Operation Omega and MILGOV

[Targan]

Originally Posted by Cdnwolf

FYI What a 1M nuke bomb will do to Norfolk and the port facilities.

I'm happy to be corrected but from memory wasn't Norfolk only targeted with one nuclear warhead, and that malfunctioned/mis-targeted and detonated in the water somewhere out in Chesapeake Bay? I'm pretty sure that the port facilities in and around Norfolk were damaged by the resulting tsunami, not by nuclear blast.

[kalos72]

I know Mayport had a 'near miss" but I haven't ready anything bout Norfolk being in the same boat. I could be wrong though...

[Legbreaker]

50,000 people on just 10 ships means a LOT of very close "friendships" developing! Even if you could find 10 ships each capable of holding an average of 5,000 people there's not a lot of space left for the necessities of life such as food, water, oxygen, etc...

I believe it's also mentioned in Going Home that even though the general perception was there wasn't enough space for everyone, there was plenty of room for all.

The RMS Queen Mary II is unable to carry enough fresh water to cater for it's passengers and crews needs for the relatively short hop across the Atlantic today. It is equipped with several desalination plants to make the crossing possible without everyone dying of thirst halfway.

So, it's not just space for people and their possessions which needs to be taken into acount, but their needs to remain alive along the way and, hopefully, for a period after debarkation.

[kalos72]

Either way...

A large Naval port to support a Navy with no fuel might not be such a concern. While feeding that Navy is more pressing at this stage.

[Legbreaker]

While there might not be much fuel, there should be enough to keep one of the more important vessels going for a while. It's doubtful they'd go very far, but would be a useful reserve force "just in case".

[sglancy12]

Originally Posted by Targan

I'm happy to be corrected but from memory wasn't Norfolk only targeted with one nuclear warhead, and that malfunctioned/mis-targeted and detonated in the water somewhere out in Chesapeake Bay? I'm pretty sure that the port facilities in and around Norfolk were damaged by the resulting tsunami, not by nuclear blast.

Kalos72 is right. That's the Jacksonville near miss you're thinking about.

Originally Posted by Cdnwolf

Why Norfolk? I mean it was hit by a few nukes and the port a melted pile of sludge? I would think a more minor port advantageous to the Milgov...

Well if we can have a whole scenario set in L'vov after it got plastered by a MIRV (Bear's Den) then Norfolk can be used as a Milgov enclave.

Cheyenne Mountain took a 3Mt groundburst and survived in operational condition. That's within the facilities anticipated tolerances though. The part we should be griping about is that the fallout didn't irradiate Colorado Springs enough to make it uninhabitable for the next few decades, and therefore impossible to function as the HQ of Milgov. We never complain about that... but maybe we should.

I mean, Omaha as CivGov HQ after Offut AFB takes a hit? Maybe in my homebrew I'll move Milgov HQ to Denver and CivGov HQ to Lincoln NB or maybe Minneapolis-St. Paul MN.

Originally Posted by Cdnwolf

Also there is no mention of the troops going to the Middle East or anywhere else... and once more the issue of fuel supplies rears its ugly head when the only fuel available is from a drifting tanker....

The first mention of troops deploying from Operation Omega to the middle east is in the timeline for The RDF Sourcebook. Kalos72 mentions Howling Wilderness but I don't remember that reference and I'm away from my books at the moment.

Originally Posted by Kalos72

Where that asset (the surviving ships) is parked, doesn't matter at all.

Actually it matters a whole lot. The surviving fleet units must be anchored somewhere defensible so they don't fall into the wrong hands. They have to be anchored somewhere sheltered from storms and other natural hazards. They can't be left without crews in international waters or the French are just going to sail up, drop a prize crew aboard and rename it La Bonaparte and they'd be within their rights to do so. Perhaps Norfolk, as bad as it is, is literally the only port on the east coast that is

a) under Milgov control

b) large enough to handle the number of surviving ships.

c) is appropriately sheltered from the elements

d) has enough surviving facilities to even get one small dry dock working.

Remember, the bombs hit in November of 97. By Summer of 2000 there has been plenty of time for Milgov to spend resources getting some parts of the yard back in business.

Originally Posted by Kalos72

We are talking about how important a demolished Norfolk Naval Yard would be to the Enclave compared to moving to an area where they can feed themselves.

Once the men are ashore, they can use their LPCs to relocate to other enclaves, like the Ft. Dix enclave. Or if discharged by MilGov they could hoof it to the CivGov enclave in Maryland and sign up there too. Or just be discharged and start legging it for home to see if any of their friends or family made it. They don't have to sit there and starve.

The surviving fleet units don't have that luxury.


A. Scott Glancy, President TCCorp, dba Pagan Publishing

[kalos72]

I guess it depends on what fleet you think is left. I DONT want to go over that again as it tends to get messy.

But for me, if even some of the returning troops stay on the Norfolk enclave makes alot of sense depending in the totals.

The more we talk about this, the more I like the idea that some people got discharged. Makes it a bit easier to swallow then seeing 50k troops back in the US when they cant feed themsevles.

Would MILGOV give them weapons or confiscate them ya think?

[pmulcahy11b]

This whole discussion makes me think of what would happen when 50,000 hungry and armed troops show up in a place where food is scarce. You know what will happen? A riot by those who already live there! Followed by a massacre at the hands of all those armed troops returning!

[Cdnwolf]

Originally Posted by pmulcahy11b

This whole discussion makes me think of what would happen when 50,000 hungry and armed troops show up in a place where food is scarce. You know what will happen? A riot by those who already live there! Followed by a massacre at the hands of all those armed troops returning!

General Po's idea of heaven you mean!!

[WallShadow]

Actually, I know where it is, but what has happened to it re: the Twilight War? It has lots of supplies, fuel, an airstrip capable of handling b-52s, and several B-2 bombers stationed there (at least in realtime today). What's damaged, what's left, and how do we get there to loot it?

[Legbreaker]

Originally Posted by WallShadow

Actually, I know where it is, but what has happened to it re: the Twilight War? It has lots of supplies, fuel, an airstrip capable of handling b-52s, and several B-2 bombers stationed there (at least in realtime today). What's damaged, what's left, and how do we get there to loot it?

I think you probably mean "had" all that stuff.
Several years into the war the vast majority of stores all over the world would have been depleted. With the Nukes wiping out virtually all significant production and transportation, those stores are extremely unlikely to be replenished.

So, the airstrip might still be useable, but what's the point when there's hardly any aircraft flying about wasting valuable fuel?

However, my guess is that it would have attracted a nuke. Situated where it is, and housing one of the five GPS monitoring stations not to mention being a rather important naval base, etc, it would almost be considered criminal to think the Soviets would leave it intact.

[Targan]

Originally Posted by Cdnwolf

General Po's idea of heaven you mean!!

Do you mean Major Po or General Pain? Or some sort of horrific combination of the two?

[Cdnwolf]

Originally Posted by Targan

Do you mean Major Po or General Pain? Or some sort of horrific combination of the two?

I thought he automatically got promoted at death!!

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by Targan

Do you mean Major Po or General Pain? Or some sort of horrific combination of the two?

Major General Popain? "Excuse me sir, do you have any Grey Popain?"

I'm sorry about that last line, I couldn't resist...