The ANZACs in T2k

[Legbreaker]

All useful information, even if a little too modern for my needs (there was a fair bit of reorganisation between the mid 90's and the date of these docs).
Thanks.

[Olefin]

FYI there will be information on American Samoa and Oceania (at least in the area around them) in the next issue of the fanzine which has been delayed by multiple personal and business (as in where I work) issues

[Raellus]

This might be of interest here:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ver-east-timor

-

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by Raellus

This might be of interest here:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ver-east-timor

-

Thank you for that. While I wasn't specifically aware of this particular incident, I do have information on a number of other, similar ones. There was a real risk shit could have turned sour, something I personally believe certain elements within Indonesia were hoping for. Fortunately the Australians (and those nations present at the time) kept their cool.
The region could well be a different place today if they hadn't.

[Targan]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

Thank you for that. While I wasn't specifically aware of this particular incident, I do have information on a number of other, similar ones. There was a real risk shit could have turned sour, something I personally believe certain elements within Indonesia were hoping for. Fortunately the Australians (and those nations present at the time) kept their cool.
The region could well be a different place today if they hadn't.

We would have flogged them, and frankly they had it coming.

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by Targan

We would have flogged them, and frankly they had it coming.

We would have for the first week.
Right up until our logistics system shattered under the strain. It barely coped as it was with a simple peace keeping mission.

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by Raellus

This might be of interest here:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ver-east-timor

-

I'm sorry, but Henri's account smells like BS to me.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Originally Posted by pmulcahy11b

I'm sorry, but Henri's account smells like BS to me.

Can you elaborate on why you think he's full if it?
It came across as reasonably plausible so I'm very curious as to how other people perceive it.

For some context, I know of somewhat similar incidents. One of my neighbours and I got along very well because we had many similar interest including time in the Australian military. His son was in the RAN and was on one of the ships serving in the Australian mission so while East Timor was going on, we discussed it pretty much every time we saw each other in the street.
His son relayed a few accounts about encounters with the Indonesians.

Apparently one Indonesian sub was tasked with keeping an eye on the Australian navy in the area and was trying to shadow our ships every time they moved into or out of the area. The Indon sub was detected relatively easily given the situation but it was persistent and tried to be sneaky when following Aussie ships.

Now, that's not as dramatic as an "almost dogfight" between the two air forces but it does show that while the Indons claimed to be withdrawing, the committed a large number of military assets to the area.
It was public knowledge here in Australia for several decades (from the 1970s on) that the Indon government did not like us and resented out presences in the region. Some people felt that the Indons were itching for a fight and whether that's true or not, they certainly did try some provocative acts (although they never quite crossed the line) through the decades.

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by StainlessSteelCynic

Can you elaborate on why you think he's full if it?

I know this going to sound like a cop-out, but it's a gut feeling.

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by pmulcahy11b

I know this going to sound like a cop-out, but it's a gut feeling.

I actually got a similar feeling. Henri comes across as trying to paint himself as more heroic than he really is.

[Raellus]

Not really T2k-related, but since we're talking about the Indonesian AF...

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...e-fighter-jets

-

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Originally Posted by Legbreaker

I actually got a similar feeling. Henri comes across as trying to paint himself as more heroic than he really is.

This actually seems to be a bit of a common thing with Indonesian military types talking about Australia. It's been known for decades that elements of the Indonesian government and military view Australia as an impediment to their domination of the region and they have portrayed us as the local bully and/or lapdog of imperialism/colonialism/whatever-ism.

I get the feeling that boasting about how they "stood up to the Australians" is part of the military mindset - it's certainly been played upon by their politicians in the past. Rereading the linked article with Paul's and Leg's misgivings in mind definitely makes me think that Henri is at the very least boasting (to enhance his prestige?)

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by StainlessSteelCynic

... Henri is at the very least boasting (to enhance his prestige?)

Almost certainly I would think. There may be some truth to his claims, but most likely he's....enhanced his role somewhat...

Meanwhile... https://en.antaranews.com/news/15838...nse-capability