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#1
08-23-2011, 03:25 AM
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__________________
Author of the unofficial and strictly non canon Alternative Survivor’s Guide to the United Kingdom 
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#2
08-23-2011, 04:08 AM
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Thus the NATO forces remained at full strength and developed force increases instead of decreases. Hong Kong never was turned over to the PRC, the Treaty of Nanking that gave Hong Kong in perpetuity and the discovery of a wartime treaty between the UK and both sides of the Chinese Civil War that not only reinforced this, but gave the UK some more territory around Hong Kong (and opened up the possiblities of other concession areas throughout China that would have been brokered by the British with what ever government would be ruling China). Now that i know that Territorial Army units are Light Infantry and Motorized Infantry units... I can understand better what's happening. reestablishiment of disbanded (or just the creation of new) mechanized infantry, armoured and cavalry units might be a big thing during the expansion of the British Armed Forces.
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#3
08-23-2011, 04:16 AM
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The Rifle's TA are light and motorised because that is the Rifle's main battle role. Every Regiment's TA unit is roughly the same as their parent Regiment. Artillery TA are trained gunners, Cavalry TA are trained tankers etc.
__________________
Better to reign in hell, than to serve in heaven.
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#4
08-23-2011, 04:24 AM
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when a TA unit is activated into a RA unit, they'd be deployed overseas, but how long would it take for them to be deployed? Would additional units that were being established/mobilized be classed as TA or just a new RA unit as it transititions during training?
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#5
08-23-2011, 05:16 AM
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Question - when did you plan to implement conscription? Before the War starts (and if so, how many years) or after it has started?
__________________
Author of the unofficial and strictly non canon Alternative Survivor’s Guide to the United Kingdom
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#6
08-23-2011, 05:26 AM
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the nuclear exchanges in Europe and North America isn't for a year and half after that.
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#7
08-23-2011, 05:57 AM
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Highest rank in all three Armed services is O-11;
RAF- Marshal of the RAF RN- Admiral of the Fleet Army- Field Marshal Even at Second World War manning levels, these proved sufficient to cover all the required posts. At current levels, these ranks are not necessary- promotion to O-11 tends to be a reward for long service as an alternative to retirement. The current Chief of Defence Staff is a General; his juniors as Chief of the General Staff, Chief of the Air Staff and First Sea Lord are all also O-10s. Congratulations at finding all those variants on the rank of Private; there were some in there even I'd forgotten! (along with others I only recognise from Afghanistan casualty lists). I would concur with the other posters about khaki uniforms- DPM for Home Guard is more likely, along with '58 pattern webbing seems more likely.
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#8
08-23-2011, 06:34 AM
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I have to say that in my opinion without conscription any expansion of the British Army at the end of the 80's / start of the 90's is going to be relatively modest...the military were struggling to keep the units that they had at full strength without raising any new ones. There are various proposed orders of battle for a T2K British military (including one of mine!  ) most of which add in a couple of Infantry Battalions - extra Gurkha Battalions are also a popular option on the basis that 1) the Gurkhas always have more applicants than they have places for and 2) it would be a less expensive option for the British Government. Likely candidiates for "resurrection" (again I'm going from memory) were the 4th Battalion, Royal Anglian Regiment (which existed until around 1975), 4th Battalion, Queen's Regiment, and 4th Battalion, Royal Regiment of Fusiliers (as others have already stated I think it's much more likely for existing Regiments to get additional Battalions rather than new formations being raised - tradition and all that...) Another option would be to add one (or more) TA Armoured Regiments with MBT's, probably Chieftains that would otherwise have been placed in storage (IRL there were five TA Armoured Regiments at the end of the Cold War, none of which were equipped with heavy armour - two were earmarked for the BAOR (2nd Infantry Division) and were equipped primarily with the Fox armoured car and three of which were earmarked for Home Defence and (iirc) equipped primarily with Land Rovers. During the Cold War the BAOR's strength was four Divisions - 1st, 3rd, and 4th Armoured, all of which were Regular Army Divisions consisting of approximately six - seven armoured Regiments (one Recce and the others MBT) and six infantry Battalions equipped with the Warrior. Additional TA Battalions would be added in time of War (most TA Bns would go to the 4th Dvn, which (I think) was the reserve Division. The other Division was the 2nd Infantry which consisted of one regular Infantry Brigade (24th) in an Airmobile role and two TA Infantry Brigades. Now, that said, taking on board the fact that this is an alternate setting you could possibly look at adding another Division to the regular order of battle, possibly to serve as some sort of strategic reserve with a mix of armour, airborne, and light / mech Infantry...kind of likethe old Field Forces that existed before the BAOR was restructured at the start of the 80's. You could then form another Division (in addition to the Strategic Reserve Division) after the fighting has started (much the way GDW did with their 5th Division) to give you six Divisions in Europe.
__________________
Author of the unofficial and strictly non canon Alternative Survivor’s Guide to the United Kingdom
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#9
08-23-2011, 04:21 AM
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I was picturing the Home Guard having a look of paramilitary (well, armed police) instead of the regular British Army. That's why i was going with the pre-DPM battle dress being issued from the stockpiles along with civilian articles.
I was seeing the Home Guard helping the Police with keeping the peace... especially dealing with anti-war riots that would be breaking out after the implimentation of the Draft on a very wide scale that included women. But the legislation would give women the ability to join the Home Guard to escape the draft (with preference to single mothers for such actions). Also Consiencious Objectors wouldn't be getting out of serving in some kind of uniformed capacity... be it in the Home Guard or as a member of a construction battalion who'd be tasked with building, repairing and clearing areas that had been attacked.
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#10
08-23-2011, 06:30 AM
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This helps to create a sense of history in a new regiment. Also regiments previously amalgamated can be expanded and restored to their original colours. An example would be the 9th/12th Lancers (one of our recon regiments), they could be expanded and restored as two seperate regiments, the 9th lancers and the 12th lancers. A long term rebuilding project would focus on restoring previously almagamated regiments before building new ones as it's easier to expand a current unit and then split it than it is to build from scratch.
__________________
Better to reign in hell, than to serve in heaven.
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#11
08-23-2011, 06:35 AM
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95th Rifleman...
I have a quesiton... Would the British Army use Commonwealth Nations Units to help flesh out Divisions and Corps? The Reason I ask, is that the Canadian Army and Austrialian Army sent troops to Europe prior to the fighting in the Far East and Near East needed troops to be sent there as well... How would they be used as Brigades (to round out a division) or Divisions (to round out Corps)? Or would they be a seperate command?
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#12
08-23-2011, 06:47 AM
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 ok, we wouldn't get any Canadians or ANZACs, they are independent nations with their own militaries who serve alongside the british. However there are severaly countries who send men (and women) to the UK to serve directly in UK regiments. I live in the town of Bicester which is the garriosn town for the 23rd Pioneer regiment. A large percentage of these lads are Fijian with some carribean, St Lucian and african lads aswell as the usual mix of Brits. I can imagine a stepped up program to recruit for these overseas countries would go alongside an expansion of the Uk forces.
__________________
Better to reign in hell, than to serve in heaven.
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#13
08-23-2011, 06:58 AM
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As i said earilier I was thinking of African Rifles being one of the units like the Brigade of Gurkhas being part of the Commonwealth of Nations personnel recruited for fleshing out the British Armed Forces. Would it be easier for the biggest expansions of the British Army to have come through the Territorial Army units?
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#14
08-23-2011, 07:03 AM
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The TA where established with future, emergency expansion in mind so yeah, they would do the lion's share of wartime expansion, but only in wartime. If your talking about peactime expansion due to the threat of the Russian bear then it would be done the old fashioned way (slowly) as recruitment is stepped up and battalions formed organicly before being split offfrom parent regiments to form their own regiment (like I mentioned with the 9th/12th lancers). The inherent beuty of the regimental system is it is surprisingly easy to expand as it is to cut down, all you need are numbers and time.
__________________
Better to reign in hell, than to serve in heaven.
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#15
08-23-2011, 07:10 AM
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__________________
Author of the unofficial and strictly non canon Alternative Survivor’s Guide to the United Kingdom
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#17
08-23-2011, 02:05 PM
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I seem to remember the subject of troops from Commonwealth countries taking part in the Twilight War under UK command coming up a couple of times before... With the exception of a handful of British overseas territories, none of whom - with all due respect - have significant military forces, Commonwealth countries are Independent States who would decide for themselves whether to go to War or not. The days of Empire, when the Dominions would send their troops to fight - and die - for the mother country are long, long gone. Australia, New Zealand, etc, would be under no obligation to declare War on anyone just because the UK has. ANZAC troops backfilling for British troops to allow the British to be deployed elsewhere is a possibility. During the Falklands War the Royal New Zealand Navy deployed a Frigate to the Caribbean to allow the Royal Navy warship usually stationed there to join the Task Force. Quote:
Also, one has to bear in mind that the Canadian and ANZAC regular militaries are, relatively speaking, not that large. For example, Canada, which had its own commitments as a NATO member, had I think (going from memory) somewhere in the region of twelve Regular Infantry Battalions at the end of the Cold War, while I seem to recall a recent discussion about Australian troops in Korea where it was suggested that the most the Australians would be able to send overseas without compromising their own security would be a Brigade Group?
__________________
Author of the unofficial and strictly non canon Alternative Survivor’s Guide to the United Kingdom Last edited by Rainbow Six; 08-23-2011 at 02:48 PM.
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#18
08-25-2011, 04:51 PM
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(Since were having several british-themed threads right now) http://www.blackwinter.freeservers.com/ (Did not check the archives on this). I liked that novel, and had some alternate stuff about BAOR, a british recongroup, and so on. Did any of you read this, and maybe used it for a game somehow ? I liked the notion of parts of BAOR planning their own "Going Home" from the city of Hamburg in early 2001, and expecting a hostile reception by the british army in southern england, because BAOR didnt retreat early, as ordered before.
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#19
08-25-2011, 04:53 PM
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I loved it. It gave me the inspiration to star myown T2k novella.
__________________
Fuck being a hero. Do you know what you get for being a hero? Nothing! You get shot at. You get a little pat on the back, blah blah blah, attaboy! You get divorced... Your wife can't remember your last name, your kids don't want to talk to you... You get to eat a lot of meals by yourself. Trust me kid, nobody wants to be that guy. I do this because there is nobody else to do it right now. Believe me if there was somebody else to do it, I would let them do it. There's not, so I'm doing it.
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#20
08-25-2011, 04:59 PM
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art along, as well! (Wanna read more good T2k stuff!)
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