Why no China?

[Olefin]

An order of Battle I found at the same web site - UI means unidentified unit - i.e. they didnt know the unit designation

[Olefin]

from the same link above as well as other sites including the wikipedia entry which heavily draws on Warden, Robert L.; Savada, Andrea; Dolan, Ronald;; Library of Congress, Federal Research Division (1988). "China: A Country Study". pp. 582–3

Under the system used in the 1980's that the game designers based the Chinese Army on for the game a field army consisted of three partially motorized infantry divisions and two regiments of artillery and anti-aircraft artillery.

Each field army division had over 12,000 personnel in three infantry regiments, one artillery regiment, one armored regiment, and one anti-aircraft artillery battalion. Each division was supposed to have its own armor and artillery but there was very little information to actually show was actual equipment levels they had.

In 1987 the new, main-force group armies typically included 46,300 soldiers in up to four divisions, believed to include infantry, armor, artillery, air defense, airborne, and air support elements. Those mobile armies were supposed to be mobile and capable of combined arms operations but because there was a lack of mechanization they still mostly consisted of foot infantry, usually transported by trucks at best, with armor and artillery support.

The 13 armored divisions each had 3 regiments and 240 main battle tanks but most didnt have much in the way of mechanized infantry support or APC's and tanks were used often as mobile artillery. There was some self-propelled artillery but rocket launchers were more often what was used for fire support.

Engineering equipment was available but there wasnt a lot of mine-laying or mine-clearing equipment which left the Chinese formations vulnerable to mine fields.

Artillery was mostly towed guns, howitzers and truck mounted multiple rocket launchers

Regional forces - i.e. independent divisions - were used as garrison units, mostly being static units to defend cities, coastlines or borders, and were artillery heavy but lacking in armor or transport. They were also used to train militia as well

Keep in mind that there are close to three million members of the People's Liberation Army Militia as well

Thus given the size of their military and adding in the Police and Militia you can see why no attempt to ever release a Chinese Army book was ever done - especially considering by 2000 there wasnt a Chinese Army anymore

[Olefin]

So as an example lets use the 205th Infantry Division - this is a unit that would have definitely been part of the fighting with the Soviets in 1995-1996

Originally the 28th Division the division was renamed as the 205th Infantry Division in 1985 and transferred to the 28th Army after the 69th Army Corps was disbanded. It consisted of the following units:

613th Motorized Infantry Regiment;
614th Motorized Infantry Regiment;
615th Motorized Infantry Regiment;
Tank Regiment which would have had around 80 main battle tanks - most likely Type 59 and Type 59-1 tanks (i.e. a Chinese copy of the T-54A)
Artillery Regiment;
Anti-aircraft Artillery Regiment.

The division was a Category A division and stationed with the 28th Group Army at Shanxi District in the city of Datong.

If you were creating a history for it you could have it involved in any stage of the Soviet Chinese War and possibly be one of the units that got nuked by the Soviets during the destruction of the Chinese Army. Thus you could have men from this unit be used as a basis for a marauder group in a campaign based in China or Mongolia

[kalos72]

My drive to figure out China is that I am working on an idea for the reunification of Korea against the Russians and if there are still viable Chinese units to support the endeavor.

I can't imagine there aren't any units left, however their loyalty of course is questionable.

[Legbreaker]

My understanding is any units still in something resembling one piece are in the southern parts of the country. The northern parts, which abuts Korea, are pock marked with nuclear craters and ghosts.

[Olefin]

I would say that there would be remnant units in Northern China - face it there were Soviet units that got nuked pretty badly as well - some of them were completely destroyed others were taken down to very low levels (as were American units - 2nd Armored for instance)

Thus could there be functioning remnant units - yes - but there is no higher authority for them to answer to except for various warlords

I would say that if there is any functioning armies or divisions that are left that Legbreaker is correct in that they would be in the central to southern areas of China away from the areas that got nuked - and mostly they would be garrison type units - as any Category A units or units that got updated to Category A during the war were probably all at the front fighting the Soviets and pretty much got nuked - example would be the Army reserve division that is on Hainan - most likely it came thru intact

[Olefin]

FYI - I think that if there ever really is anything on China that would even be close to approaching a sourcebook it either needs to be one that is more like a historical document - i.e. close to stuff that Chico and others have done trying to make a history of the war - or it needs to be a July 2000 or April 2001 China and show more what is still left and not what they had

i.e. not here is the 125 divisions that China used to have - its more like here are the 20 remnant divisions and/or warlord forces that are left