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  #1  
Old 03-17-2023, 02:45 PM
castlebravo92 castlebravo92 is offline
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Default So what happens with bases like Fort Hood?

Most/all of it's units would have been sent overseas and eventually most resident equipment as well to replace combat losses, but presumably Fort Hood would have retained base staff and been used to train replacement units. It would have been too big of an asset to abandon between 1996 and 1998, so there would have been some resident units (MPs, logistics, whatever), right?
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Old 03-17-2023, 03:50 PM
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By the spring of 97 Hood would have been cleared out of active duty field units, less some rear detachments, and recalled reserve and guard units would be cycling through on their way to the front. Lots of space there, BTW, with III Corps HQ, two two-brigade divisions (1st Cav and 2d Armored) and 6 ACCB all stationed there and the entire North Fort area reserved for the 49th AD. There would still be a small rennmant garrison staff (post commander, MP detachment and so on, but most support jobs would be done by civilian employees).

So what did the Army plan to do at that point? One of the 10 Army Reserve Training Divisions (not sure which one) would set up basic and advanced individual training at Hood, Bragg, Drum and other bases that hosted divisions in peacetime, making use of the otherwise empty barracks and ranges. Ft. Hood was the largest base in the Army in terms of area (Bragg had the most troops), so probably training mechanized and armor troops.

Another thing to keep in mind is housing POWs, and once refugees (domestic and Mexican) become an issue there's a possibility that they will be housed on base.

Finally, the Army Airfield at West Ft Hood is a former SAC base and the hill overlooking the runway is riddled with former nuclear weapon storage caves. Bet a few dollars that SAC was back in 1997 with dispersed bombers, maybe B-1s from Dyess up the road.

Just my thoughts!!!!
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Old 03-17-2023, 08:44 PM
Louied Louied is offline
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Chico,

Give me a few. I have what units would go to Hood after Reforger. Let me find it.
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Old 03-17-2023, 09:21 PM
Homer Homer is offline
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The secret alien caves of west fort hood!

Per the USACE preservation study-
Robert Gray AFB/AAF and the Q Area (Killeen Base) was a 50s-60s era AEC/Sandra Corp. national stockpile and maintenance site with 123 storage igloos, 2 weapons assembly plants and a thermonuclear weapon maintenance site. The Army provided site security and special weapons movement while the USAF provided a secure airfield and air transportation. KGRK had no assigned A/C and no hangarage; but it did have over 300k GAL of underground fuel storage, full ATC and GCA, and a 10k ft heavyweight runway with hammerheads and a small ramp space . It’s expanded and still in use today accommodating fully loaded USAF C-5s, CRAF 747s, and the occasional tanker.

So, pretty easy to use it as a dispersal for B-1s, B-52s, or tankers. Although probably B-1s because they were built with “bare base” operations in mind. The only sticky piece will be escape in the event of an alert scramble. A southern departure requires a fairly quick turn during climbout to avoid Bergstrom AFB (another likely dispersal assuming it wasn’t BRACd). A northern departure requires aircraft to thread the needle between Carswell and Dyess, as well as any pattern designed to catch escapees. Of course, SAC/ACC won’t know the exchange plays out the way it does in cannon!

Another option is that the Q area is temporarily reactivated post attack as a recovery and staging area for orphan munitions dispersed from bases which were struck. Once transported to Hood they will be expeditiously moved by air to follow on storage areas. That can set up an emergency evac or emergency disablement situation when the Mexican army comes north.

Last edited by Homer; 03-17-2023 at 10:28 PM.
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Old 03-17-2023, 09:50 PM
Louied Louied is offline
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Post-Mobilization to Ft. Hood

90th ARCOM (USAR)
4013th USARG (USAR)
84th Trng Div (USAR)
-1st, 2nd, & 4th Bdes Armor OSUT
- 3rd Bde expand the ATC at Ft. Hood for Field Artillery MOS

49th ARD (TX ARNG)
36 Bde 50th ARD (TX ARNG)

Plus an answer to a question I asked a retired Ord Staff Officer (late 1980's)
"the 'plan' was for the Divisions heading out under REFORGER to leave behind a lot of their equipment, and existing NG Divisions would either fall in on the equipment (Fort Hood and the 49th Armored Division TX ARNG) or have the equipment distributed to their mob stations so they 'modernized' in the process of getting ready to deploy. Then the NG Divisions would deploy or await instructions as appropriate"
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Old 03-17-2023, 10:45 PM
Homer Homer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Louied View Post
Post-Mobilization to Ft. Hood

90th ARCOM (USAR)
4013th USARG (USAR)
84th Trng Div (USAR)
-1st, 2nd, & 4th Bdes Armor OSUT
- 3rd Bde expand the ATC at Ft. Hood for Field Artillery MOS

49th ARD (TX ARNG)
36 Bde 50th ARD (TX ARNG)
During the pre-ARFORGEN GWOT there were USAR Garrison Support Units (GSU) that came in and took over the intrinsically military portions of running the installation until assigned units returned. Is that what the 4013th is?

Would another possibility be some state guard units coming in to provide support? I’d imagine state guards may expand once conscription kicks in and numbers of people are being found unfit for active service but want to be seen to be “doing their part” or become attracted by the idea that the state guard offers a little more security as things start to slide. Even though they aren’t a federal force, some state guards do utilize facilities on federal installations for training, so it may not be too much of a stretch for them to be utilized for other support roles.
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Old 03-18-2023, 05:49 AM
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I would expect that in any state whose National Guard units were under Title 10 orders, the governor would be very resistant to giving the state guard any assignment that hinted at federal control (such as maintaining federal facilities). Once the NG deploys, the state guard and the state police are the last organized forces the governor has at his disposal.

- C.
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Old 03-18-2023, 07:04 AM
castlebravo92 castlebravo92 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tegyrius View Post
I would expect that in any state whose National Guard units were under Title 10 orders, the governor would be very resistant to giving the state guard any assignment that hinted at federal control (such as maintaining federal facilities). Once the NG deploys, the state guard and the state police are the last organized forces the governor has at his disposal.

- C.
But once Federal control / authority collapsed and garrisons walked off, then governors or whoever the remaining state powers that be would have strong motivation to seize / occupy Federal facilities.

I'm not sure about other state guards, but I'm pretty sure that the Texas State Guard is completely unarmed (aside from privately owned weapons). Transitioning from an unarmed support organization to an armed militia would be a challenge, which again might motivate those units to occupy or raid NG and Federal facilities to arm themselves.
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Old 03-18-2023, 09:58 AM
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Oh, yeah. Once there's no functioning federal authority, it's open season on federal assets within the state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Howling Wilderness (p. 9)
On 8 December 1998, Governor Patrick Hickman of Utah (granted emergency powers by the state legislature) defederalized the Utah National Guard and took over all federal facilities in that state. The extreme state of the national and world situation, he announced, had forced him to take such desperate measures: Congress was gone, and all communication with the federal government had ceased. Utah was the first of several states to take such action.
- C.
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Old 03-18-2023, 12:39 PM
Homer Homer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by castlebravo92 View Post
I'm not sure about other state guards, but I'm pretty sure that the Texas State Guard is completely unarmed (aside from privately owned weapons). Transitioning from an unarmed support organization to an armed militia would be a challenge, which again might motivate those units to occupy or raid NG and Federal facilities to arm themselves.
The TXSG states that they are a part of the Texas Military Department. There are no weapons qual requirements in their Basic Training and do not appear to be an armed force. However, they participate in and have won TMD service rifle and pistol competitions using m16/m9 weapons.

There is currently additional training and a reg for “Security Support Units” which includes weapons qual, being an accredited peace officer, and use of force requirements. SSUs have as part of their mission set protection of TXMD facilities and armories, critical infrastructure, security of disaster and relief areas, and other security duties as assigned by governor or competent authority (including non title 10 members of the TXNG). It looks like the weapons are limited to TMD approved weapons, with mention of provision in one section. They are not a military police unit and it looks like it’s a very small party of the force.

According to their history, prior to the early 90s, the TXSG was organized into MP units with an internal security and disaster assistance role. This started to evolve by adding medical and communications support before shifting to an emergency management/disaster relief role in the 2000s.
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Old 03-18-2023, 01:24 PM
Ckosacranoid Ckosacranoid is offline
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The thing to ask would it still be useable at all and not be the host of a few nukes tossed at it to stop it from being used by the Russians at all? Or would it still be glowing in the dark is what I would have to ask?
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