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Old 01-13-2015, 01:31 PM
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Question Pintle Mounted Weapons

I worry that I might be over-crunching the rules here, but my players and I were wondering if pintle mounts are universal (within reason) or exclusively designed for one make/model of weapon.

For these examples, I'm assuming different weapons belonging to the same class (i.e. general purpose machineguns). Could a PKM be mounted on the same pintle used my an M60? Could an M60 be mounted on a pintle used by a FN MAG? Etcetera. It seems like this should be possible, but I'm not sure. If modification is needed, how difficult would said mods be (i.e. required tools, skills, etc.)?

I'm assuming that weapons of different classes probably can't share pintle mounts (e.g. an M60 and a Mk.19 or M2HB). Is this correct?

Thanks.
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Old 01-13-2015, 04:16 PM
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The biggest issue to me is that the guns can't feed from the same side.
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Old 01-13-2015, 11:18 PM
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An M-60 can use an M-2HB mount, but not vice versa. The M-240 can use both, or a light tripod designed for it. The Mk 19 or Striker can use an M-2HB's tripod, or the Striker can use a special light tripod designed for it. The M-249 SAW (or Minimi) can use an M-60/M-240/MAG/MG-3 mount; it's just not done often. In general, Russian and Chinese weapons cannot use NATO mounts or vice versa.

I have no knowledge of how all this works with CROWS/RWS-type mounts.
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Old 01-13-2015, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copeab View Post
The biggest issue to me is that the guns can't feed from the same side.
?
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Old 01-14-2015, 04:49 PM
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Thanks, Paul. That info was helpful.

I think maybe Copeab is refering the right-sided feed of the PKM, vis-a-vis left-sided NATO GPMGs, but that's just a guess on my part.

Any idea how difficult it would be to covert a ring mount to accept a non-compatible weapon system. For example, let's say the PCs have pintle mounts for M60s or M240s but the weapons themselves are damaged beyond repair or out of ammo. The PCs acquire an MG3 and a PKM. What would it take to modify or jury rig a functioning pintle mount.
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Old 01-14-2015, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raellus View Post
Thanks, Paul. That info was helpful.

I think maybe Copeab is refering the right-sided feed of the PKM, vis-a-vis left-sided NATO GPMGs, but that's just a guess on my part.

Any idea how difficult it would be to covert a ring mount to accept a non-compatible weapon system. For example, let's say the PCs have pintle mounts for M60s or M240s but the weapons themselves are damaged beyond repair or out of ammo. The PCs acquire an MG3 and a PKM. What would it take to modify or jury rig a functioning pintle mount.
probably an easy:mechanic roll would do it. The guns themselves have attachment points built into them. Then you attach an adapter to that, which then gets slipped into the pintle mount itself. Its that adapter you'd have to fabricate, but you could probably jimmy one up with some rebar and a welder pretty easily.

here is a good pic of a custom made one for an M240 that will give you an idea.

http://s220.photobucket.com/user/bla...radle.jpg.html

I know nothing about the different pintle mounts themselves - I'd imagine, and if my ancient memory serves me right, that there are mounts for light guns (m240, m60), and heavy guns (M2, Mk19 etc)., but I honestly can't remember for the life of me.
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Old 01-14-2015, 06:45 PM
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Short answer: pintle mounts are not universal (even within an organization like NATO, for example the Lafette cradle for the MG42/MG1/MG3 series is not suitable for any other machinegun except maybe the Swiss MG51 - which is based on the MG42 so no surprise there - and even then, MG42 Lafettes need to be modified somewhat to accept MG3's).

Long answer:
As far as I know, Soviet weapons will not fit onto Western pintle cradles but adaptors could be made to fit a Soviet cradle onto a Western pintle mount and the reverse is also true (Western weapons will not fit into Soviet cradles but you could make a cradle to fit Soviet mounts). Generally, the various weapons have different attachment points for mounting them to a cradle and that often requires a mounting system unique to the weapon.

Some systems are adaptable, either by modifying the cradle or the weapon somewhat. For example, the Australian Army used the British tripod for the L7 MG (I think the tripod is the L13 or the L7?) for mounting the M60 MG by slightly modifying one or the other (I can't recall the specifics).

For some clarity,
When I say cradle, it refers to the device that holds the weapon to the mount.
When I say mount, it refers to the section that attaches to the cradle and holds it on to the tripod or pintle.
The cradle can typically be removed from a tripod for storage and ease of travel but the mount can also be removed from some tripods. In some cases, the cradle attaches directly to the tripod or pintle and does not require a specific mounting piece.

I've read some anecdotal stories of .55 Boys Rifles being mounted on tripods for the Vickers Gun by some enterprising troops so I pretty much agree with CavTroop, I think it would be fairly easy for any mechanically minded person to fabricate a cradle that would suit a particular mount.

To go further with what Raellus said about Copeab's comment, yes the PK series, the AEK-999 and the PKP Pecheneg MGs all load from the right-hand side which would make it a bit more difficult to adapt a cradle designed for a left-side loading weapon to accept the Soviet weapon - probably easier to fabricate a cradle to allow it.
There are some Western cradles that are designed for specific MGs to allow loading from the right-hand side but these are rare and are typically used for vehicles mounting twin MGs (e.g. the British SASR sometimes use twin mounted L7 MGs on there vehicles, with left-hand and right-hand loading L7's)
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Old 01-14-2015, 08:21 PM
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Old 01-14-2015, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raellus View Post

I think maybe Copeab is refering the right-sided feed of the PKM, vis-a-vis left-sided NATO GPMGs, but that's just a guess on my part.
If the guns are side by side, they can't both feed from the left or feed from the right. I think a few M Gs can be switched bewteen left and right handed feed, some can be fired upside down and others are built in left or right side feed versions.
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