, 30.78222275
Newport Chemical Depot, Newport Chemical Depot, IN, VX, -87.42690277, 39.84940338
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Barksdale AFB, LA, NULL, -93.64305878, 32.50694275
US Army Chemical Center, Edgewood, MD, NULL, -76.29335022, 39.36801529
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Loring AFB, ME, NULL, -67.87444305, 46.96972275
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Whiteman AFB, MO, NULL, -93.53833008, 38.7266655
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Malmstrom AFB, MT, NULL, -111.19068909, 47.50999832
Blue Grass Chemical Depot, Blue Grass Chemical Depot, NC, NULL, -84.22180939, 37.6977005
Marine Chem/Bio Training Facility, MCAS Cherry Point, NC, NULL, -76.87190247, 34.88779831
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Grand Forks AFB, ND, NULL, -97.91666412, 47.93999863
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Minot AFB, ND, NULL, -101.31194305, 48.41027832
Kirtland Nuclear Munitions Storage Complex, Albuquerque, NM, NULL, -106.5490036, 35.00939941
Nuclear Weapon Storage /NBC School, Kirtland AFB, NM, NULL, -106.50777435, 35.0047226
Los Alamos National Laboratory, Los Alamos, NM, BSL-3, -106.26703644, 35.84027481
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Nellis AFB, NV, NULL, -114.95666504, 36.25166702
Umatilla Chemical Depot, Umatilla, OR, NULL, -119.34203339, 45.91767883
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Charleston Naval Weapon Station, SC, NULL, -79.97666931, 33.00777817
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Ellsworth AFB, SD, NULL, -103.10916901, 44.16583252
Oak Ridge National Laboratory, Oak Ridge, TN, BSL-3, -84.31666565, 35.93333435
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Dyess AFB, TX, NULL, -99.82749939, 32.43361282
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Gray AFB, TX, NULL, -98.59832764, 29.33722687
Pantex Nuclear Warhead Plant, Pantex Nuclear Warhead Plant, TX, NULL, -101.55290985, 35.31436539
Deseret Chemical Depot, Deseret Chemical Depot, UT, VX,Sarin,Mustard,Blister, -112.36820984, 40.40579987
NBC Testing Facility, Dugway Proving Ground, UT, BSL-3, -113.22899628, 40.1996994
Pentagon Bio Research, Arlington, VA, BSL-3, -77.05609894, 38.87099838
Naval Surface Weapons Center, Dahlgren, VA, BSL-3, -77.03307343, 38.34017181
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Yorktown NAS, VA, NULL, -76.58916473, 37.81666565
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Bangor, WA, NULL, -122.71472168, 47.71805573
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Fairchild AFB, WA, NULL, -117.63861084, 47.60666656
Nuclear Weapon Storage Facility, Warren AFB, WY, NULL, -104.87944794, 41.63333511

[Ancestor]

Awesome, thanks all!

[Tegyrius]

Found this thread while looking for something else and it prompted a couple of thoughts.

At the time of the Twilight War, US Army chemical munitions inventory consisted of:

• Sulfur mustard blister agent in 105mm and 155mm artillery shells and 4.2" mortar projectiles;

• GB (Sarin) non-persistent nerve agent in 105mm, 155mm, and 8" artillery shells and M55 artillery rockets; and

• VX persistent nerve agent in 155mm and 8" artillery shells, M55 artillery rockets, and M23 chemical land mines.

I believe the USAF also maintained aerial spray capability but I have no direct knowledge of those systems or which agents they were capable of dispersing.

A real-world per-site inventory of these as of 1997 is available here (the link I posted above is now defunct):

https://fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/cbw/cw.htm

The blister agent is mostly 1940s-50s production. The nerve agents date to the 1950s-60s.

Due to the mustard's age and its long storage period, a large quantity of the inventory has settled and solidified inside the munitions. This is a problem for the disposal efforts currently ongoing at Pueblo and Blue Grass. In rules terms within the T2k timeframe, I would expect this to reduce the weapons' effectiveness in terms of burst radius and damage dice.

The nerve agent is still viable with no effective loss of lethality.

The artillery shells are stored unfused. I have no info on the mortar shells but I expect they also were stored unfused. The M55s are solid-fueled artillery rockets, stored in their transport/launch tubes with both rocket motors and bursting charges in place. They are electrically-ignited - theoretically, an operator can initiate with a car battery. In a T2k recovery/theft scenario, the M55s are the munitions most likely to be usable by marauders, New America, or other factions in the absence of artillery and the requisite skill set.

- C.

[The Dark]

Some interesting adventures could be had by altering the timeline a bit and having the US maintain its stock of BZ. It's low-lethality (the lethal dose is about 40 times the incapacitating dose), with effects of confusion, memory breakdown, and hallucinations. It was estimated a BZ strike would incapacitate 94% of people in the area, with 2% lethality. BZ was delivered by two methods. The first was the M43 cluster bomb, which dropped 57 M138 bomblets, each with 6 ounces of BZ and would cover between 1/4 acre and 2 acres with BZ dust. Second was the M44 generator cluster, which used three smoke generators, each equipped with 42 canisters; each canister had 5 ounces of BZ. US stockpiles were destroyed at Pine Bluff 1988-90. The anticipated use was for situations were friendly and hostile assets were intermingled (such as hostage situations or rescue attempts), where the whole area would be hit before a protected team was inserted to withdraw the friendly assets.

[swaghauler]

Originally Posted by Tegyrius

Found this thread while looking for something else and it prompted a couple of thoughts.

At the time of the Twilight War, US Army chemical munitions inventory consisted of:

• Sulfur mustard blister agent in 105mm and 155mm artillery shells and 4.2" mortar projectiles;

• GB (Sarin) non-persistent nerve agent in 105mm, 155mm, and 8" artillery shells and M55 artillery rockets; and

• VX persistent nerve agent in 155mm and 8" artillery shells, M55 artillery rockets, and M23 chemical land mines.

I believe the USAF also maintained aerial spray capability but I have no direct knowledge of those systems or which agents they were capable of dispersing.

A real-world per-site inventory of these as of 1997 is available here (the link I posted above is now defunct):

https://fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/cbw/cw.htm

The blister agent is mostly 1940s-50s production. The nerve agents date to the 1950s-60s.

Due to the mustard's age and its long storage period, a large quantity of the inventory has settled and solidified inside the munitions. This is a problem for the disposal efforts currently ongoing at Pueblo and Blue Grass. In rules terms within the T2k timeframe, I would expect this to reduce the weapons' effectiveness in terms of burst radius and damage dice.

The nerve agent is still viable with no effective loss of lethality.

The artillery shells are stored unfused. I have no info on the mortar shells but I expect they also were stored unfused. The M55s are solid-fueled artillery rockets, stored in their transport/launch tubes with both rocket motors and bursting charges in place. They are electrically-ignited - theoretically, an operator can initiate with a car battery. In a T2k recovery/theft scenario, the M55s are the munitions most likely to be usable by marauders, New America, or other factions in the absence of artillery and the requisite skill set.

- C.

All of the artillery shells used in Special Weapons after the 1980's remanufacture were M687 Binary Chemical Munitions (base ejection using the M577 VT proximity fuse). These rounds combined the agent (GB, DF, BZ and several more) with an "accelerant" (OPA or Isopropyl Amine) during the launch of the round. Accelerating the round out of the gun caused a "diaphragm" between the two canisters to burst, allowing the chemicals to combine and react. The agent was then "distributed" by a "nebulizer device" which activated when the VT fuse "detonated" the round. The Chemical canister was NEVER STORED inside the round but rather installed by the Special Weapons team immediately before the round was fired. Binary rounds could be configured to deliver whatever chemical agent you desired (both liquid and powdered) and would outnumber every other delivery system 10 to 1 in 2000.

The M55's were not the best option and many were destroyed during Operation Red Hat in 1990. This would have STILL occurred in the Twilight timeline because of an unforeseen issue. Sarin breaks down over time and forms an acid that began to eat the aluminum casing of the M55 rockets. The Nitrocellulose can also break down and become dangerous. This is why the rockets were refrigerated (to keep the rocket motors from becoming unstable and becoming "Vertical Limit Nitro"). Not (as is assumed) to preserve the GB2. Many of these rockets were leaking by the late 80's and early 90's and so "disposal" was mandatory for safety reasons. The Rockets could be either electrically ignited or set to explode by kinetic option (a small "kicker charge" could set off the nitrocellulose... one of the reasons they were "decommissioned").

[Tegyrius]

PM inbound, Swag. I believe you and I are working off of different knowledge bases of different vintages.

- C.