Tank graveyard

[ArmySGT.]

Originally Posted by CDAT

Yes, but if

Oh the “What if” game. This is when “discussion” spirals into the ground.

Originally Posted by CDAT

Yes, but if you can not sneak up on them, or do not know they are there it will be murder on the troops on the ground.

Pre dawn darkness and engine idling to charge batteries is an excellent time. Among others.

Originally Posted by CDAT

One experience I know of my brother was in the battalion command tank section (two tanks) they were parked behind the TOC when an infantry company came out of the woods to take the command post, the two when the CP saw the troops coming up the hill they let the tanks know and the two tanks destroyed the company with no losses on there side. Now yes this was in training with MILES gear but if it had been live the results most likely would have been the same.

Actually, No. This is a training scenario…. Everything is forced to produce that force on force contact. Find a CP and call artillery on it. Not a good example of what happens…. Weapons like the M203 and the grenades can’t be simulated in MILES. As for training, better than none! Not a good example for this discussion though.

Originally Posted by CDAT

Infantry can do anything, but with out the right tools they can not do everything. No anti-tank weapons, you are going to have a very hard time taking out a tank, even a WWII one. As for if you get to close for the weapons, if it is a single tank maybe. If there is more than one we can just shoot the troops as it will not do any damage to the tank.

Infantry trains to get it done without ATGMs being available. It is one of these “Nuclear Battlefield” training points. EMP could destroy the gunners sights of the Dragon and TOW. Fire, satchel charges, pole charges, command detonated mortar rounds, AT mines rigged to command detonate, using detonation cord and mortar rounds to drop trees or walls on tanks. With more preparation and engineer support then you get AT traps like pits and trenches.

ATGMs are like a crescent wrench in an overflowing tool box.

Originally Posted by CDAT

Also some tricks that some used, fire your smoke grenades they are WP. WP will not hurt the tank but does the infantry. Some tankers have put Claymores around the tank with the controls ran to the driver so if you get close just fire it off, and say good night to the troops. Again it does not real damage to the tank (messes up the paint and that is about it).

This scenario is discussion the relics in the Littlefield and other collectors……… These don’t typically have smoke dischargers. By T2K smoke grenades for those are probably as scarce as anything else.

Now those are valid defenses…… But they are also one shots….. You are not going to get many properly using the terrain.

Originally Posted by CDAT

You do know that not all tanks have to expose them self to use some/all of there machine-guns. For example both the M1 and the M60 can fire there Commanders MG from inside with out exposing them self at all. Some other thoughts when I was in basic (early 90's) they were still using some M60 and so we took some classes where they talked about them. The M1 was the worlds deadliest tank (you can argue other nations equivalents), and the M60 was considered the worlds best defensive tank, it did not have the mobility the M1 had, but had a better thermal sight, more ammo and from prepared positions would have torn up any tank in the world at the time.

Of those in the discussion this applies to the M48 and the M60 so I agree with you. However, only the M60A3 TTS has a thermal sight for the gunner. The periscopes do not. Blind those periscopes and this doesn’t matter.

Originally Posted by CDAT

Artillery yes, mortar I do not think so. One of my drill sergeants talked about how his tank in Desert Storm drove through an anti-personnel mine field, they were part way in before they noticed it, after they got out looked for damage. All that it did was take some rubber off the tracks. Tanks are very tough (not invulnerable but very tough). As for the smoke, if it is not thermal smoke do not expect it to give you any cover, we can see through smoke.

Those in discussion do not have thermal sights, possibly passive / active infrared though.

AP mines sure. They have a charge measured in ounces. Not going to affect a tank tread by itself.

I did the hole deeper, cluster there 81mm HE rounds, remove the fuzes, pack the wells with C4, add a blasting cap just to be redundant, then cap it with the AP mine and weather proof….. I have a mobility kill. Then I wait to engage the recovery team from long range with MG fire and mortars. I want to kill those mechanics and their M88 as badly or more than one line tank.

I separate the tanks from infantry, I separate the tanks from mutual support, then destroy them in detail, usually when and where I can get them to dismount.

Originally Posted by CDAT

As already covered WP does not really affect the tanks, C4 you are going to have to spend some time placing it if you want it to do more than just mess up the paint. Good luck with that if you have a half way competent tank section.

Spread out around the tank, sure. Detonated beneath the hull where the affect is contained another crispy, smoky story. A 8, 10, 15 kilo charge in a satchel under the belly is going to do a lot. Placed against the last road wheel and the belly, the road wheel and torsion bars are coming off. I also have time to make shaped charges or use the cratering charges used to destroy roads, bridges, and bunkers. All depends on what can be carried or what it tanks to lure the tank right up onto it.