Cold War Warsaw Pact Vehicle crossposts.

[pansarskott]

Originally Posted by Raellus

I wonder why designers/engineers moved away from that design philosophy and towards integrated/combo units

My guess: It's easier to train someone to use it and the hit probability is higher.

1st gen: fly a rocket using a joystick towards the target. More difficult if the launcher is offset from the line between operator and target. Even more complicated when the target is moving and you have to estimate distances and how hard to turn the missile.

2nd gen: keep the crosshairs on the target until the missile hits. The launcher will send commands to the missile to keep it on track (the missile has a beacon that the launcher "sees")

And now there are missiles like Javelin to take care of the problem of staying exposed guiding the missile.

[Raellus]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

Also worth noting it's generally western doctrine to operate AT missiles in pairs. The target usually can only shoot at one of the launchers so the other should get the hit.

That definitely increases the odds of a hit/kill, but it would be small consolation for the crew that the enemy decides to blast with counter-fire.

Originally Posted by pansarskott

1st gen: fly a rocket using a joystick towards the target. More difficult if the launcher is offset from the line between operator and target. Even more complicated when the target is moving and you have to estimate distances and how hard to turn the missile.

That's a good point.

Originally Posted by pansarskott

2nd gen: keep the crosshairs on the target until the missile hits. The launcher will send commands to the missile to keep it on track (the missile has a beacon that the launcher "sees")

Right, but I imagine that this system would work just as well with an offset launcher than with an all-in-one unit.

Originally Posted by pansarskott

And now there are missiles like Javelin to take care of the problem of staying exposed guiding the missile.

Indeed. I reckon armies would run out of those current gen fire-and-forget ATGMs soonest, leaving older wire-guided models (until those run out).

[pansarskott]

Originally Posted by Raellus

Right, but I imagine that this system would work just as well with an offset launcher than with an all-in-one unit.

Some technical difficulties with syncing launcher and missile, but that can probably be solved. But then we're increasing complexity and cost and might as well go for fire-and-forget missiles.
Just looking a bit and read about the French missile MMP (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missile_Moyenne_Portée) which has Lock On After Launch. But that's not Twilight:2000's tech level.

Wire-guided missiles has a feature that fire-and-forget does not have: the ability to switch targets mid-flight (with some limitations depending on the turn radius of the missile). However, the usefulness can be debated.

But the 10 seconds it would take from firing with massive backblast until the missile hits 2000 meters away would feel like an eternity. I trained on the Swedish RBS-56 BILL missile ages ago.

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by Raellus

That definitely increases the odds of a hit/kill, but it would be small consolation for the crew that the enemy decides to blast with counter-fire.

That 50/50 chance of NOT being the recipient of lots of incoming lead and HE is a massive morale booster though!

[Hybris]

I would love for my Cubans to drive around in these and make my players life living hell.

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by Hybris

I would love for my Cubans to drive around in these and make my players life living hell.

Aw, c'mon, you can't just post pictures and not tell us what they are or what the picture's source is!

[Hybris]

Originally Posted by pmulcahy11b

Aw, c'mon, you can't just post pictures and not tell us what they are or what the picture's source is!

Hey you tortured me for many years with your work on a slow internet connection back in 1999 and i have to use a old inkjet printer that i used the nights while on guard duty , This is long overdue Btw i got a flashback while on exercise in Romania 2019, the connection was as slow

[Hybris]

[ATTACH]Attachment 4433[/ATTACH]I was thinking about the IDF Achzarit the israelis used/uses and was thinking if the cubans could have done something similar in order to enhance the protection of their old apcs.

Its called BTR 100 and is using a T55 turret ( so i guess the chassis could be used as apc like for the IDF, the twin zou-57-2 could be 57mm BTR-60/57-2 / BTR-60 Duplex

I also found this.

https://www.globalsecurity.org/milit...quipment-1.htm

and this:

BTR-115 - BTR-60 115mm T-62 turret


"The so-called BTR-115 is a BTR chassis, to which the T-62 turret has been mounted. Army General Raul Castro Ruz visited three industrial military companies in Havana, as part of a journey that he had undertaken for some days in the country and that took him previously to Camagüey, Santiago de Cuba and Mayabeque. On 19 February 2018 the Cuban President went to the Emilio Bárcenas Pier Industrial Military Company, in which armored vehicles for the Revolutionary Armed Forces and other means of transport are repaired and modernized. There the Army General was made aware of the fulfillment of the economic indicators of the company, which has more than 1,700 workers and has among its main production lines the repair, maintenance and modernization of bulldozers, cranes and tractors; Maz, Kamaz and Kraz trucks, among others.

He saw the new generation "institutional" version of the Cuban Army BTR-60, the biggest change compared to the old variant is that it carries a new, larger-sized cannon with a fume extractor near the middle of the barrel. It is not difficult to realize that this type of cannon is the U-5TS (also known as 2A20) of 115 mm size equipped with the main T-62 battle tanks, which the Cuban Army also has a lot.

The new vehicle fitted with an upgraded turret of the T-62 main battle tank and called the BTR-116. According to the current information, were produced approximately 10 new wheeled fire support vehicles. The BTR-116 has a modified hull and it is a radical and deep modernization of the BTR-60 APC. This fire support vehicle is effective against all APCs, IFVs, fortifications, and infantry. It can also engage medium tanks. Gun is loaded manually. No further details on the BTR-116’s specifications have been adduced.

The integration of 115mm guns on the BTR-60 will certainly help this armored vehicle with a much better capacity than the current, capable of destroying the enemy's advanced tanks as well as providing a high level of firepower reinforcement for infantry. The cannon is much more powerful, 115mm and smooth bore, superior to 105mm western guns. In the few photos that are, it is seen that the turret goes back more than the 100mm of the BTR-100. But the barrel looks shorter. It is speculated that the latter may be due to the fact that the barrel power is too much for the vehicle, and that the Cubans would use it as the BMP-3 cannon. That is, discarding the use of APFSDS projectiles. Possibly it would use only the FRAG-HE, for fire support. And as an antitank weapon, it could trust the Bastion missile, launched by the cannon.

Although the capacity has not been tested through actual combat, Cuba's practice is really a creative solution, and it may be worthwhile for the Vietnam People's Army to study and study to be able to deploy when exporting. currently requires urban combat in the new situation."