French nuclear target list?

[Olefin]

Looking at the 2nd edition the French got hit pretty good - enough that the French mafia have control of the southern part of the country. Was the Australian story written before or after the 2nd edition came out?

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by Olefin

Was the Australian story written before or after the 2nd edition came out?

Yes....
It's from Twilight encounters and I believe it was also included in the 2.0 yellow box (only thing I don't have). The chance it was written before is about equal to after. 2.0 was certainly very close to finalisation when the original was published.

[Olefin]

Twilight Encounters is version 1 timeline - so that supports the version 1 timeline where the French most likely didn’t get nuked. So that reinforces that in the V2 and V2.2 timeline they definitely got nuked as per the game timeline and description of France. Will see if I can come up with a likely list of targets based on the description from the V2.2 rules. Keep in mind it sounds definitely like a limited attack - ie this isn’t the widespread attack that the US or UK or the Soviets went thru. I suspect the French hit back and told the Soviets it ends or we join the US and the Germans and the Soviets backed down - after all they had already hit what they wanted to hit.

[Legbreaker]

Is it though?
Remember the box includes conversion rules to 2.0 and it was being written at the same time as 2.0. There's a very strong chance the writers of both were at least aware of the other's work, if not even directly collaborating.
That one statement by the trooper could easily apply to either, or both timelines.

Remember though that it's just the words of one man. It's essentially a rumour.
Probably at least partially based in fact, and as an SAS trooper they're possibly more aware of to state of the world than most soldiers of equivalent rank.

It's also quite possible the French don't want anyone to know just how badly they were hit (if at all) so they can at least maintain the illusion of strength even though internally it's chaos.

[Olefin]

Also keep in mind that the attack on the French may not have happened until the time of the follow up nuclear strikes on Britain that occurred in 1998 - i.e. just because the big nuke strikes were in 1997 doesnt mean thats when it hits France- especially if the Soviets got wind that in any way the French were thinking of supplying oil to or allowing their ports to be used by NATO

[Legbreaker]

Indeed. You've got a lot of leeway with France. Nuke or not, early or late, heavy or light. There's really no "right" answer besides what works best for you.

[Olefin]

have a feeling that the French hit back just as hard - remember reading something - not sure if it was here or somewhere else - that had the French firing a few nukes that took out one of the Soviet major ports with the message that it either stops now or they join NATO

[lordroel]

Originally Posted by Olefin

Looking at the 2nd edition the French got hit pretty good - enough that the French mafia have control of the southern part of the country. Was the Australian story written before or after the 2nd edition came out?

And still they manged to take control of Belgium and occupy parts of the Netherlands and West Germany.

[Olefin]

Per the story the Belgians joined freely with the French - have a feeling they didnt want to be out there on a limb all by themselves - and remember that a lot of Belgians have a historic tie to France. And the areas they took over in the Netherlands and Germany pretty much were against formations that had taken serious losses already - i.e. if the Dutch and Germans had pre-war formations and air power there is a good chance the French and Belgians would have taken a very very bloody nose

And considering the size of the French and Belgian formations they had to have taken some good sized losses during the invasion of both areas - none of the French formations in those areas is anywhere near pre-war manpower or equipment

[lordroel]

Originally Posted by Olefin

Per the story the Belgians joined freely with the French - have a feeling they didnt want to be out there on a limb all by themselves - and remember that a lot of Belgians have a historic tie to France. And the areas they took over in the Netherlands and Germany pretty much were against formations that had taken serious losses already - i.e. if the Dutch and Germans had pre-war formations and air power there is a good chance the French and Belgians would have taken a very very bloody nose

And considering the size of the French and Belgian formations they had to have taken some good sized losses during the invasion of both areas - none of the French formations in those areas is anywhere near pre-war manpower or equipment

Still think the Belgians joining the French freely is a little bit to much, the country is divided into a French and Dutch speaking part, never would the Dutch speaking part become a member of a French speaking alliance.

[Legbreaker]

And there's plenty of Belgians who align themselves more with Germany than France.

[Olefin]

I have always said if there is one thing that needs to be rewritten and admit they made an error in the game is Belgium whole heartedly joining France in an invasion of the Netherlands and Germany. There is no way that the Flemish area of Belgium joins up for that. You would have had a lot of Flemish soldiers saying screw this and joining the Netherlands in their fight against the French.

I.e. they need to show Belgian units breaking up, some soldiers either refusing orders, deserting, shooting their officers and mutinying, you name it as part of the timeline. But what you get instead is Belgium in lockstep with the French invading and taking over a large part of the Netherlands and apparently the whole Belgian Army saying sure why not.

I suspect there would have been a hell of a lot of insubordination at the very least - and possibly some flat out conflict where Flemish soldiers or units joined the other side.

[lordroel]

Originally Posted by Olefin

I have always said if there is one thing that needs to be rewritten and admit they made an error in the game is Belgium whole heartedly joining France in an invasion of the Netherlands and Germany. There is no way that the Flemish area of Belgium joins up for that. You would have had a lot of Flemish soldiers saying screw this and joining the Netherlands in their fight against the French.

I.e. they need to show Belgian units breaking up, some soldiers either refusing orders, deserting, shooting their officers and mutinying, you name it as part of the timeline. But what you get instead is Belgium in lockstep with the French invading and taking over a large part of the Netherlands and apparently the whole Belgian Army saying sure why not.

I suspect there would have been a hell of a lot of insubordination at the very least - and possibly some flat out conflict where Flemish soldiers or units joined the other side.

There would be a civil war in Belgium most likely.