#1




Updating Loadouts
So, I was messing around with the basic loads listed in TM 11, with a goal of coming up with updated weaponry loadouts to go along with the cache updates of 1987, 1999 and 2013.
In order to simplify the process, I created a spreadsheet (big surprise) and used the TM 11 loads to check the formulas. Of the 62 possible combinations, I can’t match the total weight (carried out to 0.01kg) of 21 loadouts. Some are off by only 0.01kg but others are off by as much a 1.00kg. I’ve triple checked everything to no avail and hope someone on the forum may have done this exercise previously or may be able to find a glitch in my calculations (otherwise it appears that the numbers in TM 11 are off). In order to use the spreadsheet (Load #4 with the Ingram is loaded as an example):
Once I know the calculations are right, this then becomes a tool for customizing loadouts and makes it easy to add different weapons or gear (i.e. M18 Smoke grenades, SAW, M320 GL, etc.). Last edited by Desert Mariner; 07152019 at 09:42 AM. 
#2




Quote:
Then it comes down to the exact weight of an empty 9mm and 45ACP magazine. Then add the weight of 32 9mm or 30 45ACP cartridges and then what type of cartridges where used standard ball? I'll dig around in my library to see what I can find out for specs. Last edited by nuke11; 06172019 at 08:06 PM. 
#3




I've noticed that before. However, the spreadsheet is using the weight data from the individual items in the 4E and the calculations still don't match the loadout totals shown in TM 11. So, either I've erred in a formula (which I haven't yet found) or the authors made some math errors.

#4




Quote:

#5




Here are my numbers for Load #4
LOAD #4 4th Edition target : 18.82kg 1 M10 w/12 mags = 2.83 kg + 13x0.62 kg : 10.89 kg 1 HP35 w/3 mags = 0.88 kg + 3x0.2 kg : 1.48 kg 4 M67 Grenades = 4x0.39 kg : 1.56 kg 2 M6 CNDM Grenades = 2x0.48 kg : 0.96 kg 2 M9A1 BZ Grenades = 2x0.45 kg : 0.90 kg 2 M34 WP Grenades = 2x0.76 kg : 1.52 kg 3 HAFLA35Ls = 3x0.63 kg : 1.89 kg Weapons Total : 19.20 kg Project pistol suppressor : 0.24 kg Project M10 suppressor : 0.34 kg Total : 19.78 kg Over by 0.96 kg If you want to update to the M6A1 CNDM (M6A1 2x0.57 kg) : 1.14 kg 
#6




Quote:
I know it's only a hundredth but if I can't get the numbers to come out correctly using given data (TM 11 loadouts) then I can't have much confidence in new figures I generate. Any updates for USGI munitions and ordinance, such as the M6A1, would be appreciated. Most of my Army TM Data Sheets are from the mid80s and 90s which will work for the first 2 updates but not the last 
#7




Quote:
For 2.83 Kg for the M10 9mm I'm using Kevin Dockery's Special Warfare Special Weapons book. Now if you look at his The Armory Vol 1 he has it listed as 2.84 Kg, which this book was done around the same time as TMP was being published. I will be digging into my library of 1970's Jane's books, but I need to get them out of storage. I believe that the M9A1 BZ grenade might be light for weight. But that is a very hard grenade to find information on. I'm basing my assumption on just looking at the M6/A1, M7/A1/A2/A3 and the M8 smoke grenades. They are all a bit heavier in the A1 configuration than there initial versions. Looking around the closest that I could find has a Yugosolvian BRS M79 AG2 grenade which in the 2 reports I found, is 0.45 Kg, so maybe the M9A1 could be right. Last edited by nuke11; 06192019 at 05:09 PM. 
#8




I had checked the Armory but not sure what happened to my copy of Special Weapons. I'm at a point where I think my formulas are good and that the totals in 4e TM 11 are off.
So, I'll proceed with adding some newer weaponry for the late cache upgrades. My thought on canned basic loadouts is to ignore them in favor of choosing weapons in the categories in the spreadsheet and building an individual loadout. This even allows for a SASS type load for a contact package if the PC so desires. If there's any interest, I can post an updated spreadsheet with my additions. 
#9




Quote:
I always used the included loadouts as suggestions We modified them to suite what was needed and was cool in the day. Some of the weights are way off, not really sure where they got them from. 
#10




Updated spreadsheet is attached. There are two worksheets Calculations and Data. Data is just that, background data for the various dropdowns and actual weight calculations. Entries that are highlighted in tan are new items not contained in TM 11.
The Calculation sheet needs user input in the light green cells to indicate the number of given items (i.e. grenades, reloads (aka feed devices), etc.). The dark green cells are dropdowns. There is input available for up to 2 sidearms, rifle/carbine, SMG, shotgun, GL, MG and as many as 4 miscellaneous items (suppressors, missiles, Medic Kit, even extra MG belts). Hand and 40mm grenades are entered in the lower 2 tables and each has an area to enter a standard or suggested loadout for reference. New items in these tables are also highlighted. The 40mm grenades will not appear in the totals unless a GL is selected from the appropriate dropdown. New weapons range from Colt SAA to SIG P320, the FN SCAR family to Winchester lever guns and the M249 to M32A1 GL. New grenades include the HGr86, M15 WP, M18 smoke and SOHG plus numerous nonlethal and smoke 40mm rounds. The weights used are all in a separate spreadsheet where I’ve settled in a given round for each weapon (i.e. Hornady 750gr AMAX BT for the new .50 calibers) most of the other cartridges used are from Sellier & Bellot. Weights include everything (I think) right down to the MG belt links. I did this to make the data repeatable and so that it is easy to add to the tables. This also enabled the second part of my current project; updated stat blocks for the weapons including range cards (see attached PDF as an example). Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. EDIT I should have added that the reason for multiple older weapons is it allowed me to check my calculations for adjusting muzzle velocity based on barrel length. The S&B cartridges were used for the same reason as they actually list the test barrel lengths used to determine their listed MV. For purposes of the spreadsheet, I used the 25fps/inch of barrel rule of thumb I was taught years ago. Last edited by Desert Mariner; 07162019 at 12:02 PM. 
#11




very interesting thank you I understood everything

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