Aircraft In 2000

[Raellus]

Originally Posted by raketenjagdpanzer

Well, once wrested from the Mexican/Cuban forces, Davis Monthan AFB is going to be a treasure trove for a rebuilt USAF - acres of A1 Skyraiders and other prop a/c, for example, to cobble together working ships out of. Of course matters like fuel are a different issue altogether.

That's a big maybe, IMHO. Those planes would need a lot of maintainance to become airworthy again. It's not like dusting off the Red Barchetta in the garage and firing it up for a Sunday drive. Parts may or may not be an issue (seems like a perfect scenario for cannibalization but I'm pretty sure that most electrical components are removed from the airframe before storage) but finding skilled aircraft mechanics probably would be. It also assumes that the Mexican military hasn't done anything with the aircraft either. They could have tried to resurrect some of them and/or they could have trashed them.

[raketenjagdpanzer]

Originally Posted by Raellus

That's a big maybe, IMHO. Those planes would need a lot of maintainance to become airworthy again. It's not like dusting off the Red Barchetta in the garage and firing it up for a Sunday drive. Parts may or may not be an issue (seems like a perfect scenario for cannibalization but I'm pretty sure that most electrical components are removed from the airframe before storage) but finding skilled aircraft mechanics probably would be. It also assumes that the Mexican military hasn't done anything with the aircraft either. They could have tried to resurrect some of them and/or they could have trashed them.

Assuming they didn't trash them, if they get any more than a few flying they'd crush the already crippled US forces once and for all. Total air supremacy courtesy of a couple of flights of Skyraiders or AC47s pretty much dooms the US.

[Webstral]

Originally Posted by raketenjagdpanzer

Total air supremacy courtesy of a couple of flights of Skyraiders or AC47s pretty much dooms the US.

That's a bit extreme, although no doubt C.L. Chennault would agree with you wholeheartedly. Assuming that "a couple of flights" adds up to four or so aircraft, each of which generates a sortie a day over the long haul (this is Twilight: 2000), then this amounts to four opportunities to attack US troops with one aircraft once per day. This does not amount to a Mexican ability to overrun and occupy the continental United States or anything remotely like it. A handful of CAS aircraft certainly would be powerful force multipliers for the Mexicans. However, I don't think even a zealous zoomie would say that a small package of even the legendary A-1 would completely upset the balance of power across 1500+ miles of what passes for front from 1998-2001.

[headquarters]

Originally Posted by Webstral

That's a bit extreme, although no doubt C.L. Chennault would agree with you wholeheartedly. Assuming that "a couple of flights" adds up to four or so aircraft, each of which generates a sortie a day over the long haul (this is Twilight: 2000), then this amounts to four opportunities to attack US troops with one aircraft once per day. This does not amount to a Mexican ability to overrun and occupy the continental United States or anything remotely like it. A handful of CAS aircraft certainly would be powerful force multipliers for the Mexicans. However, I don't think even a zealous zoomie would say that a small package of even the legendary A-1 would completely upset the balance of power across 1500+ miles of what passes for front from 1998-2001.

There certainly wouldnt be any significant results in the short run - no blitz tactic could be employes due to only 4-5 CAS prop a/c. But in the longer run, being able to strike with semi impunity the war would turn against the US loyalists still holding out. ( In this specific scenario - bear in mind - forces are mostly scattered about with few concentrated forces). Taking out smaller posts /units one at the time will as the seasons pass lead to posts being evacuated as attack draws nigh. Standing your ground is not an option to most when it will lead to a no-gains sacrifice.

all in my humble opinion. As for airwar - making AA weapons has always been the traditional countertactic against air superiority. Any thoughts on make shift AA weapons ? Could a missile be made in a garage that homes in on its target ? The Germans did it in 1945 and they had to develop it from scratch.

http://www.luft46.com/missile/x-4.html

Given access to modern plans - and electronics - could you make SAMs in T2K ? I think it is as plausible as refurbishing WWII planes and attacking the enemy. Using a jet that burns a ton of fuel were a prop plane that use 100 liters doesnt make sense imho. Air superiority isnt measured by the cold war standards in T2K is my 2 cents- more like WWI.

[raketenjagdpanzer]

Originally Posted by headquarters

Given access to modern plans - and electronics - could you make SAMs in T2K ? I think it is as plausible as refurbishing WWII planes and attacking the enemy. Using a jet that burns a ton of fuel were a prop plane that use 100 liters doesnt make sense imho. Air superiority isnt measured by the cold war standards in T2K is my 2 cents- more like WWI.

Well, the upshot is that in the event that someone brings a small number of a/c to the CONUS to use as local air supremacy they're going to find themselves up against a fusillade of AA fire once they become a known threat. I have been told that equipping the AH64 for AIM-9 use is a "simple" field modification. In that spirit I could see ad-hoc SAM vehicles being cobbled together using Sidewinders and 2.5 ton trucks and improvised launch rails. Nothing fancy, mind you, just one guy with a pair of headphones and a firing switch, listening for the "growl" while sitting in the truck cab, with a rack of 'winders pointed downrange towards the FEBA.

Plus stocks of Redeyes, Stingers, etc. that might still be on hand in the US.

Worse (for the enemy a/c) you take a situational (although admittedly non-canon) thing like my "Florida JMC" where they have two working helos and couple that with ad-hoc missile usage and there's a serious threat for enemy a/c. Not in the sense that a Bell Jetranger would be trying to dogfight a Skyraider, mind. I could just see one coordinating with ground forces, hiding behind a building or hills, then when the guys on the ground call for it, popping out, getting a lock, and firing off whatever missiles, then popping back down. Hopefully the enemy's so confident of their own air supremacy and not expecting to get bounced like that they won't see it coming.

[Legbreaker]

Of course in the US there's the School Brigade with their oversupply of dedicated AA vehicles. If the Mexicans had air superiority, I can see Milgov moving heaven and earth to get that unit down there asap.

[Olefin]

FYI one aircraft that you wouldnt think could be available in T2K would be the Grumman Avenger - while there werent that many outside the US there are still even today a significant amount of airworthy Avengers in the US

almost all are TBM-3 and 3E versions but at last count there are at least 33 flyable airworthy planes still in the US and another 25 or so that are either being restored or are on display and could be used to get spare parts

and they are versatile aircraft - you could arm them with bombs or depth charges or just use them for patrol aircraft

you wouldnt want to operate them in areas that still had SAM's or modern aircraft still working - but in other areas they would still be effective