Version 4 of the game

[Vespers War]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

Considering we are the majority of the market for them, it's sheer idiocy not to find out isn't it?
They don't have to cater for everyone, but don't you think it's a smart idea to at least try and cater for the majority?

If we are the majority of the market, then there's not enough of a market to turn a profit on a new product and the project should be shut down.

My expectation is that they may try to broaden the scope to be a post-apocalyptic survival RPG that still has a lot of military backgrounds but also has more emphasis on the civilian side, to broaden the market. Essentially, look at what 2k13 did and do the opposite, because they narrowed the scope so much that they had no market. There's room in the market for PA games, and given what's out there, I think it's enough of a differentiator to have a serious game based on realistic tech (as opposed to a far-future PA with wondertech or the comic-book style mutations of Gamma World) without also pigeonholing players into strictly military backgrounds. The trick is to find enough of a differentiator to stand out without becoming so niche that you artificially limit your market.

That said, if it is going to Modiphius' 2d20 system, I'm almost certainly out of their market because I don't like that system. I'll just stick with my collection of GDW T2k and continue adding to it as I find old product in used book stores.

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by Vespers War

If we are the majority of the market, then there's not enough of a market to turn a profit on a new product and the project should be shut down.

We are the majority of the current market. That market may well expand, but where do you think most of the earlier reviews are going to come from?
With all my years of product development, sales, etc, I can't think of a worse way to approach this than they appear to be doing.

If they're changing the background, the rules, and setting it in a different time (say 2025), can it really be called Twilight? Why not just call it "Armageddon" or something like that and be done with it? Is it just an attempt to ride on the coat tails of the earlier games?

Of course all of this is pure speculation. We know virtually nothing at this point and may well be pleasantly surprised when the first official information is published (due in about 4-6 months I believe). Personally though, I'm not holding my breath.

[Olefin]

Well we know there is obviously some kind of decent market out there or the works that I did and Raellus did wouldnt have had many sales at all - and keep in mind that they were only offered at one place - i.e. got me how many fans never go to drivethrurpg.com at all or who are only interested in actual printed material and not pdf's. (i.e. I'll just stick with my collection of GDW T2k and continue adding to it as I find old product in used book stores.)

The real question is how much remains of the original market and does the new release managed to be released in such a way that it can really build an enduring and large enough fan base to make it profitable to pay people to write new material for it and make a profit

i.e. there are only so many people like Raellus and me who did it because we love the game versus working authors doing this for a living and thus having to sell enough product to be able to pay them and still make a profit

[Olefin]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

We are the majority of the current market. That market may well expand, but where do you think most of the earlier reviews are going to come from?
With all my years of product development, sales, etc, I can't think of a worse way to approach this than they appear to be doing.

If they're changing the background, the rules, and setting it in a different time (say 2025), can it really be called Twilight? Why not just call it "Armageddon" or something like that and be done with it? Is it just an attempt to ride on the coat tails of the earlier games?

Of course all of this is pure speculation. We know virtually nothing at this point and may well be pleasantly surprised when the first official information is published (due in about 4-6 months I believe). Personally though, I'm not holding my breath.

One thing I am hoping the new licensee/owners are smart enough to do is to allow people to still write for and release material for the old versions as well. That would also expand their releases - i.e. this month its V4, next month you get a "classic V2.2" release, etc..

Sort of what Star Trek has done - i.e you have books now being written on both the reboot Star Trek and the classic Star Trek and both sell well.

Thus I couldnt see why they couldnt embrace what I or Raellus wrote or what Leg is thinking of writing as part of what they are doing as "classic releases" instead of for the the new canon.

Still very much canon but now canon for V2.2 versus canon for V4

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by Olefin

...what Leg is thinking of writing...

Which is about a third done at the moment, but on hold until we know more about this 4th edition and what they are doing with the game.
I can see both advantages and disadvantages with my work tying into the new version. One advantage is possibly tapping into professional artwork and printed hard copies (not to mention actually getting a decent financial return for all the hours I've put in). Disadvantages I've already touched on.

[Jason Weiser]

I will keep my powder dry till we get details. I do hope it respects the source material in some form or fashion. I think that's where 2013 went wrong IMO. That said, if V4 does that, and breathes new life into this old girl, I'd be happy.