Gun Trucks

[Askold]

a) Those cartels have some serious firepower. .50 sniper rifles and machine guns are bad enough but they actually have anti-tank weapons.

b) I would think that they would try to buy/steal real armoured vehicles by now. Maybe from the Mexican military or shipped from another country. I'm sure those would be better than putting some hill-billy armour on a SUV.

c) I wasn't sure if our team should build a gun-truck in Twilight but after reading this thread I think it should be our next objective.

[Brother in Arms]

I am exceptionally happy to see this thread revived.

I was thinking about gun truck Armaments today since that has been touched upon but more folks have talked about the actual trucks themselves and armor.

In Europe there would be several different weapons available. Clearly on the NATO side there would likely be M60, MAG-58/GPMG, MG-3, M249/Minimi
M2, Mark 19.

what else?

[boogiedowndonovan]

Originally Posted by Brother in Arms

I am exceptionally happy to see this thread revived.

I was thinking about gun truck Armaments today since that has been touched upon but more folks have talked about the actual trucks themselves and armor.

In Europe there would be several different weapons available. Clearly on the NATO side there would likely be M60, MAG-58/GPMG, MG-3, M249/Minimi
M2, Mark 19.

what else?

probably been mentoned already but rocket launchers, recoilless rifles, AA guns, how about a disabled M113?

If you haven't checked out Graebarde's 5th Infantry Division Reorganization document, try this link

http://forum.juhlin.com/showthread.php?t=1920

He has a provisional cavalry unit equipped with gun trucks, including a HEMET with captured quad 23mm gun and another with a M163 Vulcan ADA chassis.

Here's a pic of a Vietnam era guntruck with M113 chassis

http://www.flickr.com/photos/zippo132/6794824507/

a different Vietnam M113 guntruck

http://www.warwheels.net/images/m54A...ruckLyles1.jpg

Here's a news article from the recent Libya conflict about the 'DIY' weapons, shows a rocket laucher mounted on a truck.

http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2...rebels/100086/

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Don't just limit it to Infantry weapons, there's other sources of armament that gets forgotten about - light AA guns and aircraft/helicopter weapons.
Both the Rhodesians and the South Africans mounted 20mm cannon taken from aircraft onto vehicles, a practice started as far back as WW2 when the Long Range Desert Group mounted Vickers K machine guns on their jeeps and Chevvies.

It can still be seen in the "technicals" in Africa and the Middle East with such installations as single and twin barrel ZSU-23 systems mounted on the back of trucks. The 20mm German cannon in the 2nd Ed. Heavy Weapons book would be a good choice.
Given what's been seen in Libya this year, helicopter rocket pods are not out of the question and maybe even the turret & basket from a BMP.

Edit: Hmm, I see BoogieDownDonovan posted similar ideas as I was typing my reply. And he has links!

[Raellus]

60mm mortars would be useful indirect fire weapons and take up relatively little space. The IDF used to mount 60mm mortars on their tank turret roofs. A direct fire 81mm mortar, like the one mounted under M2 HMGs on Vietnam-era USN riverine craft would be a devastating weapon system for a gun truck (but would require a fairly sturdy mount).

[rcaf_777]

Some Images from the Interweb

[Apache6]

http://smallwarsjournal.com/blog/mex...n-nuevo-laredo

Also below are photos from US Army unit in Iraq.

[stormlion1]

I look at those pics and only think "When the Devil Drives, needs must"

[Webstral]

I love these images!

[Apache6]

Agree, odd that those OIF photos would not look too out of place in T2K

[Olefin]

Originally Posted by Webstral

I love these images!

I second what Webstral said - love these images and great ideas!!

[unkated]

I have always believed...

- That when true military vehicles cease to be available, civilian vehicles will be adapted - a pickup is better than walking; where a pickup is not available, two Ford Escorts (or compact car of your choice) will do (if they run). Beats walking and carrying all your stuff.

- Where armor is not available, soldiers will improvise as they always have. A wall of double-thick 2x4s is not as good as the armor of an M2 - but stops more bullets and shrapnel than air. Manhole covers are even better.

- As APCs die off, guntrucks and other vehicles will be improvised for use as APCs. MLRS launcher without missiles? Remove the launcher, weld on an armored box (although morelikely used for a transport.

- Military trucks are likely to last longer (as APCs) than civilian vehicles - though there are more civilian vehicles available (in Europe or the US).

And yeah, the pictures suit very well.

[SionEwig]

I ran across this image (a smaller version) today on a bicycling blog and thought this group might find it interesting.

[copeab]

Originally Posted by SionEwig

I ran across this image (a smaller version) today on a bicycling blog and thought this group might find it interesting.

More appropriate for a Victorian Science Fiction wargame

[Bullet Magnet]

Originally Posted by SionEwig

I ran across this image (a smaller version) today on a bicycling blog and thought this group might find it interesting.

Anyone who has ridden a bike where there are motorists, fully understands this photo.

[jester]

The converted trucks used in A-Stan against the Soviets, Technicals in Somalia and other parts of Africa and now ISIS, many converted civilian trucks and even stripped cars with a heavy MG or even rocket launcher mounted and armor from various sources would be the norm even in Europe and N. America.

[Apache6]

More photos from Iraq plus some from Libyia including a M113 variant with what looks like a SALADIN turret with 76mm gun(?).

[Apache6]

Including a Korean War era jeep.

[Webstral]

One really has to appreciate the creativity of some folks. That M113 with the add-on turret is a work of art. The pickups are perfectly serviceable weapons carriers, though I'd tighten up pretty severely if there were return fire.

[Raellus]

Found this big beaut while looking for pics for a supplement I'm hoping to post soon.

[Raellus]

Here's another, of what appears to be a separate vehicle. According to the online picture caption, "Ural4320 with a part of BRDM’s hull on a trunk, with UB-32-57 rocket launcher mounted on its turret." This particular vehicle was nicknamed "Broom" by its builder.

[Webstral]

Beauty! One has to wonder whether they didn't consider IF with that bad boy. It would be a shock to be on the receiving end of a concentrated barrage from the business end of that pretty girl.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Been a while since I looked at this thread but here's a couple of observations...

The Ural trucks with BRDM hull sections look like two different trucks or at the very least, if it is the same truck then at very different periods of time (irrespective of the unit markings etc. I'm looking at the damage on the bumper bar that isn't present in the other photo).

As for the M113, it looks to me like the turret from a Panhard AML90, it's certainly sporting the muzzle brake of the 90mm gun found on the AML90... M113 with 90mm, gonna have me some fun!

[Raellus]

If you haven't checked it out before, the site War is Boring contains a bevy of articles on all sorts of military history and tech, as well as current affairs, updated regularly. I spotted this article there today:

https://warisboring.com/in-1940-the-...ebb#.ip3p5x4xu

This strikes me as something that both MilGov and CivGov would be doing soon after The Exchange, if not before.

[unkated]

Of a similar nature were some other emergency military vehicle designs in the same period, also designed to minimize the use of strategic materials:

• Standard Beaverette - Named for Lord Beaver, British Minister of Aircraft Production in 1940, who requested it. Basically, a mid-size sedan with minimal armor (11mm) on the front and sides of the driving compartment, backed by 3-in of oak, armed with a Bren LMG.
  
• Bison - a mobile pillbox made using a heavy truck chassis walled with concrete. It was not meant to be used while driving, but could be driven to (for example) an airfield suffering from an attack by German airborne troops, parked, and then used as a defensive strong point. The concrete would stop small arms fire, protecting MG crews inside firing out through open ports.
  
• Bedford OXA - a lightly armored (9mm steel) 1.5t truck armed with a Bren LMG and a Boys ATR

All of these were built quickly for home defense following the Fall of France and the withdrawal from Dunkerque, where the British Army lost most of its heavy equipment and vehicles.

Certainly, something like the Beaverette or the Armadillo could be concocted in any automobile plant. Homemade versions similar to the Armadillo built up on the bed of a pickup truck should be easy enough.

Light armor vehicles with limited off-road capability and/or portection work fine - if your opponent has none.

Uncle Ted

[Apache6]

A single (mentally unstable) guy was able to design and build an armored bulldozer, equipped with video cameras and gun ports in his garage.

The number of places capable of doing this in the U.S. has to number in the thousands. I know of two local 'performance motorsports' buisnesses locally that I'm sure could design and produce the vehicles.

I think that it would be common to use commercial dump trucks (which already have heavily built chassis) and/or bulldozers as the basis of gun trucks and field expedient "tanks." This does not require a massive industrial basis, since the core component of the vehicles are already existing. If the designers are smart they will use VERY common vehicles (catapiller D-7 dozers and Oshkosh Dump trucks sinces there are lots of parts that can be scavenged).

[Targan]

Yup, my Great-Grandad had his "tank" whipped up at a railway workshop.

[Olefin]

Saw this video about Vietnam era gun trucks - enjoy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkc_...ature=youtu.be

[Olefin]

Saw this article and had all kinds of ideas for players and GM's to turn Toyota trucks into very effective fighting machines including examples from Somalia, Chad and Libya.

Got to love the following paragraph from the story

"The Libyans weren’t the best soldiers, or the best tacticians, but they were the most innovative engineers. They attached armor plate-mated office chairs with ZPU AA guns, sawed off the roof to increase the arc of fire for the recoilless rifle in the bed. They produced hundreds of trucks armed with huge S-5 Soviet rocket pods, intended for aircraft. They even cut the turret off of a BMP-1 Soviet Armored Personnel Carrier and mounted it on the back of a Toyota."

https://warontherocks.com/2014/02/th...ra-of-warfare/

[Dackattack]

My philosophy on vehicles in T2k is this:if you can, put a gun on it

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