Possible House Rule

[fightingflamingo]

because the forum keeps returning to chemical weapons I noticed that the rules (both v1 & v2) don't address the effects of using a personal decontamination kite adequately, so I'm thinking of the following as a house rule, comments are welcome.

any pc or npc whom uses a personal decontamination kit will suffer a permanent loss of 5 points of charisma.



thoughts...

[Targan]

Originally Posted by fightingflamingo

any pc or npc whom uses a personal decontamination kit will suffer a permanent loss of 5 points of charisma.

Why?

[fightingflamingo]

the decon kits, issued at least by the US during the early to mid 1990's were like baby wipes, impregnated with an acid which burned the agent off of skin, and caused significant scaring. they came as two numbered wipes. #1 was an acid, which could cause scaring, #2 was a neutralizer for the acid.

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by fightingflamingo

the decon kits, issued at least by the US during the early to mid 1990's were like baby wipes, impregnated with an acid which burned the agent off of skin, and caused significant scaring. they came as two numbered wipes. #1 was an acid, which could cause scaring, #2 was a neutralizer for the acid.

That's kind of like the autoinjectors for nerve gas -- the first was 2PAM Chloride (whatever that is), the second was an adrenaline/epinephrine mix to counteract the 2PAM Chloride.

[jester]

WRONG!!!!!!

The vials 1 and 2 from the decon kits were kinda like BLEACH! And we were issued baggies of concentrated dry bleach by our NBC officer as a suppliment to our decon kits.

Paul,

We had a total of 4 or 5 auto injectors,

3 atropiene which is a poison sure which will flood the system and counteract most poisons. The TUPAMCHLORIDE is a form of VALIUM that is super concentrated. That was to counter the effect of the nerve agents which would cause severe convulsions. Remember, those were used to counter the nerve agents not the mustard or chlorine threat. And yes, atropiene is used in medicinal practice today as well, often to counter poisoning. Another thing it does is help you to flush the system. I actualy used to know the whole bio process of how it worked but today I failed that roll

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Keeping in mind that I didn't actually play the game and I was more interested in the history and survival in the post-apocalypse aspects than the rules themselves, I think a minus 5 to Charisma is too harsh.
You only have 10 points for those stats, a bit of acid scarring isn't going to be so dramatic compared to the widespread disease problems, scarring from combat injuries, radiation sickness, people wearing the same clothes without washing & bathing for months on end and so on. I would think a minus 2 would be harsh enough.

If the material used is bleach rather than acid, you might stand out from the crowd for actually being clean

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by jester

WRONG!!!!!!

The vials 1 and 2 from the decon kits were kinda like BLEACH! And we were issued baggies of concentrated dry bleach by our NBC officer as a suppliment to our decon kits.

Paul,

We had a total of 4 or 5 auto injectors,

3 atropiene which is a poison sure which will flood the system and counteract most poisons. The TUPAMCHLORIDE is a form of VALIUM that is super concentrated. That was to counter the effect of the nerve agents which would cause severe convulsions. Remember, those were used to counter the nerve agents not the mustard or chlorine threat. And yes, atropiene is used in medicinal practice today as well, often to counter poisoning. Another thing it does is help you to flush the system. I actualy used to know the whole bio process of how it worked but today I failed that roll

So after a poison gas attack, you're wandering around the battlefield both stoned and hyped up...

2PAM Chloride wouldn't be good for me, with your answer -- I'm violently allergic to Valium. I'd throw everything in my stomach up, then go into dry heaves, then begin to bring up blood as the lining of my esophagus and stomach start to shed little by little. One of those things you learn when you're a psych ward patient and they try to calm you down quickly.

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by StainlessSteelCynic

Keeping in mind that I didn't actually play the game and I was more interested in the history and survival in the post-apocalypse aspects than the rules themselves, I think a minus 5 to Charisma is too harsh.

I've always had a problem with altering Charisma vs. looks, probably because I've always felt that looks and attractiveness are two different things. Lots of people are good looking -- much fewer are attractive. I'm sure you all have been set up with that blind date with a girl who is model-beautiful, but five minutes after you met her, are fighting an instinct to strangle her, because of her personality? That's a good example of someone who is very good-looking but also quite unattractive.

Attractiveness would not be affected nearly as much as looks by an acid burn.

Abraham Lincoln is a good example of this -- most women of the day thought he was ugly. They also though he was very attractive.

[jester]

Originally Posted by pmulcahy11b

So after a poison gas attack, you're wandering around the battlefield both stoned and hyped up...

2PAM Chloride wouldn't be good for me, with your answer -- I'm violently allergic to Valium. I'd throw everything in my stomach up, then go into dry heaves, then begin to bring up blood as the lining of my esophagus and stomach start to shed little by little. One of those things you learn when you're a psych ward patient and they try to calm you down quickly.

Basicaly Paul, you are expendable if you are allergic.

The super valium is to keep you from convulsing so much where you bite your tongue off and your bones break from the muscles convulsing and such. And so you do not bother the medics who are treating people who can be saved. The tupamchloride is so strong you just lay there and do piss and shit yourself. And let the atropine do its job if it does work. Because that is basicaly all they can do. After that, time will tell and you either live or die.

However, I think I may have a PC in the near future who has been hit with nerve agent and survived become imune to it. But, he does come down with a tick or twitch

[pmulcahy11b]

Originally Posted by jester

The super valium is to keep you from convulsing so much where you bite your tongue off and your bones break from the muscles convulsing and such. And so you do not bother the medics who are treating people who can be saved. The tupamchloride is so strong you just lay there and do piss and shit yourself. And let the atropine do its job if it does work. Because that is basicaly all they can do. After that, time will tell and you either live or die.

That's what they basically told us in Basic -- if you have to use the autoinjectors, it's too late anyway.

[Targan]

Originally Posted by jester

I actualy used to know the whole bio process of how it worked but today I failed that roll

Don't worry, there's still Wikipedia.

[Targan]

Originally Posted by jester

However, I think I may have a PC in the near future who has been hit with nerve agent and survived become imune to it. But, he does come down with a tick or twitch

I doubt that is possible. It might be posible with some toxins, but not nerve agent.

[jester]

Hey he could be a mutant, or he only got a minor dose, or he took those Nap anti nerve agent pills and he got his atropine intime so now he just has a wicked cool twistch that everyone thinks he is just phsyco like me

[Fusilier]

I think 5 permanent is too much. Besides there's more plenty more types of decon substances out there besides the American stuff that's talked about here... types that leave your face as it was (no scarring, burns, or whatever other hideous side effects mentioned).

I also tend not to use CHR as how good you look. To me its your ability to inspire, threaten, and communicate effectively under different scenarios and conditions. Looks don't really come into use for me on this.

[Legbreaker]

Charisma to me is more about force of personality, comfort in front of a crowd and the ability to "sell" yourself and your point of veiw.

Looks is purely superficial and while good looks may make the job a little easier in the first moments of contact, the moment the mouth opens....

[Targan]

In the system I use "charisma" and attractiveness of appearance are two very different things, determined by the attributes of Aura and Comeliness respectively. Command Initiative also plays a role in battlefield charisma/leadership.

[StainlessSteelCynic]

A friend who was running a Merc: 2000 campaign used Charisma for personality/interpersonal skills and he stole the Attractiveness attribute from I think it was Cyberpunk to use for how good looking a character was.