Request for Help in Outfitting Some Antagonists

[AcesandEights]

***EDIT: Title of thread should read: Antagonists...not protagonists, sorry***

Hey all.

I thought this might be a fun exercise for some of you and helpful for me.

I was wondering if some of you who are the type that are fond of gear and weaponry might give me a bit of advice about what military grade equipment and weapons a highly funded group of paramilitary-types might bring with them on a mission that will take place at the high point in a one-shot I'm going to be running for some friends next month.

To avoid spoilers, as a point of interest for those who care and for the sake of clarification, the adventure being run is 'Dead Letter' from Delta Green: Countdown sourcebook.

Now, the group in question is going to be, iirc, a 5 man squad who will be flown by a Bell Jet Ranger helicopter into a highly isolated chemical manufacturing facility, which is located on a pretty remote strip of land on an Indian reservation in, I believe Montana. They will arrive dressed as businessmen and will bully their way into the director of the facility's office with credentials as internal auditors from the parent company who are looking into the botched handling of a project. During this time period, one or two men will probably stay with the helicopter, two will do an ad hoc 'tour' of the facility (being sure to head over to the main security office to get a feel for the place) and the other two plus the baddie leader, will head to the Director's office to try and ascertain how badly he and his staff have botched their respective jobs and how much of the project has been exposed and what holes (or people) need to be plugged.

Now, after a short interview and part way through a tour of the facility with the director, the Baddie Leader will give the word to have the Director 'taken', at which point, his two associates will detain the director. This will happen down in the facility's incinerator room, so no one will hear the Director's screams as he is, for a lack of a better word, interrogated. Once the Baddie Leader learns the extent of possible exposure he will communicate with his higher up, ostensibly by encrypted cell phone. He will give a short numerical coded message to his higher up (a page-sentence-word cipher) and receive a short coded instruction back ("Sanitize").

Now, the Badies will withdraw somewhat and regroup, they will bring their heavy trunks of equipment off the helicopter, head to one of the offices they had earlier commandeered and suit up in their blacked out commando-style gear. What will they be armed with, carrying for gear and wearing?

Hopefully the PCs will intervene at some point, getting a frantic call from a person on the inside at the facility or because they have the place under direct surveillance.

Things that must be represented in the equipment manifest of the baddies:

-Considerable demolition charges and triggering devices/fuses
-Electric Bone Saw (don't ask)
-Minor chemical and bio hazard precautions (no 'space suits')
-Dry ice for keeping bio samples cool
-Some sort of grenades
-Sound suppressed automatic weapons that work well in commando-style operations
-side arms
-Perhaps one or more long arms
-Reasonable amount of ammunition
-combat knives
-Some sort of radio gear
-Some sort of Nightvision gear?
-Basic First Aid
What am I missing?

I was thinking they'd probably go with HKs (MP5s), but didn't want to be presumptuous. I figure the load out needs to be able to be choppered in with 5 guys and easily contained in a few cargo lockers.

A bit of background on our baddies:

*They are classic Boys From Brazil, with one of them being actually born in Germany.

*They have impeccable training and most will have killed before and seen some combat, while one of them (the group leader) has years (and years) of actual wartime & combat experience.

*I am assuming top of the line equipment

*Quiet is best, but they will certainly take a louder approach if they feel it's necessary

*They don't expect a run-in with the military or military-types, though with their mission and what they're already carrying, a heated run-in with police heavies wouldn't be ruled out as a possibility.

*The leader of the squad is merciless, evil, actually bent to the power of the Mythos, yet intelligent and audacious in his planning. He can be low-key when necessary, but understands that expedience and the nature of a possible 'clean up' (ie. destruction) of a facility is, by nature, going to be a loud operation, best handled quickly and efficiently...just as soon as they have gotten all their answers from some of the leaks.

[Raellus]

Maybe instead of the tried and true (one could argue passe') MP-5, they could be equipped with silenced, 5.7mm FN P90s. Low recoil, high rate of fire, powerful round, and 50-round mags (top-mounted). Pretty hip. For sidearms, they could carry FN Five-seveN pistols (uses the same 5.7mm round).

Maybe an HK G-36 with an underbarrel HK AG36 grenade launcher, just in case the local SWAT team shows up to the dance. That or one of the Para versions of the Minimi/M249. With either, your baddies should be able to hold off the fuzz for some time.

[Targan]

Originally Posted by Raellus

Maybe instead of the tried and true (one could argue passe') MP-5, they could be equipped with silenced, 5.7mm FN P90s. Low recoil, high rate of fire, powerful round, and 50-round mags (top-mounted). Pretty hip. For sidearms, they could carry FN Five-seveN pistols (uses the same 5.7mm round).

The problem with this concept is that to be effectively silenced the rounds fired need to be travelling below the speed of sound. As a general rule if a small calibre round is to be powerful it needs to have a very high velocity. This is why it is much better to use a silenced .45 ACP weapon than a silenced 9mmP weapon (because if you reduce the velocity of 9mmP to below the speed of sound it becomes quite pathetic in terms of penetration and damage potential whereas .45 ACP usually sits near the speed of sound to start with). "Silenced" 5.7mm would be about as effective as .22 short or .32 cal, as in not particularly fearsome at all.

I would go with silenced HK UMPs (they are chambered for .45 ACP) for their SMGs and HK USP Tacticals (also chambered for .45 ACP) with silencers on hand but not necessarilly attached. I agree with Raellus on the suggestion of the HK G36 (I'd go with the shorter barelled G36K myself) with an AG36 GL attached. Here are links to short videos of the afore mentioned weapons at the HK Pro website:
HK UMP = http://www.hkpro.com/video/UMP.mov
HK USP Tactical = http://www.hkpro.com/video/USP45%20Tactical.mov
HK G36 = http://www.hkpro.com/video/G36.mov

[LAW0306]

In the past I worked with the P90. Most of the operators hated it due to the underpowered round. It just did not have any punch after 50 meters due to the weight of the round. The Mp5 now; I used it all with a couple of different rounds. A 90GR franagble a 115GR FMJ and a 147gr Hollow Point. I used to stack them. With the three rounds I used to be able to control the full auto with any round burst. when you fire 10 to 20K rounds a year you get good with it. The three rounds would mess stuff up. when we converted in 00' to the M4 CQBW it was a god send . now I can fire close with no recoil but I also can ping shit at 300m with my eotech sight. I used it for 3 to 5 years and its my Favorate in service long gun. So from my side in being with the big three Govt agencys and the DOD. They all want the M4 CQBW and. The big myth of the M16 Familys failing in combat is just that a myth. out of the hundreds of thousands of rounds fired in combat and the after actions most of the fails come down to dirty mags and not seating the Mag when reloading. More or less i hurried to fast and did not do it right so I will blame the gun. I have been in combat Multiple times and I have never had a problem. Now my favorate Pact weapon is the RPK-74. what a dream to shot. no recoil at all. I can hold it one handed and hit stuff out to 100m on full auto. now I'm 6 foot 5 and weight in at 230 pounds but I have smaller friends and they can do the same thing. the weapon is just balanced so well. last year we fired a pair for 20k rounds and not one fail. out to about 800m I held a 2 mil beaten zone. I wish we would shit can our saw's and then use them. I love the RPK and would seek it out in combat.

These are just my opinions.
have a good newyear and stay safe.

[weswood]

How about a couple smallish suppressed pistols for the team that enters the building? Something like a .22 or .380, easily concealable in a suit coat, enough of a threat to take over the manager of the place until re-enforcments with heavier weapons arrive.

Commo equipment could consist of the older Delta model ASIP Prick 1523 SINCGARS...ECHO and FOXTROT being the current use, so harder to come by...however, proper generator and vehicle power mounts and wiring would be required...as well as recharging systems for the man portable batteries if one time use batteries are not had.

Motorola also makes a shit ton of different Land Mobile Radio and Air Mobile Radio systems that are easier had as many law enforcement and first responders will be using them all across the country.

I would say your best bet is to search around the net for a good radio system from Motorola. Uniforms could be sand colored BDUs(solid sand color, no camo), or a light brown variant...depending on the area, whether wooded, or desert/low foliage, BDUs, or DCUs bought NOS(new, old stock) surplus could be had(Fort Gordon, "Disgusta," GA was giving out BDUs for FREE to anyone who would pick them up on Thursdays at Clothing Sales/Services when I was there for AIT in '07)

In theory, these guys could be outfitted to the 9's, using one generation back hand me downs from the USDoD considering they most likely have the resources, and channels to do it.

[Marc]

Well, this adventures with full availability of high-tech materials are not my strong point, but I have enough experience dealing with my players and their "material that the GM would graciously try to put in the hands of his players" list. So, I think that a borescope would be a piece of equipment the players would appreciate. Who knows what's waiting at the other side of the door?

[jester]

If its being all stealthy, then I have an idea of the mission already with some of the items in the kit.

Sidearm, a Modified GLOCK 21, with a slector switch and a flip down forward grip on the slide rail <akin to the Beretta M93> With a few standfard 12 round mags and a few 30 rounders should they need the full auto option.

<Glocks are EASILY modified to full auto>

Further Glock mods, extended threaded barrel with removable silencer and tritium night sights, or even a lazer sight.

A Russian Balistic Knife with Kurari covered blade for silent work

Tazer so you have distance non lethal weapons should you need someone alive for retinal or dermal or face recognition software security features.

[Marc]

Originally Posted by jester

Tazer so you have distance non lethal weapons should you need someone alive for retinal or dermal or face recognition software security features.

Nice detail, Jester.

[jester]

I actualy hit the send button before I was done typing, I would also suggest tracer rounds to reduce the chances of leaving a blood pool or trail if its inside and the security personel have a rover patroling inside or checking on static personel.

Zip ties, to tie the personel in place should cameras be on site. Otherwise say someone in the camera room sees Joe missing for an extended period of time, or sees a body on the floor. But if he is tied to his chair in a semi normal position well he should pass glance.

Another thing, make sure the weapons are generic. Thus the glock.

Other ideas,

The UMO-40 or 45 as was suggested, or the the Mac 10 if concealment is required.

And if the infilrtration goes tits up and all bets are off then the personel or designated personel take over with breaching charges, so they should have a good number of those, enough to do the job plus about 25% more per team. Toss in a Beneli M2 with breacher rounds as well to open doors as well as the firepower it provides.

Tear gas grenades and smoke grenades, to keep reaction forces buttoned op and at bay, as well as to cover the escape. 1 or 2 frags per man also can be carried to deal with reaction forces if needbe, this would depend on the target and assets they have for defence.

A decent representation of M4s would be good as well to give the teams some kind of firepower again should their stealth insertion go bad, at least 1 per 4 men.

A vehicle and two members at a predetermined rally point, with 1 support weapon, a SAW would be good, a Grenade Launcher or even a semi auto battle rifle to lay down support fire. And toss in some claymore to cover the exit for good measure if you want to get really creative.

The escape vehicle is expendable and will be dumped a fairly shprt distance and the team members will split up and rally at another location that is predetermined.

I would also suggest something as a distraction such as an inturuption to the facilities power, a staged car accident out front, a preregistered mortar etc on the compound or something to hit the compound and keep them off balance at a crucial moment.