Societal Changes in Your New Worlds

[Cdnwolf]

Need a barter system set up and if it is going to work a price list like they had in the TV series Jericho.

What about protein? Everyone should own a few chickens, a goat and a cow. Take a look at Medieval freeholders and use a system like that.

[kalos72]

Barter system is a good idea.

As for the chickens, thats what we thought too. There will not be a store you go to every weekly and buy 3 meals a day for your family. There wont be enough power to supply refrigerators in every home. Or fuel to ship things across country.

We also thought about a prison system/LE policy...

Even procreation, limited or restricted? How do you effectively enforce population limits?

[simonmark6]

Goats are good too if you can get them.

A half dozen pygmy goats are as easy to keep as chickens and you can get about a quarter gallon of milk a day from each of the girls. If you have six and a billy you'd be getting a gallon and a half a day.

I'd split that into different production areas. If you have vinegar, easy with a still you can use half a gallon to make soft cheese, enough for a meal for four people. Then I'd skim the rest so you have a pound of butter a day and a couple of pints of skimmed milk.

Potatoes and skimmed milk can keep you alive if you have to but it's risky.

In addition, each dam will drop one to two kids a year which can be used to increase the herd or to sell on. They're too valuable for meat.

The shit is also good for fertiliser and if they are a long haired variety you can even comb out enough hair for a really nice sweater every few months.

Bigger goats are good too, you can get by with two if you have a billy that can cover them nearby. Each will produce a gallon of milk. More than that will be wasted for the normal family as you can't store the milk unless you're making hard cheese which takes a lot more steps.

Sheep are similar but they're stupid buggers and a lot more work. The wool is nice though.

[kalos72]

Great information guys...thanks.

But what are your thoughts about the way life continues in your worlds?

Do you plan on restoring the power grid, water treatment and sewage treatment plants?

Do you plan on using the 1000 acres big farms to produce food to ship to your major cities to feed the population or will you force people to be self sufficient?

Will you try to support a half million people in skyscrapers in downtown Tuscon or force them to leave and go work the land for themselves?

I think there are some MAJOR changes that would need to be made to society if you plan on surviving. Any other ideas/suggestions?

[mikeo80]

Originally Posted by kalos72

Great information guys...thanks.

But what are your thoughts about the way life continues in your worlds?

Do you plan on restoring the power grid, water treatment and sewage treatment plants?

Do you plan on using the 1000 acres big farms to produce food to ship to your major cities to feed the population or will you force people to be self sufficient?

Will you try to support a half million people in skyscrapers in downtown Tuscon or force them to leave and go work the land for themselves?

I think there are some MAJOR changes that would need to be made to society if you plan on surviving. Any other ideas/suggestions?

IMHO, it really depends on what else is happening in the world at the time of trying to implement the changes you are advocating. Is this post TDM? Post "The Day" of Alas Babylon/Morrow Project? What type of experts do you have available? Farmers? Doctors? Engineers? Military?

Is there rampant disease in or near the development? Is there a library available for information? If nuclear war just happened, what is the status of the EMP, the radiation, the blast areas?

Again, IMHO, water is THE most crucial raw material. Any one that is included in the settlement MUST have water. Water is also needed for any type of agriculture. If this is post TDM/The Day type scenario, population is going to be very limited. Any recovery is probably going to be slow and small at first.

Any type of government that evolves from a nightmare of nuclear warfare is going to have to be VERY responsive to any developments. An outbreak of Typhus, or an armed gang sighted 2 days march away.

The person or persons involved will have to make quick, sometimes UGLY decisions. For example, you might have to decide to close the community NOW from the outside world because of sickness. NO ONE will be allowed in or out. This would have to enforced with DEADLY force. IF your community is surviving, how the hell are you going to KEEP it alive if typhus or cholera or smallpox or WHATEVER is near by.

The issues are difficult at best and draconian to maintain.

My $0.02

Mike

[Slappy]

Couple of thoughts from what happened historically. Not destiny, but observations on pre-industrial societies.

Incarceration, at least long term, was quite rare. Keeping people locked up in a non-productive way is extrememly resource intensive. The accused are generally held until trial and punishment is corporal, capital, fine, or exile. Incarceration is hard labor which is effectively hard labor until death on starvation rations.

Self sufficiency in terms of food is likely not mandatory. Specialist tradesmen (carpenters, smiths, soldiers) will exist. They may have some plots or livestock to suppliment, but division of labor will happen. Barter will happen, but not nearly always directly. Person to person credit is a mainstay of small communities. The tallies are enforced by honor. To be caught cheating and to not pay one's debts leads to being shut out and is a huge cost. Shame and exile in small communities is more effective than any modern credit bureau.

Self sufficiency in terms of arms was almost always enforced. Freemen were expected to be able to arm themselves for the common defence when needed at their own expense or to pay a fee to have it done for them. Often an exhorbanant fee.

The penalty for transgressions was often to be made an outlaw. Which it is worth remembering meant not that one broke the law, but that one had no protection under the law. That one's life could be taken without fear of retribution. In pre-industrial societies, that was often the easiest way to issue a death sentence.

Slappy

[Cdnwolf]

Another important commodity... salt...