AKM or AK-74

[ChalkLine]

Another weapon the USSR had stopped using was the DShK and DShKM, both phased out in the seventies.
They brought in the NSU and then the Kord after the fall as the NSU was and is made primarily in Ukraine. So by the twilight war the DShKM was gone from front line units for near on thirty years.

Of course, they built literally millions of them. And. being the USSR, they never threw even one away. They either gave them away or stuck them in dispersed storage in case they needed to do another Great Patriotic War total mobilisation.

Sorry for thread drift, but this storage has never been really addressed. The Russians built enough tanks to totally replace the whole tank inventory of the west every year, with the elderly going into dispersed storage. This was where the old AK-47s went as well, as well as the DPMs and DPShs and all the other goodies. There was and is tens of thousands of unused SKS carbines there, just in case. The storage, as its name suggests, was built in simple earth berm bunkers or caches small enough to be a pain in the arse to strike with strategic weapons, and scattered to survive nuclear strikes. Nothing underlies the Russian claims that their militarism was defensive so much as these caches, as it's useless for an aggressive war.

[Raellus]

For what it's worth, I tend to have 1st line Soviet and Polish units armed with the AK-74 and Tantal (a well made clone) respectively.

Second and third line units are equipped with the AKM. PACT marauder units tend to carry a mix of both.

As a side note, NoCarrier recently pointed out that the Brits were having lots of trouble with the L85 and that no systematic attempt was made to mod/upgrade their stocks until '97, too late for the original T2K timeline. So, in all likelihood, most UK units in '00 would likely be equiped with the "old" 7.62mm L1A1 SLR and Sterling SMGs and/or possibly M-16s and AR-18s (the firing mechanism upon which the L85 was based).

[Brother in Arms]

British Front line troops would probably reluctantly be using L85A1 because they had been issued for years before being revamped in 1997. I would hope for there sake there would be a lot of the old L1A1's in the hands of troops as it is a much better alternative to the L85A1. I'm sure sterlings would still be kicking around as well. The SAS used the M16 extensively especially in the old CAR-15 incarnation. GB also uses the H&K MP5 and G3A3 for special forces.

[ChalkLine]

This assumes the sedate pace of peacetime. It's pretty easy to dither about the vagaries of kit when you're doing peace-keeping, something different when you're trying to reach the USSR border before the Russians can turn around and stomp you.

I'd see the L85A2 arriving in the first year of the war, as well as the G36. The Germans may well deploy the MG4 LMG the year after. The USA would probably get a lot of its newer electronics out faster as well.

Don't forget that the world knew it was sliding towards war, and re-armament was taking place. Keeping RL time lines of issue is in my view unrealistic.

[chico20854]

Originally Posted by ChalkLine

Sorry for thread drift, but this storage has never been really addressed. The Russians built enough tanks to totally replace the whole tank inventory of the west every year, with the elderly going into dispersed storage. This was where the old AK-47s went as well, as well as the DPMs and DPShs and all the other goodies. There was and is tens of thousands of unused SKS carbines there, just in case. The storage, as its name suggests, was built in simple earth berm bunkers or caches small enough to be a pain in the arse to strike with strategic weapons, and scattered to survive nuclear strikes. Nothing underlies the Russian claims that their militarism was defensive so much as these caches, as it's useless for an aggressive war.

Great point, Chalkline!

To reiterate, the USSR had an unbelievable amount of old weapons stored away. The numbers are hard to pin down on tanks, but a few tidbits: in 1990 for the 45th Anniversary of VE Day the parade featured an entire T-34/85 regiment running through Red Square. For Jason's Soviet Army Guide we're looking at about 62,000 tanks assigned to Soviet units (including 19 Mobilization Only tank divisions) and another 10,500 in war reserve. On the small arms side, here in the US there has been a pretty much non-stop flood of old weapons from Russia into the civilian market since 1992 or so. Mosin Nagants have never stopped coming, the flow of SKSs was heavy but has now stopped, the Tokarev SVT-40s, captured Gewehr41s and 43s likewise came and went and Russian-captured Mausers are still coming in. Makarov, Mosin revolvers and Tokarevs are all coming in too. The PPsH and early model AKs never arrived on the US civilian market due to their full-auto features, but the number (and excellent condition) of WWII-era weaponry is truly staggering. In a T2k context I can easily see all Soviet combat troops having AKs of one type or another (with the troops in Category A units in the Western military districts with the most modern and Mobilization-only troops in the Urals with the oldest), with support troops (truck drivers, depot guards, etc.) and militia in areas near the Soviet borders armed with SKSs, militia inside the USSR with WWII-era weapons like the SVT, Mosin and Mauser.

On the NATO side, keep in mind that the Norwegians used the MG-34 in 8mm through the 1980s, and that the Danish, Greek and Turkish army reserves were issued M-1 Garands in the 1980s. And NATO's newest members in the v1 timeline, Romania and Jugoslavia, also were small arms hoarders on a scale comparable to the USSR. (And as far as old equipment goes, Jugoslav coastal artillery in the late 1980s had some 100-year old guns in service!).

[pmulcahy11b]

In addition to the sorts of things that have been mentioned, I have some weird things operational due to accelerated pre-war development. Some include the F/A-22 (though still called the F-22 in the T2K timeline), the Small-Diameter Bomb, Aurora aircraft, and even a few new fighters based on the X-29 and X-31 programs that in real life never resulted in actual production aircraft. And my personal favorite, the F-16F Scamp.